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| Quote ="jonh"Mossop is a secondrow who will become a Prop. Coley can cover second row if needed.
In your opinion Bailey should be gone next year fair enough and prior to Hock's ban i agreed with you, but again you cannot expect to win the forwards battle with an inexperienced lightweight backrow, given we have such a lightweight frontrow.
As usual I find myself going round in circles whenever you 2 get your heads together, and to be honest i have not the time for it, so feel free to crack on, until I see something that takes the debate forward there is no point in continuing with posting on this topic.'"
No one at the Wigan club has said anything about Mossop moving to prop.
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| Quote ="jonh"Mossop is a secondrow who will become a Prop. Coley can cover second row if needed.
In your opinion Bailey should be gone next year fair enough and prior to Hock's ban i agreed with you, but again you cannot expect to win the forwards battle with an inexperienced lightweight backrow, given we have such a lightweight frontrow.
As usual I find myself going round in circles whenever you 2 get your heads together, and to be honest i have not the time for it, so feel free to crack on, until I see something that takes the debate forward there is no point in continuing with posting on this topic.'"
Nice of you to even give us the time you have given us so far.
However, in future, please feel free to ignore my posts altogether.
Thanks.
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| Quote ="Last Son of Wigan"Jonh, please don't rate yourself so highly, that is your problem, no one is getting worked up over anything you say, infact it's the exact opposite, hence why I reassured Jack that you are a pr@tt who likes to argue, thats all you are in all honesty.
Once again you've got it wrong, I have totally no issue with someone disagreeing with me, everyone is entitled to an opinion, it would be a boring forum without discussion! But it's your manner and the way you suddenly become condersending with your attitude to people on he who disagree with your points, I read some of your replies to Jack, same condersending belittling replies you always try to us when someone disgrees.
Relax Jonh and realise, this is only a discussion board.'"
I think you are confusing condecsending with opinion backed up by why i hold this opinion, nothing more nothing less.
To accused of calling people names and then twice in the same thread to be called a pratt by the same posted making the accusation does make me wonder about you.
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| Quote ="Last Son of Wigan"No one at the Wigan club has said anything about Mossop moving to prop.'"
Who said they did?
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| Quote ="jonh"Who said they did?'"
In nearly ever post you mention how Mossop will be a prop in the future. I thought you backed up your opinion with facts?
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| Quote ="jonh"I think you are confusing condecsending with opinion backed up by why i hold this opinion, nothing more nothing less.
To accused of calling people names and then twice in the same thread to be called a pratt by the same posted making the accusation does make me wonder about you.'"
I called you a pratt because of the names and manner you attack people. If you didn't then I wouldn't. Simple really.
At times Jonh you post some solid posts which make sense, your issue seems to be when people disagree with you. What a meal you made of my opinon of wanting to sign Long on a 2yr deal, that was my opinion. P.S I think we would have beaten Wire if Long with at 7 to Sam at 6 in the semi, another one of my opinions.
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| Quote ="Last Son of Wigan"In nearly ever post you mention how Mossop will be a prop in the future. I thought you backed up your opinion with facts?'"
It is my opinion he will end up as a Prop, time will tell. If you could back an opinion up with 100% facts, it would cease to be an opinion and become a fact.
I say this as i think he is ultimately his build and style is better suited to Prop, also given he has significant game time at Reserve level as a Prop it would indicate that it is a distinct possibility.
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| Quote ="Last Son of Wigan"I called you a pratt because of the names and manner you attack people. If you didn't then I wouldn't. Simple really.
At times Jonh you post some solid posts which make sense, your issue seems to be when people disagree with you. What a meal you made of my opinon of wanting to sign Long on a 2yr deal, that was my opinion. P.S I think we would have beaten Wire if Long with at 7 to Sam at 6 in the semi, another one of my opinions.'"
Where have i attacked anyone?
You accuse me of calling people names again where?
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| Quote ="jonh"It is my opinion he will end up as a Prop, time will tell. If you could back an opinion up with 100% facts, it would cease to be an opinion and become a fact.
I say this as i think he is ultimately his build and style is better suited to Prop, also given he has significant game time at Reserve level as a Prop it would indicate that it is a distinct possibility.'"
You clearly wrote how Mossop 'will be a prop' that statement is not a matter of option but a factual comment.
An option doesn't become a fact if backed up by facts Jonh, for example, someone may say Tomkins is a better SR than Bailey then back up their comment with stats facts, then someone will counter that comment with other stat facts to prove Bailey is a better SR, hence a debate.
Follow?
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| Quote ="Last Son of Wigan"You clearly wrote how Mossop 'will be a prop' that statement is not a matter of option but a factual comment.
An option doesn't become a fact if backed up by facts Jonh, for example, someone may say Tomkins is a better SR than Bailey then back up their comment with stats facts, then someone will counter that comment with other stat facts to prove Bailey is a better SR, hence a debate.
Follow?'"
Hence you do not have 100% facts and that is why it remains an opinion.
I do think Mossop will be a prop, i am unsure where the confusion lies.
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| Quote ="jonh"You are entitled to your opinion which is fine, i am honestly board of your cameo appearances on here slating everyone else's opinion and then vanishing for another few months.
What position would you play him next year? Locky has been the form loose this year in the comp and is going nowhere.
Given our current deficiencies up front we need some size and go forward in our backrow, both Mossop and Farrell give us this certainly over what Flannigan can. Nobody is faulting Flanigan's contribution thus far but is he has played only a few games his workrate is fantastic but given his size and stage of development can we expect this from him week in week out throughout a regular season, in my opinion no.
Having spoken about reserve players with reserve players Farrell is always mentioned as an opponent that they do not like to play against and is held in very high regard by his fellow reserve standard players Flanigan i dont think ever in these talks get a mention.
I do not for one second think he is a bad player, but our pack clearly lacks go forward, for the balance of the team i feel the above players mentioned offer the team more at this moment in time than Flanigan does. if we had a pack able to dominate teams i am sure he would be worth a spot much like the Wilkin role at Saints, i see him very much as that kind of player. The fact is we have very little go forward and a front row that fails to dominate there opponents apart from a 3 or 4 week spell every year.
Flanigan will be able to enhance his handling skills and his conditioning in an environment much more suited to improving this. In a couple of year he should return a better player and hopefully once we have the likes of Fielden off our hands and Prescott with another few years development a team of props capable of consistently competing and winning the battle upfront.
Until we are in a position to field a team of Props capable of this the last thing we need is a lightweight backrow.
Who mentioned anything about brining in bog standard Aussies by the way? I am starting to think you have an obsession with them, all the promotion for the backrow should and does look to be coming from within the club.'"
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| Quote ="Last Son of Wigan"'"
?
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| Quote ="jonh"Hence you do not have 100% facts and that is why it remains an opinion.
I do think Mossop will be a prop, i am unsure where the confusion lies.'"
Where are your facts that Mossop will be a prop? its a call without anything to back it up!
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| Quote ="Last Son of Wigan"Where are your facts that Mossop will be a prop? its a call without anything to back it up!'"
The fact that he has spent significant game time in the reserves playing Prop, and also in my opinion he has the game more suited to Prop yet needs time to bed in, in the secondrow, I have mentioned it several times in this thread alone.
This is not a fact it is opinion, held by me.
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| It looks to me like Jack Kerley has had his usual effect. Cause other people to get into arguments, while he slinks off.
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| He could start an argument at a peace rally.
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| Quote ="Cruncher"It looks to me like Jack Kerley has had his usual effect. Cause other people to get into arguments, while he slinks off.'"
Precious as usual, eh?
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| Quote ="Jack Kerley"Precious as usual, eh?
'"
Give over with the innocent act.
I’ve seen your method up close. You subtly provoke people by calling their opinions ‘tripe’ or whatever, at the same time ignoring any reasoned argument they may present to support their view. When they get annoyed, you respond by making fun of them, accusing them of name-calling, etc. Then a lackey will appear (at one time it would be Charlie Seeling, but I guess anyone will do). He’ll take over the argument and you disappear.
To make sure I don’t fall into a similar trap, and having made my point, I’m vacating this thread. See you in a few weeks, no doubt.
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| Quote ="Cruncher"Give over with the innocent act.
I’ve seen your method up close. You subtly provoke people by calling their opinions ‘tripe’ or whatever, at the same time ignoring any reasoned argument they may present to support their view. When they get annoyed, you respond by making fun of them, accusing them of name-calling, etc. Then a lackey will appear (at one time it would be Charlie Seeling, but I guess anyone will do). He’ll take over the argument and you disappear.
To make sure I don’t fall into a similar trap, and having made my point, I’m vacating this thread. See you in a few weeks, no doubt.'"
I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about, but then again I never have had.
Who is Charlie Seeling.
Paranoia is an illness, for which you can get treatment.
Please use your time away from this thread effectively, by nipping down to the doctors for a check up.
You're welcome.
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| Who WAS Charlie Seeling or CP Wigan. 
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| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"Who WAS Charlie Seeling or CP Wigan.
'"
I don't know but im sure he will be back soon.
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| i think we're the only team to lose players because their partners want to go to Oz. we're far to nice!
At the min i would be selfish and keep hold of him. He's one of our best prospects and we let him go. There is no knowing whether he'll come back a better player, he may just end up playing reserves, getting injured etc. At the moment he's playing well, cermenting a place in the first team so why change something thats not broken.
Maybe the players who are slightly younger and that aren't needed in the next year or so. Not someone who's 22 and becoming a first team regular.
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| Jonh, I agree with everything you have said thus far on this thread.
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| I didn't quite get what the big problem was with jonh saying Mossop will be used as a prop mainly during his Wigan career.
I'd agree with that assesment due to 2 things- firstly his build and secondly due to us having a lackof top quality front rowers and a shed load of backrowers.
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| Quote ="Cruncher"Give over with the innocent act.
I’ve seen your method up close. You subtly provoke people by calling their opinions ‘tripe’ or whatever, at the same time ignoring any reasoned argument they may present to support their view. When they get annoyed, you respond by making fun of them, accusing them of name-calling, etc. Then a lackey will appear (at one time it would be Charlie Seeling, but I guess anyone will do). He’ll take over the argument and you disappear.
To make sure I don’t fall into a similar trap, and having made my point, I’m vacating this thread. See you in a few weeks, no doubt.'"
 I'm sick of the derailings so people can have arguments on pointless technicalities. Although I'm a bit worried that they genuinley believe that they have not done anything wrong, when in fact they are using aggresive language, but are quick to point out anything on the other side. However, I am disapointed in John for feeding the trolls 
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