Hope you are right with the Bradford analogy.

During and after the game I was bitterly disappointed with the performance.
It was like being in a bad dream thinking that Lam was still head coach.

The day after I got to thinking what was good about the performance other than the start and the finish.
A bit of a struggle to be positive but then I thought we didn’t panic and we kept playing rugby. Not always great rugby but we didn’t fall back into one man rugby which I think we owe to the new coaching structure.

I do think that Field’s pace has covered over some cracks which for me is our lack of speed without the ball, slow ptb and I don’t think that squad is particularly well balanced with too many versatile players and not enough quality experts in several positions notably centres, wings and to a lesser degree the backrow. We still lack that top class prop (could be Mago but he’s got to step up much more for me on a regular basis to be even considered a very good prop) who can do long minutes.

What we have got is better structure and more self believe which if we sprinkle in sublime talent of Field, KPP and hopefully Mago we can give most teams a good game and a good base to build on.
I’m quietly confident of a big improvement against Catalan.

Agree with you re Bilko and Joe Mills. I think they compliment each other but Joe at times can go a bit ott.

I’ve got a feeling our intensity on Saturday will be several times higher than versus Toulouse.

add French to that also will add a bit of dynamic play hopefully

I also think Havard with the solid work of Ellis and with Singleton, Smithies and Byrne improved will add a lot over the season once back into this team. Mago gives us that X factor impact into that equation. How good are we, well definitely better to watch than last season but with a few tests to pass. I think at season start we would all of took what we have seen as a huge positive.

I don’t want to derail the thread so apologies. However not sure where you are getting this idea (again) of Saints fans not being happy with our attack?

42 points away from home last Friday, we looked sublime. Our left edge of Matuatia, Percival and Makinson looking superb. Dodd is showing his class week on week now too. Let’s not forget we have a brand new spine this season, our first choice left winger hasn’t played yet, we’ve had brand new centre/wing combinations on the right side most games and Makinson has played on the left rather than the right all season.

Wakefield is the only real game so far that we didn’t get going and stuttered a little. Not sure what more you want us to do? Have you seen our points difference?

I’ll give you HKR, I didn’t see it, so can’t comment but I’ve seen your other three games and the attack functioned as a result of your defence. Grinding the opposition down and picking them off in their 20. It isn’t traditional attacking rugby (that Saints are famed for) by any stretch (maybe at HKR it was try’s from all over the field, 60,70,80 metres, I don’t know).

We’ve had great points differences in the past and been much the same in terms of a style of play. You score your points through your defence IMO and one or two individuals bring a bit of magic. In terms of my post, I’m saying for us to replicate that is pretty much impossible. Saints clearly put so much time and energy in to practicing that, as well as Woolf coming up with his ‘energy saving’ tactics.

I actually think that you could cause us some real problems this season when we play. Any team with genuine pace could (if utilised correctly) get around our linespeed.

Wakefield caused us a whole host of problems, they kicked early, went wide early in the tackle count and were genuinely inventive and different. I can’t recall a team making as many line breaks and half breaks against us for a long time. We scrambled superbly otherwise they would have posted a few points against us.

Field in particular in broken field will definitely cause us problems. I agree with you that to take us on down the middle would be foolish.

I’m really looking forward to Saturdays game. If Wigan win (or even lose by a close score) I’ll hold my hands up and say they are a real threat this season. Toulouse game apart (and parts of the Hudds game) they’ve looked good this season so Saturdays game is a good barometer of where they are.

It will be really interesting to see how your pack goes against Catalans. We nullified them for the first game however we’ve got our own great pack anyway so it was fighting fire with fire.

We’re a work in progress I think. I fancy that we can maybe take Catalans on at the minute and go close but there’s still work to do before we face (and try to beat) Saints. I don’t think we’ll be in the trophies this season but you never know. People are just enjoying seeing a bit more threat and attacking intent. When we do meet Saints we’ll need to push things and be inventive but it could make for a good game.

I agree trying to 100% replicate what they do isn't the answer, but we need to look at how we up our intensity at key times and positions on the field and find teh right balance. Especially against Saints you need to stop them coming out of their half as easily in the first 3-4 carries.

A good kicking game (it's been better this season but still more improvement needed) exploiting our pace and increased offloading in attack which we seem to be doing will be a huge improvement on last years rugby. We need to put more doubt into a quick line speeds defence and make it harder for them to rush and close the ball players down.

Any of you guys travel over? If so any useful info? Best hotel, bars etc....

It's interesting to hear people including yourself saying that you don't think we'll be in the trophies. We're among the top 3 or 4 sides in the comp so we're definitely in with a chance otherwise the no.1 ranked team would do the clean sweep every year! And that's before we get to the likes of Sheffield etc winning trophies against all the odds.

Saints might look to have the advantage at the moment but it's a long season. Get French and Havard in and we might move a level up. Saints have been relatively lucky with injuries over the last 3 seasons. There's no guarantees that will continue. Most of all form changes over the course of a season. If we're firing on all cylinders come the end of the season (or Saints aren't for that matter) it could look a whole lot different. Most importantly of all, finals are two horse races. We were shoe-ins to win the GF in 2014, Saints to beat Catalans in the CC similar and we know what happened on those days and many others besides.

The trophies aren't handed out in March.

You make some good points. I agree that injuries play a huge part. If we lost say Walmsley or Lomax or even Dodd, we would be massively affected.

However you’ve not made mention of the fact that I think we have a lot more in us yet. Woolf has alluded to this and as I said earlier we are still to play a first choice full strength team. The spine of Welsby, Lomax and Dodd is only 4 games old so lots of room for improvement still.

I don't even know why we're having the season. They should have just given Saints all the trophies and let the players rest for 12 months.

Not sure why you have felt the need to respond the way you have. I've not for one minute suggested we are going to do a clean sweep, I've just alluded to the fact that injuries could play a part. I was merely saying that I think there is more improvement in us yet.

I thought you welcomed fans from other clubs?

I'm not dismissing the fact you have more in you as do all teams, ourselves included. I'm not sure that's relevant as, come the end of the season, no team is likely to be playing their first choice 1-17.

The point I was making is that I simply don't understand the "I don't think we'll win any trophies this year" coming from supporters of a top 4 side. ANY top 4 side has a good shot at winning a trophy and, even outside of the top 4, there's still a chance, especially in the CC where it's a regular occurrence.

The fact is Saints only needed to turn up at Edinburgh. Radlinski had other ideas and the rest is history. Wigan only had to turn up in 2014. Ben Flower had other ideas and the rest is history. Even just 2 years ago Saints only had to turn up yet Wigan could (should?) have won. The posts had other ideas and the rest is history



I'll tell you on the evening of September 24th who is winning the trophies. Anything else is just so much hot air.

Yeah that's fair. The best examples of this are Leeds winning it from 5th when they used to pace themselves for the play offs, get players back who had been resting and gain momentum going into the play offs.

I agree that any of the Top 4 have a realistic chance of winning trophies.

Very true. That Leeds side could hardly be said to have dominated the comp. In fact, it's relatively rare for the LLS winners to go on and win the GF and probably even rarer for them to win the CC.

I think this season will be an interesting one. Without belittling Saints achievements in any way, the last 2 seasons haven't exactly been an even comp. Even playing a couple games less than an opponent can have an enormous effect, if only in terms of fatigue and a corresponding reduction in the chances of picking up injuries. This season should, in theory at least, be the same for everyone.

"However you’ve not made mention of the fact that I think we have a lot more in us yet. Woolf has alluded to this and as I said earlier we are still to play a first choice full strength team. The spine of Welsby, Lomax and Dodd is only 4 games old so lots of room for improvement still."

Apologies, but that comes across as the typical "Saints are the best side RL has ever seen" sort of crap I keep reading on these boards alongside comments such as "Wigan are nothing special". Fair enough if it wasn't.

BTW...you have more in you (as do we) have yet to play a full side (nor have we) and your spine is only 4 games old (as is ours, and arguably won't be our first choice spine)

We absolutely could win something but personally I don’t think we will. We’ll tell plenty over this next 4-6 weeks now when we play Catalans and then Saints and maybe my confidence will grow after that. I think I’m just trying to stay pretty level about things. I don’t expect a trophy but I do expect vast improvements and I think we’re getting that. I do see one or two areas that we can really look to improve in via recruitment and I’m confident if we retain who we need to and sign players to plug any gaps, we’ll be right in the mix next season. Who knows, maybe we’ll get there ahead of my made up schedule but I’m feeling pretty comfortable with how we’re looking.

We'll do a clean sweep and England will win the World Cup, humiliating the Aussies in the final. Have faith!

I would take the World Cup part over Wigan winning anything this season TBH.

Absolutely. I’ve waited a life time to win an Ashes or beat the Aussies to a World Cup.

Snap, and seeing as we only seem to beat them at RU these days a RLWC win would be most welcome.

Toulouse may have brought us back down to earth. But I’m fully accepting of why we went so high; 3 seasons of an abysmal mess all round the club to a colossal change on and off the pitch in more ways than one was always going to get the fans on a pedestal much higher than we should be.

Do I in reality think we’ll win a trophy? Hand on heart no. But I do believe it’s between us and Catalans for a final spot in both the GF and CC. I think it’ll take an almighty performance to knock Saints off their [grits teeth fully deserved perch. They’ve set the standard phenomenally high and keep taking it up a notch. It’s up to us to either pull them back or own a higher perch.

Catalans this week will be a tough test. I can’t see us coming home with the win, I just think they’ve a bit more than us even with their injury/suspension list but it’s a huge bonus if so.

I read yesterday that they expect to have Tomkins, McIlorum and Dudson (last two are defo back) back and possibly Whare as well. I think that only leaves them short of Napa and Bousquet (it didn’t mention Yaha and if he’s ok after pulling out in last weeks warm up).

Happy to get the test against a strong Catalans side anyway. I think we need to see where we’re at.

We caught the "aeroport" bus outside the airport arrivals terminal, every twenty minutes - €8 each. We caught it back from the centre to the airport - very good and punctual.

Our hotel was located about twenty minutes walk away from the city centre Odalys, cheap and very clean. Nice rooms. Saw an Ibis closer in that probably would have suited us better.

At night for those that like a takeaway there's a number of pizza, kebab shops in a row that are open late, plus lots of McDonald's. Quite a lot of nice restaurants knocking about but we didn't go in.

Best pub I thought was Melting Pot, great atmosphere pre and post match. Guinness - €6.90 a pint.