I think the position of 'loose forward' can be interesting, over recent years the position has seen a significant change with including a 60-80 min prop at 13, Gallen is the perfect example of this, teams can dominate others pitting 3 props up against 2, such players are a massive commodity hence the bidding war for Jason Taumalolo, takes some engine to play prop well for 60-80mins, valuable players.

Also seen Ryan Hinchcliffe at Storm, playing 13 but taking on a lot of the dummy half duties freeing up Cam Smith for spells of the game, this allows Smith to stay on for the full 80.

Other options are a tackling machine; think Dallas Johnson, a 13 isn't fixed to left or right like a SR, this type of 13 can work left and right sides tacking anything that moves.

This is why I rate Lockers so much, he has the handling skills of a 6, can run the ball like a prop and tackle all day long, basically do all of the three roles of a 13 which I've previously discussed. I believe this is why he's so missed, and why he's rated so highly in the game.

For me it's a case of sitting back and analysing what do we want: a) what to achieve in the game b) how can we do it.

For me it's back to basics, look at the way the game is played in the NRL, dominate error free pack, gain field position then put your structures into play. Win the arm wrestle though strong D and off the back of a strong kicking game. I believe with Wigan if we can play with 3 props on or McM at 13 we can be dominate and have options with 3 if not 4 (considering Hampshire as the 4th option) to win the wrestle and field position. Get our backs into their half and they will score, I'm confident of that.

Break teams down and watch the points rack up.

Burgess and Sutton will probably come back in at the expense of Manfredi and Greenwood I'd have thought.

I've not got an issue with pretty much the same group of players getting a chance to redeem themselves but one or two must be drinking in the last chance saloon.

What has happened to Logan Tomkins?

He played for Workington last week at London Broncos.

Gildart played for the Wigan team in the friendly up at Workington pre-season and didn't impress, in fact he looked a bit out of his depth at that level.

Cheers. How did he look?

Feel a bit for Logan tbh. I mentioned to a mate of mine tonight that he can probably put himself alongside Bateman as one of only two of our players who can say they've preformed consistently well when they've player this year.

Quote ="Rogues Gallery"As I suspected, same squad as last week. www.wiganwarriors.com/WContent.a ... &type=news'" You do have to the ask question? How helpful is that statement to a young squad... Quote I want to give the players a chance to get back in my good books'" Sounds like old school bullying tactics to me..

Quote ="Rogues Gallery"As I suspected, same squad as last week. www.wiganwarriors.com/WContent.a ... &type=news'" You do have to the ask question? How helpful is that statement to a young squad... Quote I want to give the players a chance to get back in my good books'" Sounds like old school bullying tactics to me..

As opposed to dropping them?

Well you could only drop them if you had replacements..I'm sure you agree.

Castlefords defeat at Huddersfield last night shows Wane has every right to have some players in his 'bad books'.

Last Friday night was unacceptable. We've been beaten fair and square plenty of times in the Maguire/Wane era and we were again last Friday but none other then that Cas game have ever been from a lack of effort.

Why? To me it sounds like a coach laying down the ground rules that the players have to perform to get in the "good books" and get back in the 1st team.

We've got the biggest squad in Super League. Plenty of replacements. I reckon Wane is spot on. Give them all a chance to put it right tonight. I think they will, and I can't wait. Really looking forward to this one.

Bateman dropped to the bench.
Larne Patrick starts at loose.

I actually think Wane is trolling us now.

I don't see why. Bateman (one of the few to come out of the season so far in credit) is surely 'rested', rather than dropped, and will surely have his part to play anyway.

Yes, Patrick has been disappointing so far, but he's a new signing. Are we meant to accept (already?) that he is not good enough to make the starting 13? Let's give him some more game time before we rush to judgement.

Well a win is a win, that's all you can say about that really.

Error and penalty count was much improved. Still zero creativity though - we should've scored plenty in the second half.

Mossop was quality.

And LOL at Hull's last play, wtf was Watts doing?

Creativity was always going to be a problem without Green,just need to try and grind out results until it clicks into place.

Well I have just got back and that was abysmal.

The passing was shocking. If Budgie got a pass to hand at the right height all night I'd be amazed. Behind him at knee or ankle height not where they should have been.

As to the decision making that was no better. I could not believe, yet again, we score a try and them immediately give the ball away by trying a stupid move in our own 20m area. How many more times are going to try and do this when there is no need?

We looked good for thee first 10 minutes but following that mistake we regularly either gave a penalty away or lost possession so we never got any momentum going. The 2nd half was terrible. Camped in the Hull half and could not score to save our lives.

If you want apositive it was Mossop. Thought he had a very good game and was a real handful for them. Smith got MoM and he looked better than of late (but still missed a conversion whereas Hull's kicker slotted one over from right on the touchline to get them within a point).

I wonder, as another poster did the other day, if Smith might not do better if relieved of the kicking responsibility. You might say, it shouldn't be necessary, he's a senior player, but, with the best will in the world, he can't be our long-term kicking answer. I'm sure he's practiced and he tried, but he isn't. He is a very good, if not brilliant half-back, and we need to get him back to doing what he does best.

I'd go with that if I thought it would add a spark to creativity to the attack because we have none at the moment.

I am not sure it would make a great deal of difference though because we seem to stick rigidly to one attacking move and while it may seem the half backs aren't creating much they seem to get rid of the ball all the time so we can move the ball wide time and again.

In previous games you could argue they had no platform but in the 2nd half v Hull we camped in their half and we scored 1 solitary point from a drop goal. I think I saw one, possibly two breaks from the halves all night but the rest of the time it was pass it wide, pass it wide.

Add to the fact the passing is poor so this doesn't work as the ball goes to ankle height or behind the player, so overall it's just rubbish.

I would say creativity from the team is missing as a whole..Lot of possession in that second half but the points went the other way.

The timing of our attack is way off with passes constantly missing the mark and that's hard to cope with when you play the style we do.

It always seems to be the case when Lockers is out that our organisation goes to pot. He seems to hold everything together and we need him back ASAP.

Clubb and Mossop played well in the front row, although they weren't really up against much.. Tomkins had some good runs in the first half. Smith played a little better individually but there still looked to be little organisation or structure to what we were trying to do.
Williams didn't look right at hooker. I don't know why he was moved from stand off because he was showing some good signs and offered a much needed direct style of play. Powell has gone okay but I can't help but think that Wane has gone back on his claim that he'd give Williams time.
Bowen still offers very little. When he joins the attacking line there's little threat and he messed up a try scoring opportunity with a poor pass and that's not the first time he's done that this year. Hampshire may well be worth another go despite his defensive weaknesses at fullback. He offers a greater threat in attack. Sarge is our best fullback but he's tied down at centre because we don't have adequate cover there.
The pack will hopefully improve as players regain fitness. A fully fit Tautai with Mossop and Clubb in good form isn't a bad front row, although it's not going to strike fear into teams. Bateman has done well. Tomkins has shown brief glimpses of what he can do but Farrell still disappoints. Perhaps he's struggling from the internationals at the end of last year.

It's probably not surprising that our attack is struggling. Green and O'Loughlin were the two big creative influences last season and we don't have either of them in the side. They were both huge influences and we haven't found players who are capably of providing what they did to the side.

Clubb had a blinder as did Mossop going off the stats. www.superleague.co.uk/report/11058 Larne Patrick's stats awful again. We may as well give Connor Farrell or Rhodri Lloyd a go. There's a decent prop/loose forward playing well for HKR who I'd rather have in the squad at present.

Clubb had a blinder as did Mossop going off the stats. www.superleague.co.uk/report/11058 Larne Patrick's stats awful again. We may as well give Connor Farrell or Rhodri Lloyd a go. There's a decent prop/loose forward playing well for HKR who I'd rather have in the squad at present.

Quote ="NickyKiss"Clubb had a blinder as did Mossop going off the stats. www.superleague.co.uk/report/11058 Larne Patrick's stats awful again. We may as well give Connor Farrell or Rhodri Lloyd a go. There's a decent prop/loose forward playing well for HKR who I'd rather have in the squad at present.'" Patrick is really disappointing. He just isn't up to it. His fitness is shocking - he was blowing for tugs after about 15 minutes and subbed off with our starting props after 20. Lockers breezes through 80 minutes at Loose and Bateman was getting through double the amount of work than the what Patrick did last night. Clubb and Mossop were awesome last night (Clubb has been all season), they could become a formidable front row for us. Although I don't remember Clubb missing 7 tackles... Also, one I've just remembered - why was Farrell penalised for picking up that ball when Hull had no dummy half? Surely that's just a free ball and anyone can go for it? I thought that rule about reaching around the play the ball was when the dummy half is passing.

Quote ="NickyKiss"Clubb had a blinder as did Mossop going off the stats. www.superleague.co.uk/report/11058 Larne Patrick's stats awful again. We may as well give Connor Farrell or Rhodri Lloyd a go. There's a decent prop/loose forward playing well for HKR who I'd rather have in the squad at present.'" Patrick is really disappointing. He just isn't up to it. His fitness is shocking - he was blowing for tugs after about 15 minutes and subbed off with our starting props after 20. Lockers breezes through 80 minutes at Loose and Bateman was getting through double the amount of work than the what Patrick did last night. Clubb and Mossop were awesome last night (Clubb has been all season), they could become a formidable front row for us. Although I don't remember Clubb missing 7 tackles... Also, one I've just remembered - why was Farrell penalised for picking up that ball when Hull had no dummy half? Surely that's just a free ball and anyone can go for it? I thought that rule about reaching around the play the ball was when the dummy half is passing.

Get Flower and Lockers in that pack and it has a totally different feel. Flower and Mossop starting with Clubb and Tautai from the bench looks pretty formidable especially if we can get Lockers back holding it all together.

One point I would make about that four though is Tautai needs to get fitter. He's a handful for sure and I'm prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt that his Wigan career has been stop start due to injuries which will affect his fitness but he looks a yard off the pace a lot of the time to me.

If he can get fitter then great but if not I think we should look at replacing Pettybourne mid season to add more competition.