Hanley isnt the answer. What did he do at cas. Took them from cellar dwellers to...ummm..cellar dwellers. He hasnt a clue.

I could have won the title with the playing staff Saints had at the time.

Your right Steve. Hanley would not be an Alex Fergusen type of appointment. He woule be here for 6-18 months to change the philosophy and whole environment of the club.
He would bring self belief. Currently we make a mistake / Give a penalty away in our half and everybody suspects we might concede even though we are a player up. It look like the players feel that way as well.

I think that Hanley was the catalyst to their success over the last 10 years. They were not a bad team before that in fact i would go as far to say good but since he was there they have become great. His job was done just as it was at Doncaster and leave it to somebody to build on his work.

I hope Lowes stays and turns it around but I am having massive groundhog day moments here. The game tonight was like Harlequins at home last year when everything was in our favour, Dragons had 2 big players out in Ryles and Raguin and lost Carlaw for the full game early on.
They were down to 12 men for 10 minutes and we still couldnt do it.
That is a difference in mental attitude and not coaching. Lowes did not drop the passes, Hold players down and make tackles when you are in an offside position.

You can be as fit and strong as you want with all the skills in the world but if the desire is not there then you have very little. In that second half Dragons were starting sets 10 yards out but were getting to halfway to make the kick or getting a free ride from a penalty.

Poor.

I'm with you on that Buddie, I don't know who the right man to lead our team is but felt Lowes was the wrong appointment and still do.

Moribund - I like that word. I remember an Alan Partridge sketch about that once .

I am fairly certain we have Tony Smith lined up for next year. If we haven't, then Lowes is a disaster. If he is, then I can just about cope (just). If Smith is not lined up, then get Noble in now. He'll sort out our defence. And yes, I know Wigan have lost their first three, but look at their squad - nowhere near our quality.

Sir Ian of Millward is looking for a return to Super League. Tony Smith has got to be the favourite, although he thoroughly destroyed any respect I had for him with his inability to coach our finest into anything like a resistance against the proper teams in the World Cup.

I don't think Smith would be a good choice for Warrington either as he is not going to resolve the drinking culture and 'lads about town' nature of the club. He totally and utterly failed at uniting the Saints and Leeds players in the England squad, which the players have now admitted cost England.

Hanley was only involved in a vague "consultancy" role at Castleford, for four weeks, so its hard to see what sort of impact he could have had. In the two jobs where he was head coach, he succeeded both times.

As for winning the title with the playing staff Saints had at the time, don't be daft, the reason Shaun McRae was sacked was because he couldn't. Saints had some good players but it wasn't anything like the team that they later had. It had players in the first team like Paul Atcheson, Anthony Stewart, Chris Smith, Julian O'Neill (the prop), Vila Matautia, Paul Davidson....these guys would not have been regulars in the Bradford, Wigan and Leeds teams of the time. Bradford were the best team in the competition that year, Hanley won Saints the title by constructing a resilient and defensively tough side who hung in the title race right through to the Grand Final and then at Old Trafford made sure they stayed in the game when the Bulls were on top of them, and sneaked a win with a late score.

One myth that came from that season is that Hanley installed a blanket alcohol ban, which he didn't, he just enforced an alcohol ban at certain stages of the season, eg over the Easter weekend when they had a busy run of fixtures.

I would urge the board to do something sooner, rather than later, so that a new man will have time to make an impact before it's too late.

If things up the road don't change soon, then IMO Hanley will be a SL head coach within a few weeks, We should be making a move now whilst he is still available. However, I suspect the board will hang on, and on, in the hope that Jimmy gets it right eventually (they do have 'form' in this department).

No point in bringing a disciplinarian in if the board will not back him. Paul Cullen tried to sack a player last season due to consistant misdimeeners but the board would not back him as they did not want the bad publicity that would come with it and the story that would then come out.

Cullen found himself in a similar position to Keegan at Newcastle, what is the point in having someone in charge of the team if the board will not allow them to then run the team without interference.

Ellery Hanley would not get on well at Warrington for the reasons above although I beleive with a free reign to sort things out he could be a very good appointment.

In that case geordie the board will have to go too.

Ive said a million times before that I dont know who the hell these board members are and what they bring to the club. As far as I can see they are just washed up ex politicians or councillors who seem to have no idea what so ever about how to bring success to this club.

They pride themselves on off the field successes but Im sorry this is a RLFC and its what happens on the pitch that counts.

I wont include Moran as he obviously brings a bit of financial clout but all the others can bugger off and take their crap decisions with them.

I'd argue that there's a need to have a tough overall rugby manager to carry out contract talks, deal with transfers, control discipline, deal with the media, oversee and coordinate youth and development stuff etc. He should then be over the first team coach providing input into the team direction but not necessarily dealing with the team all the time. He also would not be over friendly and over familiar with the team. The First team coach can then purely deal with the first team on the game and training field.

At the moment we seem to overload our coach with duties and expect him to be a strict disciplanarian who is totally friendly with the players while juggling every other duty except printing the programme. I can't see anyone can do that successfully

Why would we need to bring Hanley in?!

The board promised us a world class coach when Cullen resigned and who are we to say Lowes isn't? After all none of us run a rugby league club.

Are you;-
a - drunk
b - honestly suggesting that Lowes is a world class coach
c - trying (and failing) with a 'Sally'

7 depressing losses isn't exactly "World Class" is it?

Exactly what has Lowes brought to the advancement of this Club ??
As far as I can see....sweet FA

Is Hanley world class though??

I don't really understand why the national coach can't do 2 jobs (Tony Smith)

The games are spread over 3 days nowadays so he can get to other games besides the Warrington ones and he would see every team against Warrington

It's not like England play too many games, especially during the Super League season (1 I think? Against France?) and then the 4 Nations at the end of the season

GET TONY SMITH IN NOW!!

Interesting point from Geordie. Increasingly it seems to me that alot of the problems come from the top. Although Simon Moran has been great for the club in terms of pumping cash in but (and this is purely my own perception with no basis in fact) I get the feeling that the power in the team lies with him rather than coach.

In particular, I get the impression the signings we make are whims of fancy rather part of a structured scouting programme lead by the coach. Matt King and the Joey Johns signings are classic examples of this. Did we actually watch King closely before we signed him? Just from my cursory reading about the NRL lead me to believe that King wasn't anything special but had prospered by the tactic of high kicks to his flank where he outjumped the oppositon. The way his signing was flagged up - it was like the second coming of Phil Blake was on its way. Sullivan is another example - everyone in Oz said - the guy is a relief hooker not a scrum half so we faff around for a season until we realise he's a relief hooker not a scrum half.

Watching King against Saints was embarassing - was he injured or is he really that slow and lame.

I don't know why I'm so peed off - as to be honest I expected this season to start this way. I just can't believe that we appointed Lowes before the end of last season - the board had absolutely no need to rush into a decision - we won games we should have and then when we appointed him full time - the thing went South and the rot hasn't stopped.

I'm almost at the stage now where I hope we lose so we might actually get some change. I've supported the Wire for 26 years and I've never felt like that.

Well it can't be failing that bad as you question my prerogative after so long on here.

There is only 1 answer to our long term problems and that is Tony Smith. The problem we have short term is an inept coach and no one to fill the void on a temp basis. The calls for Hanley have there merits, he would instill discipline and put fear into the dressing room but its not a long term solution. We as a club are becoming a farce, expecting that if you pump money in (look at Man City, Newcastle) you are guaranteed success. It takes time to build a club and a winning team and at the moment a "team" is something we are a million miles from.

nice thread

heard that as well....may be a rumour but the rfl warned warrington to keep there distance as regards to smith..hope we do get him the sooner the better...whats phil chadwick doing these days i`d love to see him with this bunch of no hopers up lymm damm...something like that wud sort this pathetic bunch out

I absolutely agree Geordie, the KK comparison is spot on, too many 'powers above' have a say in on the field stuff, for me, and that was one of the main reasons to Paul leaving.

I'm in that club too. Thirty plus years of support and I hate James Lowes being Head Coach.

I'd like to know how many of the crowd who wanted Cullen removed - I was definitely not one of them - would have done so had they known Lowes was to be the replacement.

hanley did nothing at cas cos we didnt listen to him.for him to be effective you need the board to back him 100%
in 2004 hanley came in and listed everything that needed changing at the club top to bottom.
in our wisdom we ignored most of it he left and we went down the cheap gary mercer route to nl1.
whilst i dont have much time for hanley the person hanley the coach is a winner.

For me - fantastic player as he was - Hanley wouldn't be the answer. Look at all of his appopintments and they've never been exactly smooth for the clubs concerned or always led to success.

Millward ? Was he found out at Wigan?

Smith ? Jumped from Leeds before he was pushed?