I have to say what an absolute load of tosh this thread is with a lot of people discussing things they know nothing about.
All we need are the torches and pitchforks.
This is being blown so out of proportion I think people are losing sight of the facts.
What he has done supposedly, is stupid. It's not worth sacking imo but I suppose it suits a lot of peoples' agendas this way.
And before the obvious posts, no I'm not Gareth, a relative or friend just someone who is keeping a level head and more interested in the club as a whole and what best suits them.

That's right. There are now so many things that are illegal its possible for ordinary people and employers to break the law without intending to or even knowing they were doing it.

However when the government or a politician or the local council or the police do it there is always some excuse that makes it ok.

No - and such people have the right to go to court if they choose to.

What I'm saying is we need to stay away from a situation where the police/government investigate the offence AND decide on guilt or innocence AND decide on the sentence, or we are heading for a totalitarian state.

Spot on. But she will keep hanging on until the last.

When I fought the law , the law won.

Unfortunately this bunch of misfits have managed to introduce 3,000 extra offences in their twelve years in power - that's two for every day that Parliament has sat. Most have been the result of dog-whistle politics and pandering to newspaper editors who claim to represent middul ingerland.

The latest one "Independent Vetting & Barring" starts from the premise that evryone is a potential child molester. It wouldn't be too bad if it was called "Independent Vetting & Accepting", at least that way there would still be the presumption of innocence.

For any laws to be workable, they should be simple to understand and transparent to administer fairly, without prejudice or favor. Only that way can all realise that an action (or failure to act) can be unlawful and only then can everyone have no complaint if they're caught bang to rights

I think you've hit the nail on the head. Politicians, of all parties, are social misfits. It's hard to identify more than a handful (of the high profile ones certainly) that you can imagine having a pint with and a Joe-Public-type-conversation. They are so detached as well because of the rules that we have to follow that they don't. For years they have protected pipe-tobacco from rises in taxation that would be in line with other tobacco, they put alcohol duty up and have their own "duty-free" bar in the commons, they keep ram-raiding private pensions but have their own final salary pension that protects them, they have a "parachute payment" in case they're voted out but it's way above the statutory payment that we might receive for redundancy, they don't have to worry about stamp duty - particularly on a second home whereas we're not allowed similar assistance with second homes - they chose politics - I and many others place of work is where the customer is but there are no... perhaps I ought to stop there, this horse is getting a bit too high...I'm getting a nose bleed.