FORUMS > Wakefield Trinity > Conditioner |
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| Quote: RebelRebel "This was immediately after the season with Adam Trypass, wasn't it? When the players went in exactly the opposite direction, bulking up and becoming as mobile as an oil tanker. It must be pretty complex, trying to find that ideal balance for a particular kind of sport, and then maintaining it.'"
It must be. But other teams seem to able to do it.Or is it that our players would rather start the day off with a fry up at the Donny rd sarnie shop then train a couple of hours and then finish the day off at Nando's with a bite to eat and a drink.
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| Quote: RebelRebel "This was immediately after the season with Adam Trypass, wasn't it? When the players went in exactly the opposite direction, bulking up and becoming as mobile as an oil tanker. It must be pretty complex, trying to find that ideal balance for a particular kind of sport, and then maintaining it.'"
Season after, Evans was McNallys 2004 conditioner and yet another person taken from us by the never had an original idea themselves Giants. Trypass followed and was very poor.
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| Quote: vastman "Season after, Evans was McNallys 2004 conditioner and yet another person taken from us by the never had an original idea themselves Giants. Trypass followed and was very poor.'"
Our conditioning appeared excellent in 2004 we were finishing games very strongly but again we had a good team and didn't spend all our time defending so you have to factor that in as has you mentioned earlier
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46136_1705770219.jpg M.I.B. ??....nope - M.I.R.W.B !!!
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| Quote: The Clan "Without giving too much info about my personal background..Ive always had a passion for and the ambition to follow Andrew, Neil and Paul into coaching but as a single dad of four for the last 14 years its been impossible to do.
I'm now studying physical education with a particular interest in Motor Skill Aquisition, Motor Skill Development and Biomechanics.] My hope is to go into teaching but to also take up a coaching role somewhere at any level whether its U7s amateurs or assissting at a pro club somewhere.
I don't know if I'll be any good at it but you don't know until you try!
Without contradicting what I just wrote above... NO!'"
You could try Harratts or Polar Ford .....
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| who was the fella that got solomona even fatter? chuffing genius he was.
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| Quote: fat faced fan "who was the fella that got solomona even fatter? chuffing genius he was.'"
Adam Trypass
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| Quote: vastman "Mopsey has made two good points within a week which beggars belief but there you go.
He noted on another thread that many of our young players have failed to develop physically in a way they seem to at other clubs. They remain either painfully under developed like Davey or carry to much puppy fat. I pick on Davey in particular because he IMO is mentally ready for SL but is still a million miles away physically. Yet it's three years since he made his debut in a pre season and made his first team debut last year. I know some player remain relatively slight like Roby and that's not a bad thing but he still looks like a man all be it a business man. I also know there is a limit to what muscular developments some people bodies can manage but looking at Davey I cannot believe that is anywhere near his peak.
So the question is what exactly to we do or more to the point not do with these young players. I think a new conditioning regime is very much in order.
Just thinking outside the box, I'm told that some of the best and most radical up and coming conditioners/trainers are currently being produced by American College Football. Currently there are nowhere near enough places for them in the states. Might be worth a look, with minor modification both sports require very similar athletes. Also the American can do mentality would not go a miss at BV either.'"
It was Beanz that recommended Colin Sancturay after working with him part time at York.
I have long since been a critic of him after being involved in that set up.
In relation to American College football these guys are probably the best in the business, but the wages they are on even the up and coming ones are astronomical, way more than most long established conditioning coaches in rugby league.
I think you would find it nigh on impossible to get someone to come across that was any quality or even had potential quality for the wages on offer at most if not all SL clubs.
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| Quote: Khlav Kalash "This subject came up a few weeks ago.
Apparently Sanctuary’s philosophy has the players lean and mobile which, in jonh’s words, originally went down well with the players. They took to his methods and it appeared from the evidence in 2009 season they were rewarded. Unfortunately the methods haven’t progressed and the players, particularly the youngsters, were becoming disillusioned with Sanctuary’s policy and wanted to beef up a lot more. The see their peers at other clubs and, as you have pointed out, they feel small in stature. I’ve read they no longer were fully committed to Sanctuary’s methods and perhaps the results have shown.
I’ll admit this is a subject beyond my comprehension and I don’t know which is the right or wrong way on how to condition RL players, However, one thing I have always thought is a team that’s wining looks fitter than a team that’s losing purely down to the amount of defensive work the losing side has to get through. In 2009 Trinity were on fire and were finishing games, and the season, strongly. Fitness was never an issue.
Again, at the start of the 2010 season the clubs first few games continued in the same vein and the players looked in tip top condition. The drastic change in how the player’s fitness appears to have nosedived seems to have coincided with the drastic change in performances of the team. For the last 14 or so months the club have more often than not being on the back foot and the players have subsequently suffered because of this.
As an aside, the fittest I’ve ever seen a Trinity side was when Geoff Evans was the conditioner.'"
The main reason I left was because of the conditioning philosophy especially with the younger players with which I was involved.
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| Quote: jonh "It was Beanz that recommended Colin Sancturay after working with him part time at York.
I have long since been a critic of him after being involved in that set up.
In relation to American College football these guys are probably the best in the business, but the wages they are on even the up and coming ones are astronomical, way more than most long established conditioning coaches in rugby league.
I think you would find it nigh on impossible to get someone to come across that was any quality or even had potential quality for the wages on offer at most if not all SL clubs.'"
Not if they can't find a job, also some may wish to travel. I don't reckon it's as difficult as you imagine and with a little effort and starting at a base level. Wages in the States are not as high as some would imagine things are just cheaper. Even some high schools in the States have better people than most SL clubs and I suspect we can compete on wages. We are not talking NFL or even top level Varsity here, let's be realistic.
I know you reckon you know your stuff but I don't reckon you know the going rate for these people. I only know because I watch Fox News for a laugh and it was one of their stories.
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| Quote: vastman "Not if they can't find a job, also some may wish to travel. I don't reckon it's as difficult as you imagine and with a little effort and starting at a base level. Wages in the States are not as high as some would imagine things are just cheaper. Even some high schools in the States have better people than most SL clubs and I suspect we can compete on wages. We are not talking NFL or even top level Varsity here, let's be realistic.
I know you reckon you know your stuff but I don't reckon you know the going rate for these people. I only know because I watch Fox News for a laugh and it was one of their stories.'"
In America the top collegiate guys earn a fortune and even the normal college guys get a massive salary, you must appreciate that even the lesser known colleges attract huge audiences far in excess of most pro sports apart from football in the uk.
There are also so many more jobs in the USA in this field, all colleges, schools, gyms and sports clubs employ conditioning coaches and the chances are anyone's that could be available are probably available because they have not cut the mustard.
I concentrated much of my research around NFL the books available are excellent and plentiful, and I feel that whilst these guys are top class at what they do, they are extremely specialist. They produce the perfect athletes functionally for the sport, but they condition purely anaerobic activity as that is all the sport requires. I think they would struggle with the details of conditioning athletes who require a blend of both anaerobic and aerobic conditioning.
I feel you would be better looking for someone from a track and field back ground as they have to generally work with a wider range of athletes requiring all aspects of different physical traits.
All conditioning has to be functional and if you cannot grasp every aspect of the game you are never going to get the best out of your players or prepare them for performance.
The AIS is a far more viable target for conditioning coaches though given they will know the game inside out and much of what they do will be influenced by the biggest sport in the country Rugby League. The British network is also improving with centres of excellence such as those in Sheffield, Manchester, Birmingham etc etc with the EIS.
Lets not forget you have had a conditioning coach with a doctorate in Sport and Exercise science, but his failure to grasp the basic concepts of the game has in my opinion cost the club dear.
Conditioning coaches probably spend more time with the players than any other coach. You need to recruit a guy who the players can relate to as all the knowledge in the world is good for nothing if you cannot actually coach.
Rugby Union has a far better network of up and coming conditioning coaches and learning/development pathways. Any club with limited funds to spend in this area may do very well to target a few of the guys in this development pathway who are hungry for an opportunity and have a grasp of the demands of the game.
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| Without shampoo, there can be no condintioner....
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| Quote: jonh "<snip>'"
To a layman like myself, that looks a pretty convincing argument. I suppose you could argue that Trypass was more the NFL type of conditioner, bulking up players for a 60 minute game spread over something like 4 hours, whereas Sanctuary focuses more on the 2 x 40 minute duration without taking the impact into account as much. I know this is a crass generalisation, but hey. When you also take into account the fact that different positions require different conditioning, you begin to realise what a complex subject this is.
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| I think it's likelly that Beans and Col will go at the end of the season, but i think we just have to be a little bit fair and say that the players they are coaching are to be blunt mainly c\\**p, these were the same crew who coached us to our hghest ever SL points score when they worked with players who had talent.
Ultimately our league position is down to the players we recruited being not good enough on any level.
I agree with JK and that freshening things up after five years is a good idea. I've also heard that the players are sick of being beasted.....but then again some of them deserve it.
re the Younger players...dare i say it some of them need an attitude adjustment if they are to make it in super league and get the graft done and to live like professionals away from Belle Vue. Re bulking them up, that would be the opposite of the trend in the NRL
i'm always surprised at how little those guys weigh, but yet retaining the power...
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| Quote: Big Cat "I think it's likelly that Beans and Col will go at the end of the season, but i think we just have to be a little bit fair and say that the players they are coaching are to be blunt mainly c\\**p, these were the same crew who coached us to our hghest ever SL points score when they worked with players who had talent.
Ultimately our league position is down to the players we recruited being not good enough on any level.
I agree with JK and that freshening things up after five years is a good idea. I've also heard that the players are sick of being beasted.....but then again some of them deserve it.
re the Younger players...dare i say it some of them need an attitude adjustment if they are to make it in super league and get the graft done and to live like professionals away from Belle Vue. Re bulking them up, that would be the opposite of the trend in the NRL
i'm always surprised at how little those guys weigh, but yet retaining the power...'"
In relation to the NRL I think the small and lean has kind of passed. If you look at the size of the NRL players, especially the backs in comparison to our guys they are far larger and athletic.
In very basic terms the larger the muscle the more strength and hence if converted correctly the more power it can produce. Get the balance of size and endurance right, ie work out how to get the guys big yet able to do the minutes whilst improving agility (a bi-product of power) and maintaining flexibility, then you will always be a success in rugby league from a conditioning point of view. Its obviously a very complex process and far easier said than done.
One thing is for sure you can never ever take your eye off the game and the style of player you are working with. Functionality is the key to producing a successful athlete regardless of the sport. They MUST be built to do the job they are put on the field to do.
Colin very much subscribes to the smaller and powerful but in todays game I do not think this is the way to go.
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