The usual encouraging atmosphere at the Dinner last night, plus a much greater sense of confidence. Better stronger squad, improved fitness regime, more varied coaching input and greater strength in depth.

OK it is impossible to legislate for what the opposition have been doing to prepare, but it would seem that we have ratcheted things up a few notches across the board. Great team spirit and togetherness, very much in evidence again, with TO'C (who is admittedly massively biased) suggesting that the atmosphere amongst the Widnes squad is unique in his experience across Superleague.

Message from Denis that he and the coaching staff are faced with real selection dilemmas as there are many more quality players competing for places in the 17 than ever before and that the pre-season games have also demonstrated that any of the younger players called upon, will be ready and not played out of desperation. He made it clear that the squad has been assembled for the season as a whole and that different combinations would be needed for different games.

Kevin Brown also at Terry's behest attempted to put to bed all the rumours of him being interested in going to Australia, making it clear that he was very happy here playing with his mates, proud to be captaining the side and that they fear nobody (a far cry from his early games when he was occasionally fearful of what sort of blowout score it might be if certain teams cut loose against us!).

These nights always have a feelgood factor, but I sensed some steely determination beneath the surface!

Everything sounds good.Team spirit, competition for places,fitness, nutrition etc etc.Just need to walk the walk now and put it into practice where it counts.

That all sounds encouraging WV, thanks for the info.

Any news about number of SH uptake last night? I'm a little concerned JR has stated we currently have 'several hundred' from last year still not bought so was wondering if this has been offset with similar amount or more new sign ups?

Do we have a situation were fans have already become complacent and can't be bothered, the hype of SL not done it for them even on the back of our best ever year in the top flight in the last 20yrs.

Well the Season ticket deal is pretty good compared to football Season tickets. Some may just pick their games and that be a reason dropped out of a season ticket. Next year i will probably just pay on the day, because i travel from Lincoln and work shifts too. Even though most are on a Sunday the days played are varied and you never know if a shift worker. The record breaker seems a good idea for Marketing our game and hopefully people spread the word around the Town.

I agree record attempt is a great idea to up interest, the problems for me with this are it is a week day (Thursday) not a weekend day, it is a work and school day & time 11am IIRC so I will be amazed if they succeed or get close to the target of 4,000. Not their fault first game picked for Thursday TV but would it have been better to wait until Sunday or Saturday match to do it? Although they could be targeting the number of unemployed or students that could be free on a Thursday morning who they feel may not go the game that night, this way they give out some free tickets in the hope to boost the crowd number on the night. How kids are going to get out of school to attend will be interesting, the wagging officer if there is such a thing should be down there to see if he / she can pick up some fines!!

Hope they get the record and people who do go do then attend the match later that night.

Neil he remains silent about actual numbers, but painted a gloomy picture of the impact of the drop in crowds last year saying that we suffered a six figure reduction in cash on season tickets (passes!) and a six figure reduction on ticket sales. The failure to get extra crowds through the gates really seems like our biggest problem.

On the basis of what he said I am assuming that season ticket sales were down across the year by at least £100,000 and money through the turnstiles was down by another £100,000 (at least).

Given that and the fine (which wasn't referred to at all last night), it is pretty remarkable that we managed to bring in Heremaia, Manuokafoa, Clarkson and Dudson and support all the rest of the infrastructure for the academy sides.

The record breaker initiative, was generating plenty of interest with 2000 school children already signed up and the hope that there will be 4000 on the pitch. Hopefully there will be enough interest to take up their tickets for the Wigan game (West Stand?). Lets hope the weather doesn't spoil things!

It was a great night last night and definitely left me feeling upbeat and positive about the season ahead. Me and my mate had a good chat with Jon Clarke who says he is loving his new role and is very very impressed at the step up in professionalism around fitness and nutrition along with lads at the academy to keep an eye on. The drop in crowds and people renewing their season tickets is a bit frustrating though. I'm doing everything I can to encourage mates to come along and see what the game's like and we're about. Hopefully people will get back on board, feel the positivity around our club, and get the attendances up...

I doubt the average punter in Widdy sees eighth place as success. It is progress but if we could only average around 7500 in the glory years winning silverware then eighth in the table means nothing to the casual fan.It is frustrating Rafe and as you say,provide a nice new shiny stadium,a team playing decent football in good weather and the public say '' we might come if you actually win something.Might do.Some of us.''

Quote: WirralViking "Neil he remains silent about actual numbers, but painted a gloomy picture of the impact of the drop in crowds last year saying that we suffered a six figure reduction in cash on season tickets (passes!) and a six figure reduction on ticket sales. The failure to get extra crowds through the gates really seems like our biggest problem. On the basis of what he said I am assuming that season ticket sales were down across the year by at least £100,000 and money through the turnstiles was down by another £100,000 (at least). Given that and the fine (which wasn't referred to at all last night), it is pretty remarkable that we managed to bring in Heremaia, Manuokafoa, Clarkson and Dudson and support all the rest of the infrastructure for the academy sides. The record breaker initiative, was generating plenty of interest with 2000 school children already signed up and the hope that there will be 4000 on the pitch. Hopefully there will be enough interest to take up their tickets for the Wigan game (West Stand?). Lets hope the weather doesn't spoil things!'" Well I am really surprised we have managed to bring in those 4 players too if those six figure amounts are true, no reason not to believe them. £100,000+ lost on season passes last year equates to about 400 not resigning at an average price of £250 each pass, that's a lot. Our average was down circa 400 per game so at £20 per ticket x 13 games (league matches) = £104,000 lost. 400 lost season passes is unbelievable for me if we have 3,000+ holders a reduction of over 10% is mental considering how well we did. Must be so soul destroying for the people running the club to see this. James Rule on Merseyside Try Time last night confirms above, listen via link below Widnes first part of the programme. www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p02gvff8#auto

Quote: WirralViking "Neil he remains silent about actual numbers, but painted a gloomy picture of the impact of the drop in crowds last year saying that we suffered a six figure reduction in cash on season tickets (passes!) and a six figure reduction on ticket sales. The failure to get extra crowds through the gates really seems like our biggest problem. On the basis of what he said I am assuming that season ticket sales were down across the year by at least £100,000 and money through the turnstiles was down by another £100,000 (at least). Given that and the fine (which wasn't referred to at all last night), it is pretty remarkable that we managed to bring in Heremaia, Manuokafoa, Clarkson and Dudson and support all the rest of the infrastructure for the academy sides. The record breaker initiative, was generating plenty of interest with 2000 school children already signed up and the hope that there will be 4000 on the pitch. Hopefully there will be enough interest to take up their tickets for the Wigan game (West Stand?). Lets hope the weather doesn't spoil things!'" Well I am really surprised we have managed to bring in those 4 players too if those six figure amounts are true, no reason not to believe them. £100,000+ lost on season passes last year equates to about 400 not resigning at an average price of £250 each pass, that's a lot. Our average was down circa 400 per game so at £20 per ticket x 13 games (league matches) = £104,000 lost. 400 lost season passes is unbelievable for me if we have 3,000+ holders a reduction of over 10% is mental considering how well we did. Must be so soul destroying for the people running the club to see this. James Rule on Merseyside Try Time last night confirms above, listen via link below Widnes first part of the programme. www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p02gvff8#auto

IIRC Sky money went up for this year plus of course we have released players.

Hopefully the majority who have not renewed will continue their support and attend games.One reason for the drop is games being played Thursday Friday and Sunday.People can't plan ahead.

This could be the reason guess we will never know, likewise it could be the reason an extra 500+ have bought SH because we have switched to mainly Sunday matches (Sky pick aside). Let hope we can do as well if not better than last season, Final and top 4/6 maybe (lots of fingers crossed for this one!) and our average over the full season can edge to or break the 6,500 barrier. I feel it need to if we are continue our year on year improvement as the extra money helps to retain players both experienced and youth and also can aid in signing the better quality players to improve the squad as people leave or are released.

Bring on Thursday COYV.

Just seems unlikely that hundreds of people can go from season ticket holders one year to not interested at all the next,all at the same time.A couple of dozen maybe. There must be a common denominator and no regular match day is it I reckon.That goes for all clubs of course.

Well I have had a family tickets for the past 3 yrs but because of the change in format of the SH, the big increase in price for me and 2 kids tickets (family ticket) added to the fact the kids don't want to go every week I chose to just get Adult ticket this year for me and will take kids a couple of times should they want to go. Will this from the clubs perspective but noted as two lost SH'ers? But I have never been contacted and asked why not a family ticket anymore.

I also know of 3 people who are not renewing this year from last year for different reasons, not sure can make matches every round, another gets free tickets so no need to buy a SH.

I too questioned the number being in the hundreds, it does seem a lot from one season to the next.