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| Quote ="ccs"A drop in attendances of 1k per year for 4 years adds up to at least £2.5m in income. A tidy sum.
He didn't say these new guys are not affordable, but a key income stream is not generating the kind of money needed to maintain this level of investment over the longer term.'"
He should have appointed a decent coach then and the attendances wouldn't have dropped. Pretty poor blaming the fans for the situation we're in which is all of his own making
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| imo I believe we have made good signings for next year, pearson has but a lot of money in and ok has made some dodgy calls,we have a team to challenge for 5 or 6 and maybe top 4 who knows, if that happens the crowds will start to improve imo
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| Quote ="ccs"A drop in attendances of 1k per year for 4 years adds up to at least £2.5m in income. A tidy sum.He didn't say these new guys are not affordable, but a key income stream is not generating the kind of money needed to maintain this level of investment over the longer term.'"
These are based on our home SL matches, we haven't had a play-off game since 2013 so I've not included them in the averages.
2011 161,557 agg, 13 matches Av. 12,427
2012 154,515 agg, 13 matches Av. 11,886 (+8,862 PO game)
2013 151,355 agg, 13 matches Av. 11,642 (+4,970 PO game)
2014 143,891 agg, 13 matches Av. 11,068
2015 156,467 agg, 14 matches Av. 11,173
Total 'lost' fans by comparison to the aggregate of 2011 is strangely exactly 40,000 (7042+10202+17666+5090), if you want to then take off the extra fans from having play-off games that's 26,168 fewer home fans over 4 years.
Based on your £2.5M & 26,168 fewer fans Adam Pearson has lost an average of £95.54[inet[/i for every single fan from home (league & PO) gate money which can't be right because average [igross[/i income per fan over the 4 year period is at most £18 (taking into account juniors and lower season pass costs in previous seasons), however you have to take off the wedge of money that SMC takes makes the actual net income to the club per fan very much less.
I think someone once mentioned less than £10 but I've no idea how the deal works, but whatever it is, over 4 years the amount in lost income from fans through the gate is nowhere near the £2.5M you've stated, 5 times less if we're being v.generous so this massive loss of income doesn't seem to be quite as bad as you're trying to make out.
Either way he has to do something to encourage the fans back and stop making antagonising statements that puts the onus/blame squarely onto the fans, having a pop at those deciding to keep their money in their pocket due to the rubbish on the pitch is decidedly not the way to do it.
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| Quote ="Diogenes"A better product on the pitch will increase the walk up gate next season and generate more pass sales in 2017.'"
Is there such a thing now everyone has to buy a ticket?
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| Pearson does really have a nerve blaming the fans and this antagonist and egotistical approach will only damage the fanbase further.
Like stated the demise we find ourselves in is solely down to him.
His sanctioning of deals, his continued employment and support for a head coach not good enough whose sole employment alone has driven fans away.
He's now further allowed the signing of albeit quality players on large salaries I'd assume which in actual fact causes an imbalance in the squad and not addressed any of this season issues.
This is highlighted further when you see Wigan signing the likes of Isa not because he's a superstar but i suspect he's relatively cheap but compliments the balance of the squad which is far more important than a handful of marquee signings to boost the crowd ala Salford and now us to a lesser extent.
Signings aside I still know of fans who after 2 years of Radford and another season of him coupled with continued disappointing performances have decided not to renew because of these reasons which has outweighed the signings made in their decision making.
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| Quote ="Darrell"Quote ="Diogenes"A better product on the pitch will increase the walk up gate next season and generate more pass sales in 2017.'"
Is there such a thing now everyone has to buy a ticket?'"
I meant non-passholders.
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| Quote ="Darrell"Is there such a thing now everyone has to buy a ticket?'"
Yes you can walk up and pay on the day just not at the turn style. Have to go to office to purchase ticket first. I know a lot of people who still do this simply due to work and other commitments have often clashed when sky have chosen to move game.
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| Quote ="knockersbumpMKII"These are based on our home SL matches, we haven't had a play-off game since 2013 so I've not included them in the averages.
2011 161,557 agg, 13 matches Av. 12,427
2012 154,515 agg, 13 matches Av. 11,886 (+8,862 PO game)
2013 151,355 agg, 13 matches Av. 11,642 (+4,970 PO game)
2014 143,891 agg, 13 matches Av. 11,068
2015 156,467 agg, 14 matches Av. 11,173
Total 'lost' fans by comparison to the aggregate of 2011 is strangely exactly 40,000 (7042+10202+17666+5090), if you want to then take off the extra fans from having play-off games that's 26,168 fewer home fans over 4 years.
Based on your £2.5M & 26,168 fewer fans Adam Pearson has lost an average of £95.54[inet[/i for every single fan from home (league & PO) gate money which can't be right because average [igross[/i income per fan over the 4 year period is at most £18 (taking into account juniors and lower season pass costs in previous seasons), however you have to take off the wedge of money that SMC takes makes the actual net income to the club per fan very much less.
I think someone once mentioned less than £10 but I've no idea how the deal works, but whatever it is, over 4 years the amount in lost income from fans through the gate is nowhere near the £2.5M you've stated, 5 times less if we're being v.generous so this massive loss of income doesn't seem to be quite as bad as you're trying to make out.
Either way he has to do something to encourage the fans back and stop making antagonising statements that puts the onus/blame squarely onto the fans, having a pop at those deciding to keep their money in their pocket due to the rubbish on the pitch is decidedly not the way to do it.'"
I guess the HDM must have got it wrong...
Quote ="HDM"With last season's average gate of 9,662 over 4,000 down on four years ago, current pass sale levels suggest another significant drop is on the cards ahead of the new-look Super League structure coming in.'"
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| Quote ="Mrs Barista"Indeed. If we go tits up we can't say we weren't warned and didn't have the opportunity to help.'"
We wont, but thanks for your threats
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| Quote ="threepennystander"Fans who don't renew killing the club? Is he for real. Always backed pearson but the guy is losing the plot and will be losing more fans with idiotic statements like that.The fans have stuck with his next season will be the season bull for how long.After the leeds play off we all loved the "never again will this club come to leeds and be embarrassed,and scraping into the play offs will not be excepted "speech ( unless its 2015 and thats our main aim ). We've had the building a british based side with future internationals speech ( which means overpaying unproven players on long contracts then having to pay them off,or its 2016 and we need to look to the nrl for our recruitment).Then we got the home grown wigan approach with the club hull speech ( until we decide to merg our academy with our biggest rivals despite more lads stepping up to first grade than ever) . Throughout all these false dawns and grand statements we've turned up more times than the team. Now he pulls out his ace card "the fans who don't renew their passes are killing this club". I'm not disputing it won't have a drastic effect on the club but to lay it at the fans feet is a joke..I'd ask the question if he's been watching the same team as me. If he has it can't be to hard to see why people aren't renewing anymore. Sorry adam but this situation is down to you more than us. Best intentions? Yes. Terrible decisions? Yes Trouble ahead? Most definitely'"
AP reminds of a small man who run the club in 1998
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| Quote ="BEN_THE_BLACK&WHITE"Call me cynical but could this be the spin and excuse that leads to a full on merger with KR.'"
It's coming
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| Quote ="Sebasteeno"On a side note, weve signed all these great back rowers etc then gone out an said were fooked financially and in the mire. Bet they cant wait to come now
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We will be royally fooked, if the tank doesnt turn up, Barista will kill
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| There will be plenty of fans who have called the club and its fans on the internet, those who say the club will close due to 1000 passes not being renewed, who will be at the player of the year dinner tonight, lording it up, licking the club and professing to be super fans
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| To give a sense of perspective I suggest that everyone mentally replaces every reference that Pearson makes to "the club" with "my investment".
The guy has no interest in the club whatsoever other than the monetary value has has invested in it.
It is obviuously conjecture, but if someone offered him his money back that he paid for the club tomorrow I'd wager he'd bite their proverbial hand off.
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| Quote ="Lang Park"To give a sense of perspective I suggest that everyone mentally replaces every reference that Pearson makes to "the club" with "my investment".
The guy has no interest in the club whatsoever other than the monetary value has has invested in it.
It is obviuously conjecture, but if someone offered him his money back that he paid for the club tomorrow I'd wager he'd bite their proverbial hand off.'"
It's a tricky one trying to read AP. If what you say is true, why would he have paid the SMC (Allams) to keep the North Stand open, this season, when he could have saved his cash????? If he is motivated by money, why has he laft a lucrative position at Leeds United, or was it Hetherington that run him out of Leeds  or is it a conflict of interests regards the FA, ie consortium taking over City??????????????
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| Quote ="Lang Park"To give a sense of perspective I suggest that everyone mentally replaces every reference that Pearson makes to "the club" with "my investment".
The guy has no interest in the club whatsoever other than the monetary value has has invested in it.
It is obviuously conjecture, but if someone offered him his money back that he paid for the club tomorrow I'd wager he'd bite their proverbial hand off.'"
100%, in fact I think he'd stomach a 25% loss to just walk away, but hey ho, he's still the messiah in some eyes and it's all our fault for not throwing good money after bad.
If Hull FC were a restaurant, serving up poor food in a dull environment, luke warm coffee with salt instead of sugar, would people still say "keep paying, or it will close"... it's a buyers market when it comes to entertainment/leisure.
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| Quote ="Armavinit"It's a tricky one trying to read AP. If what you say is true, why would he have paid the SMC (Allams) to keep the North Stand open, this season, when he could have saved his cash????? If he is motivated by money, why has he laft a lucrative position at Leeds United, or was it Hetherington that run him out of Leeds
or is it a conflict of interests regards the FA, ie consortium taking over City??????????????'"
I think he's still hoping to get the success he craves so that he can turn things around and walk away with a profit. After all, he had several failures and was under pressure to sack Peter Taylor at City before he turned things around and saw Ap walk away with a tidy profit.
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| Quote ="HullFC_1865"100%, in fact I think he'd stomach a 25% loss to just walk away, but hey ho, he's still the messiah in some eyes and it's all our fault for not throwing good money after bad.
If Hull FC were a restaurant, serving up poor food in a dull environment, luke warm coffee with salt instead of sugar, would people still say "keep paying, or it will close"... it's a buyers market when it comes to entertainment/leisure.'"
To be fair the field of professional sports has always been a special case and the loyalty to the brand has always been stronger in it. I respect the fact that people are loyal to Hull FC and prepared to spend their hard earned cash even when they're not been served up value for money.
What I find hard to accept is when those that have a different value system are pilloried for it. They should be shown the same respect for their views as those who still choose to financially support the club.
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| pearson got his faults no doubt but still think hes invested a lot of his time and money in the club and for now has my backing
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| Quote ="Lang Park"To be fair the field of professional sports has always been a special case and the loyalty to the brand has always been stronger in it. I respect the fact that people are loyal to Hull FC and prepared to spend their hard earned cash even when they're not been served up value for money.
What I find hard to accept is when those that have a different value system are pilloried for it. They should be shown the same respect for their views as those who still choose to financially support the club.'"
Fair post. Of course everyone is entitled to thier opinion and may chose to do what they please with thier hard earned cash. The problem arises when thier opinion is constantly pushed down other peoples throats and then respond by pilloring others for thier own opposite opinions, if that makes sense.
Not a good comparison, I admit, when "He who shall not be named" at The Dark Side, was reportedly funding his club to the tune of £500,000 a year, supposedly, then went on to say "unless we can attract alternative investment, I am genuinely thinking of leaving" there was no resultant hoohah, the same as we are experiencing????????????????
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| Quote ="Armavinit"Fair post. Of course everyone is entitled to thier opinion and may chose to do what they please with thier hard earned cash. The problem arises when thier opinion is constantly pushed down other peoples throats and then respond by pilloring others for thier own opposite opinions, if that makes sense.
Not a good comparison, I admit, when "He who shall not be named" at The Dark Side, was reportedly funding his club to the tune of £500,000 a year, supposedly, then went on to say "unless we can attract alternative investment, I am genuinely thinking of leaving" there was no resultant hoohah, the same as we are experiencing????????????????'"
There was no Hoohah because we all realised the seriousness of him walking away. To be fair to Hudge he did have 'runs on the board' from where we where when he took over to where we where at the time of his statement and a lot more recent memories of the club being on the brink.
I'd say the worrying thing for FC is not just the renewal of passes but more the addition of x number of passes to break even to AP's satisfaction. Reading between the lines he cannot run the club with the finances equal to what they were this year, so that needs a step change in income going forward. What level of success would see this happen, top 4, GF appearance, cup final??. The 1st 2 will be extremely difficult to achieve a year after finishing so far off the pace, the last one is always possible but again is far from a certainty.
I'd say more worryingly for Pearson is even if you get a reasonable level of success (Top 6 and a decent super 8 performance) is will that be worth much more to him?
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| results bring in more supporters in more or less any sport, we start well and I think the support will start to come back, but we have to start well, imo with the players we have I think we can
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| Quote ="barham red"There was no Hoohah because we all realised the seriousness of him walking away. To be fair to Hudge he did have 'runs on the board' from where we where when he took over to where we where at the time of his statement and a lot more recent memories of the club being on the brink.
I'd say the worrying thing for FC is not just the renewal of passes but more the addition of x number of passes to break even to AP's satisfaction. Reading between the lines he cannot run the club with the finances equal to what they were this year, so that needs a step change in income going forward. What level of success would see this happen, top 4, GF appearance, cup final??. The 1st 2 will be extremely difficult to achieve a year after finishing so far off the pace, the last one is always possible but again is far from a certainty.
I'd say more worryingly for Pearson is even if you get a reasonable level of success (Top 6 and a decent super 8 performance) is will that be worth much more to him?'"
We're lead to believe that part of FC's tenancy agreement is that the SMC fund 3000 passes? Has this become a bone of contention between AP and the Allams? Can they rewrite the tenancy agreement , in light of what's happened with the Council's recent court case???????????????? Hence his push for pass sales?
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| Quote ="Armavinit"Fair post. Of course everyone is entitled to thier opinion and may chose to do what they please with thier hard earned cash. The problem arises when thier opinion is constantly pushed down other peoples throats and then respond by pilloring others for thier own opposite opinions, if that makes sense.
Not a good comparison, I admit, when "He who shall not be named" at The Dark Side, was reportedly funding his club to the tune of £500,000 a year, supposedly, then went on to say "unless we can attract alternative investment, I am genuinely thinking of leaving" there was no resultant hoohah, the same as we are experiencing????????????????'"
No comparison at all. Hudge did not blame the supporters. Did not try and blackmail them into buying passes. Saying the same thing each year. Pearson has annoyed many of your own supporters. Hudge merely said he did not want to continue paying out to the tune of £500,000 per year and was looking for further investment. How could he attract investment unless he said he needed it? Your club appears to be in a financial mess with falling sponsorship and attendances, information supplied by Pearson himself. Your response is to try and deflect attention from this mess by erroneously comparing the situation with a different scenario at another club. Well done, it must make you feel a lot better trying to show that KR is in the same financial mess as FC.
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| Quote ="Keiththered"No comparison at all. Hudge did not blame the supporters. Did not try and blackmail them into buying passes. Saying the same thing each year. Pearson has annoyed many of your own supporters. Hugge merely said he did not want to continue paying out to the tune of £500,000 per year and was looking for further investment. How could he attract investment unless he said he needed it? Your club appears to be in a financial mess with falling sponsorship and attendances, information supplied by Pearson himself. Your response is to try and deflect attention from this mess by erroneously comparing the situation with a different scenario at another club. Well done, it must make you feel a lot better trying to show that KR is in the same financial mess as FC.'"
Read the post, I wrote "not a good comparison, I admit". I'm not trying to deflect anything onto anyone. Hate to admit it but I'm a secret admirer of "He who shall not be named" for his dedication and support of his team. We could do with a few like minded sponsors at FC. We've got enough knee jerk responders of our own on this board, without you chiming in. Sorry for any offence caused.
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