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| Quote ="St pete"The idea not to sign a halfback and not to replace jammer cost him his job.'"
You've been on the ale again.
Royce stated quite clearly in the press at the time of seeking a replacement half for Pryce/Eastmond that there were no halfbacks available, and that Hohaia was the best out there. He also stated he wanted a prop but we have been outbid - again, an issue with the board, not Royce.
Royce did his best. Both Laffranchi and Flanagan look fine to me. They need time to settle in - and God knows what they must be thinking now. They came here because Royce was here. They now find themselves right in the middle of a catastrophe which also leaves them without the reason they came.
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| Quote ="SaintsFan"You've been on the ale again.
Royce stated quite clearly in the press at the time of seeking a replacement half for Pryce/Eastmond that there were no halfbacks available, and that Hohaia was the best out there. He also stated he wanted a prop but we have been outbid - again, an issue with the board, not Royce.
Royce did his best. Both Laffranchi and Flanagan look fine to me. They need time to settle in - and God knows what they must be thinking now. They came here because Royce was here. They now find themselves right in the middle of a catastrophe which also leaves them without the reason they came.'"
No halfbacks available so we give a fullback 4yr deal. Great thinking!
To be honest I don't take notice of anything Royce says as 99% of the time it's utter crap.
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| Quote ="St pete"No halfbacks available so we give a fullback 4yr deal. Great thinking! '"
Look, Pete, you were shown evidence when you last blathered on about this that Hohaia has played in the halves previously, including at first team level. That's where he began. He prefers it there and he came to saints to play there. He was only shifted to fullback a few years ago.
Quote To be honest I don't take notice of anything Royce says as 99% of the time it's utter crap.'"
Nah. You're talking about yourself again.
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| Quote ="St pete"Kite and king play for current NRL champs. Gibbs is ten times the player laffranchci is. O'meilly is the sort of tough rough prop we need.
Not seen much of dudson and also don't know who the ten NRL props that moved are.
It's the clubs job to replace jammer, not mine.
If Royce wants to bring his old mate over to keep him company then it's back fired.
If youve ever watched laffranchci play in the NRL then you'd see he runs out wide and not down the middle.
The idea not to sign a halfback and not to replace jammer cost him his job.'"
I'm gonna go ahead and guess you didn't read the post.
Kite and King currently play for the NRL Champs... exactly, would we have been able to attract and afford them?
Gibbs is 10 times the player Laffranchi is... 1) He's 27, 2) a current origin player & 3) In late 2010 "he signed a contract to remain with the Wests Tigers until the end of the 2014 season. However, by the middle of 2011, Wests Tigers had released Gibbs in order to make room for Adam Blair, and he signed a three year conract with the Cronulla Sharks from the start of 2012 - We would never have been able to afford or attract him either
O'Meley... is currently mid-way through a lucrative contract with Hull
Lauaki's stats aren't as good as Laffranchi's thus far, Dudson if I'm correct has yet to even play, Chris Hill's stats (though 2 games less) are comparable at best, Darrell Griffin's stats are currently inferior...
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| Quote ="SaintsFan"Look, Pete, you were shown evidence when you last blathered on about this that Hohaia has played in the halves previously, including at first team level. That's where he began. He prefers it there and he came to saints to play there. He was only shifted to fullback a few years ago.
Nah. You're talking about yourself again.'"
Why hasn't he been playing in the halves then?
Don't say because roby is out, he was on the bench before robes got hurt.
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| Quote ="St pete"Why hasn't he been playing in the halves then? '"
The man has only just landed in this country, although God knows he must be wondering what on earth he has let himself in for. You don't throw someone who knows nothing about the ethos, structure, etc of a team straight in at the deep end if you don't have to. He has played in the halves though and we won those games (although that could be coincidence of course). But not consistently as yet because he needed time and Royce wanted to keep his players fresh to get a GF win this time, so he was rotating them.
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| Quote ="Tony Stark"I'm gonna go ahead and guess you didn't read the post.
Kite and King currently play for the NRL Champs... exactly, would we have been able to attract and afford them?
Gibbs is 10 times the player Laffranchi is... 1) He's 27, 2) a current origin player & 3) In late 2010 "he signed a contract to remain with the Wests Tigers until the end of the 2014 season. However, by the middle of 2011, Wests Tigers had released Gibbs in order to make room for Adam Blair, and he signed a three year conract with the Cronulla Sharks from the start of 2012 - We would never have been able to afford or attract him either
O'Meley... is currently mid-way through a lucrative contract with Hull
Lauaki's stats aren't as good as Laffranchi's thus far, Dudson if I'm correct has yet to even play, Chris Hill's stats (though 2 games less) are comparable at best, Darrell Griffin's stats are currently inferior...'"
Are you Phil Clarke?
Listen, the was props available and we opted for a average backrow to replace the best player at the club.
Is is from a coach that constantly said he won't pick players out of postion and that was the main reason for the back on the bench.
He wont play players out of postion but signs a backrow and fullback to play prop and stand off
Well if we can't find a prop anywhere in the world in the time we had (10 props moved in the NRL) then props will be extinct soon.
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| Quote ="SaintsFan"The man has only just landed in this country, although God knows he must be wondering what on earth he has let himself in for. You don't throw someone who knows nothing about the ethos, structure, etc of a team straight in at the deep end if you don't have to. He has played in the halves though and we won those games (although that could be coincidence of course). But not consistently as yet because he needed time and Royce wanted to keep his players fresh to get a GF win this time, so he was rotating them.'"
He's a world cup winning player who's played in NRL grand finals so I'd suspect he'd be ok against super league sides.
I'd thought he'd stuck with him at #7 if he thought he was the answer.
Only time will tell if he makes it in the halves but I'm willing to bet you £200 he don't make a success of that postion.
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| Quote ="St pete"Listen, the was props available and we opted for a average backrow to replace the best player at the club.'"
Look (which is more appropriate since we are typing on a screen), there were props available, we bid for them, and they went elsewhere.
End of debate.
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| Quote ="SaintsFan"Look (which is more appropriate since we are typing on a screen), there were props available, we bid for them, and they went elsewhere.
End of debate.'"
Maybe they just had chat with Royce and went elsewhere
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| Wrong choice of appointment in the first place.
I can remember when the appointment was announced and the Hull fans were saying, top bloke, yes, will run marathons for you, but head coach? No.
Eamonn was trying to emulate Wigan by taking an NRL assistant coach and hoping he would do the magic over here. Dont want to sound ageist but, there was a reason why Madge was no 2 at the most successful club in the NRL by his mid thirties. And also a reason why Royce was not a head coach in the NRL by his fifties.
At least Eamonn has had the balls to admit his error and tried to rectify it.
KFC I don't think is the answer, too much too soon, could do more damage than good and could take him years to recover ala Betts at Wigan.
What you need now is an old hand to steady the ship in these troubled times
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| Quote ="nikos"And also a reason why Royce was not a head coach in the NRL by his fifties.'"
Wayne Bennett must be total crap then!
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| Quote ="SaintsFan"icon_lol.gif
Wayne Bennett must be total crap then!'"
he wasnt making a living from rugby league his whole life
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| Quote ="feilds of knowsleyRD"he wasnt making a living from rugby league his whole life'"
What?
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| Quote ="St pete"Are you Phil Clarke?
Listen, the was props available and we opted for a average backrow to replace the best player at the club.'"
You keep saying there were props available. So far you haven't listed a single viable candidate. And I shall restate an obvious point - a club's "best player" is BY DEFINITION extraordinarily difficult to replace. There are only two or three props in the world capable of doing Graham's job. NONE were available.
You describe Laffranchi as "average". Yet he has played for both NSW and Australia and has consistently been regarded as one of the top back row forwards in the NRL. I mean, you're making yourself look utterly stupid.
Quote Is is from a coach that constantly said he won't pick players out of postion and that was the main reason for the back on the bench.'"
Did you miss the bit about saving players for the playoffs?
Quote He wont play players out of postion but signs a backrow and fullback to play prop and stand off
'"
Were you complaining when David Fairleigh was picked at prop for Saints? And since when was it unusual for a back row to gravitate toward the front? Since when was it unusual for a full-back to play in the halves? A full-back who, I might add, has represented New Zealand in the halves.
Quote Well if we can't find a prop anywhere in the world in the time we had (10 props moved in the NRL) then props will be extinct soon.'"
How many good props have Saints produced in the last twenty five years? When I said "good" I mean a player with the wherewithal to cement a long-term career at the club (say five or six years in the first team).
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| Quote ="St pete"Lauaki, dudson '"
Lauaki and Dudson are second rowers by trade. People would have levelled the same complaint they are now about converting second rowers.
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| Quote ="Mugwump"You keep saying there were props available. So far you haven't listed a single viable candidate. And I shall restate an obvious point - a club's "best player" is BY DEFINITION extraordinarily difficult to replace. There are only two or three props in the world capable of doing Graham's job. NONE were available.
You describe Laffranchi as "average". Yet he has played for both NSW and Australia and has consistently been regarded as one of the top back row forwards in the NRL. I mean, you're making yourself look utterly stupid.
Did you miss the bit about saving players for the playoffs?
Were you complaining when David Fairleigh was picked at prop for Saints? And since when was it unusual for a back row to gravitate toward the front? Since when was it unusual for a full-back to play in the halves? A full-back who, I might add, has represented New Zealand in the halves.
How many good props have Saints produced in the last twenty five years? When I said "good" I mean a player with the wherewithal to cement a long-term career at the club (say five or six years in the first team).'"
Like I said, ten NRL props switched clubs last year.
I ain't listed any?
Blair, Gibbs, kite, king, hill, dudson, Luke bailey, griffin along with tye other NRL props that was available.
We've got clough, laffranchci, TP all converted from the backrow with only perry and LMS as props by trade.
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| Quote ="Mugwump"You keep saying there were props available. So far you haven't listed a single viable candidate. And I shall restate an obvious point - a club's "best player" is BY DEFINITION extraordinarily difficult to replace. There are only two or three props in the world capable of doing Graham's job. NONE were available.
You describe Laffranchi as "average". Yet he has played for both NSW and Australia and has consistently been regarded as one of the top back row forwards in the NRL. I mean, you're making yourself look utterly stupid.
Did you miss the bit about saving players for the playoffs?
Were you complaining when David
Fairleigh was picked at prop for Saints? And since when was it unusual for a back row to gravitate toward the front? Since when was it unusual for a full-back to play in the halves? A full-back who, I might add, has represented New Zealand in the halves.
How many good props have Saints produced in the last twenty five years? When I said "good" I mean a player with the wherewithal to cement a long-term career at the club (say five or six years in the first team).'"
Also, Leeds, Widnes, Wigan, hull, hull kr, Wakefield, bradford all signed a couple of props on.
David ferrioul was also off contract
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| Quote ="Smurf"Lauaki and Dudson are second rowers by trade. People would have levelled the same complaint they are now about converting second rowers.'"
Dudson isn't, out and out prop but he hasn't played for us yet this season. You thinking of Flower perhaps?
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| Quote ="St pete"Like I said, ten NRL props switched clubs last year.
I ain't listed any?
Blair, Gibbs, kite, king, hill, dudson, Luke bailey, griffin along with tye other NRL props that was available.'"
They were available. But this doesn't mean they were available to us. The NRL knows the value of a good prop. Which is why such very, very rarely come to the UK. I mean, sure - there was a time when we could offer significantly higher wages and this did attract some. But given the amount of lolly swilling around in the NRL these days (not to mention unfavourable exchange rates coming to the UK) we can no longer compete for all but one or two.
Some of the above names go beyond wishful thinking. Of the remainder you are forgetting those who see no good reason for signing with Saints. If I were a player looking for a SL club Leeds, Warrington and Wigan seem to offer better prospects.
Quote We've got clough, laffranchci, TP all converted from the backrow with only perry and LMS as props by trade.'"
Since when did it become impossible for back row forwards to migrate to the front?
Have you forgotten that Kevin Ward, Andy Platt, Jamie Peacock and David Fairleigh - four of the greatest props in the last thirty years - ALL moved up from the second row?
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| Quote ="Mugwump"Have you forgotten that Kevin Ward, Andy Platt, Jamie Peacock and David Fairleigh - four of the greatest props in the last thirty years - ALL moved up from the second row?'"
And Graham.
I reckon Laffranchi has been our best prop so far this year, admittedly, none of them have been particulalrly good, but even so, he has done ok. Perry is an out and out prop, and he has failed dismally so far.
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| Quote ="Mugwump"Since when did it become impossible for back row forwards to migrate to the front? '"
Anyone who thinks TP and Clough are anything but props is on a different planet to me.
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| Seems to be a few people on here a bit deluded, at the end of the day in most sports the coach/manager pays the price for poor performances and results. We are no doubt light in some areas of the team (An experienced halfback (not a guy who's mainly played fullback and hooker) and a monster prop) that may or may not be Royce's fault but it doesnt matter really as he is paid to coach what we have to perform at their peak week in week out and for whatever reason he's not managed it.
Time will tell if it was the correct decision at this point in the season but tbh I dont think his contract would have been renewed anyways so all we have done is bring forward the inevitable
With Rush and KC in charge I wonder if they'll make the tough calls? The Wello question springs to mind - for me he shouldn't be our first choice at 1 , if they see it too will they make the call and bench/change Wello's position ....
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| Quote ="Offside Monkey"Anyone who thinks TP and Clough are anything but props is on a different planet to me.'"
I kind of agree but I think TP would be fine in the second row if we had better options at prop , running wide he would create havoc and importantly space for our centre's with his ability to draw in defenders and offload
Clough is a bettering ram and a prop every day of the week
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| Quote ="No1 Saint"I kind of agree but I think TP would be fine in the second row if we had better options at prop , running wide he would create havoc and importantly space for our centre's with his ability to draw in defenders and offload'"
When we signed him, I was hoping for a Lauititi type second row to play out wide, but ever since he's pulled on the Vee he's played up the middle (and a very good one).
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