[quote="Trojan Horse":19k5rx8c]Maybe we are seeing different things but his management of the defensive line last season was extremely good. If you watch games back he’s constantly shepherding players where they need to be whilst placing himself in good positions in defence and attack. He’s already better in this area than the current England full back. Perhaps he will have to show this at SL level if that is what you meant about developing further. I genuinely believe if you stuck Max in Wellsby’s shoes he would be running saints in for many more try’s and perform better than Wellsby overall. Now he has a team that’s on the upwards trajectory for having quality and determination around him, hopefully he can do it with us next few seasons.[/quote:19k5rx8c] I actually said he'd developed this part of his game. I also said his attack is as good if not better than anyone. So to use your oft used phrase, maybe you should go back and reread my post. Saying that, my point is, improving your line management in the championship is great, but it isn't SL. I'm sure he will develop further under Powell but I see this as an area he has to show his improvement this year. For England, he doesn't really have a lot of competition as most teams have an overseas full back. Welsby, Evalds, Hardaker at a push and Eckersley at Wigan as an outsider.

[quote="alegend":qdqfgzme]Stayed at the club when he was getting dropped for one mistake in a match .Yet the player who took is position could do as he liked .Max should have left the then ,but took it on the chin and got on with it Will be a strange call to move on now as hopefully the club as turned the corner.[/quote:qdqfgzme] Hi Butcher , with all due respect , and I aren't a Cas fan with any axe to grind , I don't think he is second in line for England . If Welsby wasn't available then I think Evalds is clear second in line for the role and a much better all round FB than Max at the moment . That said , England 2026 WC team may be a possibility , as Evalds will be 32 and , if Max continues to improve in the meantime , he would appear to be the obvious choice as understudy to Welsby , Sorry 'alegend', clicked the wrong post to reply to by mistake , hence the 'Hi Butcher' start to the message

For sure, that’s exactly what I meant really, that opposition supporters (welcome!) would consider Evalds or even Brierley in front of him, but Wakey fans know he’s a better player than either of them. However, he needs a brilliant season or two in SL to prove that to kick on and get in the England squad.

[quote="Butcher":2zwmne9e]For sure, that’s exactly what I meant really, that opposition supporters (welcome!) would consider Evalds or even Brierley in front of him, but Wakey fans know he’s a better player than either of them. However, he needs a brilliant season or two in SL to prove that to kick on and get in the England squad.[/quote:2zwmne9e] Again with respect , and that may be the case in a year or two , but I'm not sure many (other than Wakey fans) would consider him better than Niall at the moment. Yes , he's looked good this season , but there is a massive gulf in quality between SL and Championship rugby. Niall is proven at SL level and has been for some time now. I think Max has the ability to be a top class FB in time , he's just not there yet and needs regular SL experience to further improve and reach his full potential , something I am sure he will do in the future.

[quote="Another Cas Fan":9xtwey70]Again with respect , and that may be the case in a year or two , but I'm not sure many (other than Wakey fans) would consider him better than Niall at the moment. Yes , he's looked good this season , but there is a massive gulf in quality between SL and Championship rugby. Niall is proven at SL level and has been for some time now. I think Max has the ability to be a top class FB in time , he's just not there yet and needs regular SL experience to further improve and reach his full potential , something I am sure he will do in the future.[/quote:9xtwey70] One thing we never really struggled with in SL was full back. Max has always been fine at SL level. You’ll be very hard pressed to find any Trinty fan who see Max week in week out even consider a swap for Evalds or Brierly. That’s more to the point that Butcher was making. Other fans don’t see him week in and week out like we do. He’s already SL standard but to reach England level he just needs to tidy up a couple of areas. He’s not far away at all looking at the lack of English fullbacks in SL. There are certain parts to Jowitts game that would improve Evalds and vice versa at this time but hopefully Max can start to really shine this next few years and show the rest of SL what a lot of trinity fans believe he’s capable of.

[quote="Another Cas Fan":1v518wgu]Again with respect , and that may be the case in a year or two , but I'm not sure many (other than Wakey fans) would consider him better than Niall at the moment. Yes , he's looked good this season , but there is a massive gulf in quality between SL and Championship rugby. Niall is proven at SL level and has been for some time now. I think Max has the ability to be a top class FB in time , he's just not there yet and needs regular SL experience to further improve and reach his full potential , something I am sure he will do in the future.[/quote:1v518wgu] You may be right.......we'll find out soon enough. My money is on Max though.

[quote="PopTart":wqyll82n]I actually said he'd developed this part of his game. I also said his attack is as good if not better than anyone. So to use your oft used phrase, maybe you should go back and reread my post. Saying that, my point is, improving your line management in the championship is great, but it isn't SL. I'm sure he will develop further under Powell but I see this as an area he has to show his improvement this year. For England, he doesn't really have a lot of competition as most teams have an overseas full back. Welsby, Evalds, Hardaker at a push and Eckersley at Wigan as an outsider.[/quote:wqyll82n] Fair enough, ultimately how Max gets percieved will come down a lot to how the team performs as a whole. If we have a solid season and can get on the front foot enough to show some attacking plays and his skills then it will only help his cause. England full backs as you say are a rarity anyway so that only improves his chances. Sometimes luck or lack of it can play a part in players getting caps.

[quote="Another Cas Fan":h4jk6opj]Again with respect , and that may be the case in a year or two , but I'm not sure many (other than Wakey fans) would consider him better than Niall at the moment. Yes , he's looked good this season , but there is a massive gulf in quality between SL and Championship rugby. Niall is proven at SL level and has been for some time now. I think Max has the ability to be a top class FB in time , he's just not there yet and needs regular SL experience to further improve and reach his full potential , something I am sure he will do in the future.[/quote:h4jk6opj] Absolutely, your first point here is exactly the point I was making. Only Wakey fans think/know he’s a better all round full back than Evalds or Brierley, opposition fans don’t, which is why he needs a great couple of seasons to prove it. Where we disagree is that while Niall Evalds is a good player - great positioning and plenty of speed - he’s not as safe, skilful or creative as Jowitt. Of course we’ve been here all season saying and thinking ‘well Super League’s a different level’, but experience (Super 8s, Challenge Cup etc) shows you that the gap’s not that big between the full time Champ teams and the lower table SL teams, and the players that make them. We won 38 out of 40 games. I honestly don’t think Cas, Huddersfield, Hull or London’s squads would have done that. And Jowitt was our best player, and the league’s best player. Now he’s off to skin James Tedesco in the Ashes

[quote="Butcher":488fmvu6]Absolutely, your first point here is exactly the point I was making. Only Wakey fans think/know he’s a better all round full back than Evalds or Brierley, opposition fans don’t, which is why he needs a great couple of seasons to prove it. Where we disagree is that while Niall Evalds is a good player - great positioning and plenty of speed - he’s not as safe, skilful or creative as Jowitt. Of course we’ve been here all season saying and thinking ‘well Super League’s a different level’, but experience (Super 8s, Challenge Cup etc) shows you that the gap’s not that big between the full time Champ teams and the lower table SL teams, and the players that make them. We won 38 out of 40 games. I honestly don’t think Cas, Huddersfield, Hull or London’s squads would have done that. And Jowitt was our best player, and the league’s best player. Now he’s off to skin James Tedesco in the Ashes [/quote:488fmvu6] James Tedesco who? not fit to bring Max’s kicking tee out surely

I have confidence Max will stay. Whether he plays for England does not bother me as long as he keeps doing the business for us. IMO if Max maintains his progress with his defence, I wouldn't swap him for another fb in the game let alone SL. In response to previous comments Max was doing the business in SL years ago! AND he isn't a bad stand off!

All the postings have good points, but think on, max can afford not to sign & play out this season knowing he is on a free transfer @ the end of season, equally we as a club would have some thinking to do ? Maybe max is waiting to see if the RFL, grant him a benefit season this year ? This could be something he is waiting for ?

[quote="Start@1873":3usmkwll]All the postings have good points, but think on, max can afford not to sign & play out this season knowing he is on a free transfer @ the end of season, equally we as a club would have some thinking to do ? Maybe max is waiting to see if the RFL, grant him a benefit season this year ? This could be something he is waiting for ?[/quote:3usmkwll] As a doom monger, I'm not sure this is the one to cling to.

[quote="Start@1873":6mldaqn5]All the postings have good points, but think on, max can afford not to sign & play out this season knowing he is on a free transfer @ the end of season, equally we as a club would have some thinking to do ? Maybe max is waiting to see if the RFL, grant him a benefit season this year ? This could be something he is waiting for ?[/quote:6mldaqn5] He could...but I don't think Matt Ellis will play that game. If a player doesn't want to invest into his vision for the future, Ellis won't wait around wondering - he'll buy a replacement and move on.

Fair point. It's up to Max too on this. It's not just for us to pay no matter what. ......but personally I think he's worth a lot to us.

[quote="PopTart":icsxw8ze]Fair point. It's up to Max too on this. It's not just for us to pay no matter what. ......but personally I think he's worth a lot to us.[/quote:icsxw8ze] Yes, I agree. He can agree his worth with the club, or he can see what is on offer elsewhere. The new rules mean he can do that right now, no waiting, no messing. The club won't wait for ever though - if he plays a waiting game, I don't think Ellis will do the same.

its the first week in January... negotiations take time... whether to leave or stay in 2026... that takes time... however: - I see no speculation on possible suitors in the RL press - all the signings and retentions have been announced at a time that is strategically beneficial to the club - Currently MAX is an icon at the club... his performances in '25 with either enhance or break that status. - his most recent form has been as a standout player at championship level I kind of like that we don't have to be scared of players leaving or staying for money any more... if its right for both parties he will be a Trinity player in '26 and beyond... if it's not right for both parties then he won't.

Nothing to do with being a doom monger, just stating - discussing the current points, personally I am a big fan of max & I do hope we sign him on a 4 year deal in line with our team building. I also think that our full back line would be very potent with him. Up the trin.

Spook / Start, you are both correct. Plus for all we know, the deal may already be signed. What will be will be.

@Trojan Horse, @Pop Tart and @Butcher Will reply as one I think all of your comments are fair enough . I have no axe to grind and agree that he is a good player who can still improve . I also take note of your comments being different to other clubs who haven't seen him play week in and week out , and again you are absolutely right . With little or no coverage of the lower leagues , we weren't able to see his performances on a week by week basis . The one thing I feel that I have to mention is his outstanding effort to reach 500 season points and break the record . A fantastic achievement even at a lower level . The fact that he is even being mentioned as a possible England Full Back is testament to the progress he has already made, although at 27 it could be argued that it is difficult to measure at exactly what level he should be at now . I still have my own doubts about him being ahead of Evalds (in particular) and also Brierley , but that's just my opinion to be fair , we're not all going to agree . Perhaps I was being unkind to say that he hasn't yet reached SL standard , on the basis that you spent a season in the Championship and prior to that were at the lower end of the table during Max's earlier time in SL. I think we can all agree that it is going to be interesting to see how he goes this season and I wish him all the best (except for the 3 games against Cas of course.Hope he has a few off days against us haha)

Max was outstanding in 2024, has persevered when the likes of walker Hampshire et al were picked in front of him. However if he’s second in line as gb full back think it says more about the dearth of quality in British game. Championship player of the year is nice but both max and the other former championship player of year walmsley have a lot to prove at sl level. Realistically think we are the team most likely to give him a good deal, personally think talk of other clubs is just that - talk! Am sure he’ll be announced before long along with atoni

[quote="Kirmudgeonlyisback":2cw7eb0h]Max was outstanding in 2024, has persevered when the likes of walker Hampshire et al were picked in front of him. However if he’s second in line as gb full back think it says more about the dearth of quality in British game. Championship player of the year is nice but both max and the other former championship player of year walmsley have a lot to prove at sl level. Realistically think we are the team most likely to give him a good deal, personally think talk of other clubs is just that - talk! Am sure he’ll be announced before long along with atoni[/quote:2cw7eb0h] I like Atoni but he’s got much more to prove at SL level than Max who’s played 100 or so games in the comp and is known SL standard already. I like Atoni and he’s improved but I’ll be interested to see how him and Bain go at SL level.

[quote="Trojan Horse":3kpy6cyh]I like Atoni but he’s got much more to prove at SL level than Max who’s played 100 or so games in the comp and is known SL standard already. I like Atoni and he’s improved but I’ll be interested to see how him and Bain go at SL level.[/quote:3kpy6cyh] For me Atoni is there. He's played in SL and when he settled he really rocked defenses. And I think has got fitter. Bain is a question mark. We'll just have to see. He's had a slow start with injury but could be good for us.

[quote="PopTart":d2f7e3ii]For me Atoni is there. He's played in SL and when he settled he really rocked defenses. And I think has got fitter. Bain is a question mark. We'll just have to see. He's had a slow start with injury but could be good for us.[/quote:d2f7e3ii] I agree but I think he only actually got there for 1/3 of the season at the back end. He can do it but I want to see if he can do it consistently over a season. He’s capable. Bain is a question mark. I can see him playing more interchange 13.

[quote="Trojan Horse":1z7p017p]I agree but I think he only actually got there for 1/3 of the season at the back end. He can do it but I want to see if he can do it consistently over a season. He’s capable. Bain is a question mark. I can see him playing more interchange 13.[/quote:1z7p017p] I agree on Bain at 13 but he's got Pitts, Cozza and any of the middles when Powell plays them their. He's got a tough job to impress.

[quote="PopTart":3pe1xcrr]I agree on Bain at 13 but he's got Pitts, Cozza and any of the middles when Powell plays them their. He's got a tough job to impress.[/quote:3pe1xcrr] He does, it’s hard to see past Pitts for starting 13. Seems to be aging like a fine wine and looks fitter and stronger. There’s certainly healthy competition for interchange 13 like you say. Could be a handful fighting for it. Will make for a good competitive training attitude hopefully.