666
You must be joking!!!!!!!!!!
How many liquidations of the Cougars has he been through?

(((One with Colin and they were asked to do it, ask the right people and you will find this is true. He wasn’t a board member prior to Colin and himself saving the club when nobody else would)))

spymaster
Stealth makes very good points on this and worth reading, in particular the point that despite his cronies Neil took out of club via freebies to various groups but to my recollection was the security set up who were basically thugs and were aggressive to home fans who were stalwarts of the club for no other reason than fact they were bullies.

(((I am not a thug I have never stolen or treated anyone viciously, I am not a bully and you know nobody I have ever bullied and when I ran match days I dealt with all problems fairly.)))

Stealth comic
This guy should never been given a life membership, his picture in the hall of fame should have been torn down and burnt in the middle of the pitch. It downright pi55es me off every time I see his face at Cougar Park.

(((Then should you go on to riot and steal, after burning an effigy, what kind of person are you?)))

I would like to think that our board of directors are of sound enough mind and judgment as to not even consider him for such an esteemed position. In my opinion it would be counter-productive to all their hard work and progress they have made in building bridges with the fans in the last 18 months or so to bring back the guy who almost destroyed our club.

(((Ask them if he almost destroyed the club)))

Spymaster
Let's bring some other facts to the table then, not just the carefully selected ones that you have posted in order to construct your contribution to this debate.
Neil Spencer presided over the club when it went in to administration on more than one occasion.

(((As above wrong so not a fact)))

Loyalfan08
Paying his family a fortune and bringing loads of them for free meals etc so he has got something out of it as well.

(((I was paid £60 a win when I played for the A team, I worked match days for most seasons for free but in the end I took £30 a match which was spent on the day over the bar or to entertain my son. I have had a few meals at least half of which I paid for myself by booking a full table. I have put sponsorship in this season and overall it is cost me way more than I have ever got out, no fortune here.)))
(((I am not defending Neil, he is my father and he doesn’t need defending to lying nasty people who are seriously ill informed he knows his own self worth and so do those who truly know him. I am calling you libelous people for claiming things about me that are not true and cannot be proved for that very reason. Locking a thread means you are allowing people to read these lies and not be able to reply, delete the thread or opening the debate back up.)))
Ian Spencer

I commented on information i was told that's all. And if not true i apologise but there must be some reason why our club hasn't been run properly and where has money gone from the past. There will be no proof on any comments made by people or comments made to defend people

Define run properly you speculate on income and get the best squad you can and if that income falls short you dont have enough money. At any level you sign the team and agree the payment terms at the beginning of the season having had no income then you hope the income covers it, it never does so then you hope you have enough benifactors who will make up the short fall usually the board of directors but often others help. I will give you any proof you like you can see my bank account you can visit my business I can get Gary Moorby, Paul Moses, Keith Dixon and hundreds more to speak on my behalf I am more than prepared to be called to task on anything I say. Colin and Neil were 62 when they formed Cougars 2000 it was more than they really wanted to take on but rather than see it fold they did. At 72 they were finally relieved to hand it on.

Quote ="Fossil"666 (((Then should you go on to riot and steal, after burning an effigy, what kind of person are you?))) '" The kind of person who's clever enough to know that not every one who burns effigies goes out rioting and thieving. Take November the 5th for example. Comparing what I typed to the appalling scenes going on the UK at the moment, well done. companycheck.co.uk/company/04276267 Well run clubs aren't insolvent, which is what the negative net worth statistics here showed the club to had been for a fair few years, in fact 2006 aside, it shows that the level of insolvency was actually increasing to the point that the liabilites of the club were 3 times more than the club's assets.

Quote ="Fossil"666 (((Then should you go on to riot and steal, after burning an effigy, what kind of person are you?))) '" The kind of person who's clever enough to know that not every one who burns effigies goes out rioting and thieving. Take November the 5th for example. Comparing what I typed to the appalling scenes going on the UK at the moment, well done. companycheck.co.uk/company/04276267 Well run clubs aren't insolvent, which is what the negative net worth statistics here showed the club to had been for a fair few years, in fact 2006 aside, it shows that the level of insolvency was actually increasing to the point that the liabilites of the club were 3 times more than the club's assets.

Clever enough to know that burning effigies is a small step in that direction, yes Guy Fawkes is burnt as an Effigy but in fun these days not as a sign of being, your phrase, pi55ed off. One person considers something is bad so they do something worse then someone does something even more so, when is bad behaviour going too far? Plus it was designed to provoke a reaction I doubt you are a potential rioter but I dont know because I dont know who you are.

So what are you trying to prove that Colin and Neil should have jumped ship sooner, wait they didnt jump ship they stayed until a new crew came along.

(((I am not a thug I have never stolen or treated anyone viciously, I am not a bully and you know nobody I have ever bullied and when I ran match days I dealt with all problems fairly.)))

No one said you personally were involved but the FACT remains my nephew was threatened phsically by some of the men in black who were doing the security at the time.

Bearing in mind the crowds were fairly small at the time plus there was adequate stewards etc there was no need for the extras, at the most maybe one on door near bar would be deemed okay but the level was overkill, unneccessary.

With reference to the club under Neils stewardship albeit I accept it was not a one man show the club went belly up after club was screwed by rfl re super league and more recently after the grand final win against Oldham and the part that sticks in the throat of many cougar fans was the FACT Neil was telling anyone who would listen and I include the players and coaching staff all was well when clearly this was untrue to say the least.

In addition to this the directors of Cougars 2001 were deemed as failing the fit and proper person test and in itself tells a story. You cannot cherrypick parts to suit an argument.

It cannot be easy reading the criticisms as it involves family and therefore am unwilling to get into this any further as it would help no one and achieve anything useful.

Certainly not.

I'm saying that as guardians of the club they should have run the club in a manner that did not allow the club to accrue so much liabilty.

The liabilty came from signing a strong squad and failing to see sufficient return as I stated earlier, a weaker cheaper squad would have meant less liabilty MAYBE because who would have watched them. You have a 60 year lease thanks to Colin and Neil ask the Coop. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keighley_Cougars and check Wikipedia the previous folding was due to a real criminal. Maybe it was over kill but it was also half the price of the previous match day crew and I am sure there are invoices somewhere that can prove this. I am sorry about your nephew and if you had come to see me it would have been sorted, no one gets everything right but things can be made right.

The liabilty came from signing a strong squad and failing to see sufficient return as I stated earlier, a weaker cheaper squad would have meant less liabilty MAYBE because who would have watched them. You have a 60 year lease thanks to Colin and Neil ask the Coop. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keighley_Cougars and check Wikipedia the previous folding was due to a real criminal. Maybe it was over kill but it was also half the price of the previous match day crew and I am sure there are invoices somewhere that can prove this. I am sorry about your nephew and if you had come to see me it would have been sorted, no one gets everything right but things can be made right.

Oh and the current directors could have kept the club out of liquidation they chose not to, to be able to start from £0 FACT

Colin and Neil took it on the chin for the club my words not theirs

Is it a FACT though? It's my understanding that the club are still paying the past debt off until the end of this year.

Incidentally, if you are new to internet forums there are two things you should bear in mind: using capitals ie "FACT" is the equivalent of shouting in the real world, using the word FACT (in capitals) is used by angry people with a weak argument.



I didn't join the last squabble, family members are emotional and such things should not be aired on the internet.

Firstly, I believe that Neil is Keighley Cougars through and through, but in his own way. He would be a good member of a larger board but I don't think he has the skill sets to handle the role he had. His interaction with people left a lot to be desired, particularly the fans.



Why did we get insufficient return? Lack of fans and sponsors? If so why?

Nothing personal against Neil, but in my opinion he wasn't up to it.

Dreamer fair comment and he would agree him and Colin werent enough it needed more and it took 9 years for the more to come forward.

I know I shouted fact because it was anger because I am nobodys crony I am not a bully I am not a thug and I am not a fortune stealer and being called those things makes me angry and I am his only son and I was in charge of match days for a total of 9 or 10 years cant remember exactly. If my arguments is weak feel free to pick holes in it I stand by comments 100% on here or face to face with anyone.

The question is how angry, angry enough to put these replies and thats all, I get rid of my frustrations on the rugby pitch the bigger ones than this.

£0 isnt the fact that would be ridicolous sorry for misleading that was poetic license, the fact is that the liquidation was a choice for financial reasons.

As a matter of interest check this out as well Stealth companycheck.co.uk/company/05151071

As a matter of interest check this out as well Stealth companycheck.co.uk/company/05151071

Quote ="forwardpass1"As a matter of interest check this out as well Stealth companycheck.co.uk/company/05151071'" It doesn't make for good reading does it? It was brought up around the time he took over the club as regards Link Telecom's troubles. IIRC Link Telecom got involved in a dispute with one of the major mobile network as regards a large contract to supply mobiles to teachers.

Quote ="forwardpass1"As a matter of interest check this out as well Stealth companycheck.co.uk/company/05151071'" It doesn't make for good reading does it? It was brought up around the time he took over the club as regards Link Telecom's troubles. IIRC Link Telecom got involved in a dispute with one of the major mobile network as regards a large contract to supply mobiles to teachers.

Everyone has their opinions and views - I really dont see why this post needs to be filled. If it is a non active post then lets do without it please. Really not sure what good it would be to the club, unless the rest of the directors dont go to away matches??

I think it is sad that Neil's family feel the need to come on here and defend their mistakes. (Or Choices) Do Cougars Fans want to live in the past or look to the future.

I don't know anybody who guns for Neil more than Spymaster. Do you think publicly doing a supporter of the club down in public constantly does anything to help the club. Perhaps you should go see Neil and discuss it face to face.

By the way Spymaster how many games have you been to this season?
Ahh none. How would your family have liked your mistakes over recent years discussed on here.

You are on Dodgy ground slinging mud at people and it is their families you upset also.

I think that this thread should be locked as it's going nowhere and 'Fossil' doesn't seem to be able to identify other 'posters' correctly.

I also think that Fossil needs to remember that Wikipedia states:



Which is what everyone believed. If Neil wasn't a member of the Board then why was he allowed to be the Cougars' representative on the RL Council? I only hope that my memory serves me right as he always appeared to be a 'Director'. There were others 'standing in the wings' when Colin and Neil took control of the Club but they had already registered the new name at Companies House/Registry and 'done the deal' before anyone else was able to take any action - A 'supporter's trust' would have been ideal at the time.

I would imagine most Cougar fans want to look to the future, however, sometimes you need to reflect on the mistakes of the past to ensure they don't happen again.

At times, Neil showed little respect for many of the fans and they reciprocated in kind.

For those reasons I do not think it is [i"forward thinking"[/i to put Neil in any position associated with the club, either official or honarary.

I couldn't agree more 'Dreamer'.

But, and this is a really [size=200BIG 'BUT'[/size why has everyone forgotten about the other 'Neil'?

Not Spencer but the one and only [size=200'MICK O'[/size. Mick was the real driving force behind the Cougars (apart from Mike [Smith) so why has everyone forgotten about the debt of gratitude that is owed to them and the only reason that they failed was Lindsay!

Say no more. Forget the Salvation Army proposing Neil Spencer. Without Mick O'Neil the Cougars would have been lost years ago.

So, can anyone answer the question:

If there has to be a 'Life President' then why not give the honour to someone who actually deserves it? [size=200MICK O'NEIL[/size

He was a member of the board until.



Sorry who have I miss identified I will correct it.

Vert Frank I am not defending my mistakes, I am denying the claims I am a crony,fortune hunter, bully and thug, I am not saying my father should have or wants the honour he is still enjoying his rugby I believe he would agree Mick O Neil is a good choice they are still friends but I started this to defend me not him.

Oh and Dreamer is 666 a really angry person with a seriously weak argument?

I dont think so but based on your statement I may be wrong as I dont have all the [size=85facts[/size.

If you are going to use my quote back at me at least don't add words for dramatic effect


I don't know "666", so I'm not sure if he (she) is an angry person. I can only assume that having watched what's happened to his (her) club over the last few years has made him (her) at least moderately miffed.


Are these fact, facts, poetic license facts, or facts that in fact aren't facts.



Can you answer the question that you ignored earlier?
You wrote:


I said:


I really don't want to get involved in a slanging match here. As I said earlier, members of Neils family are bound to get emotional when discussing such issues. Sometimes it needs an element of clinical detachment to see where the problem(s) lay. Neil believed in what he was doing, but in my opinion went about it the wrong way.

Dreamer you misunderstood it was humor. I used capitals, 666 used extra large bold capitals hence "really and seriously" merely expanding on your rhetoric. It seemed fair that you had a little fish on this minor point so I joined in.



Why did Cougars get insufficient return, big question and I can’t answer it and don’t want to I started this, once again to defend me and I apologise to my father for being drawn into defending him I should know better.

However could have just been too much for Neil and Colin, why they were so foolishly trying to manage it for people who wanted them out and after retirement age I do not know, I wouldn’t have done it.

Wait a minute love of the Keighley Cougars and rugby league.

Oh and let me ask a question 666, how many times was Neil Spencer a director of the club when it folded?

Just for fun explain this sentence to me. Are you saying you find I am a fool who has no experience on internet forums, or are you giving advice that with the strong argument I have I should not spoil it by putting words in capitals, or are you saying that I have a weak argument and the capitals prove this and you believe I was aware of the way capitals are taken but thought you would point it out to me anyway to try and make me look foolish, or are you just saying I am a angry person with a weak argument. I get the feeling the being helpful option is off the table so it must be one of the more lets be nasty for nasties sake options.