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which he feels should include "Newcastle and Wales and two overseas teams, mostly likely from France".

The man is an utter genius.............

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No reserves,but resilience,persistence and determination are omnipotent.:



Quote: Donnyman "https[i "to have a 10-team competition based on the needs of television",[/i which he feels should include "Newcastle and Wales and two overseas teams, mostly likely from France".

The man is an utter genius.............'"


Since when have you suggested/agreed with 2 French clubs.

How about a link with the ideas of chairman Lenagan - or was this just another time when he had a private conversation with you?

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He was a good CEO at Hull so im always open to listen to his ideas. He is definitely right that SL needs an independent board not just chairmen voting to suit themselves and he is right that we face extinction the way things are going.

10 teams is too small, but I'd agree with his suggestions of Newcastle as it is a large City with a good Rugby ground and there are definitely green shoots of interest up there. I also think we gave up on Wrexham too quickly, North Wales can be seen as an extension to the heartlands and there isn't much sport in competition up there. We also badly need a Cumbrian team, create a merged one and get on with it. Id also bring Bradford back.

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Instead of creating a wish list of teams I'd like to see in SL, I thought I'd do one of what teams are underperforming and dragging SL down.

Huddersfield - rich RL fanatic owner, great stadium, birthplace of the game but despite cheap season tickets and success on the field earlier in the decade the crowds stubbornly refuse to increase, the Town isn't interested.

Salford - loyal fan base, an unexpected Grand Final and CC final (but that burst of success seems to be over) decent stadium but poorly located and that has hit crowds, Salford as a City is in the shadow of Manchester and limits the appeal.

Wakefield - again a loyal fan base and always punch above their weight on the field with the budget...but how many decades have to go by where we are promised a new stadium or ground improvements and nothing happens?

Cas - same as Wakefield above but a smaller town where even with a new ground there would be a natural limit to crowds

HullKR - of course I am biased here...but loyal fan base, to their credit ground has been gradually improved and they help create at least 2 good attendances a year with the Derby, but East Hull is geographically isolated so again there's a natural limit to how big their crowds can go. 2 teams in one isolated City isn't ideal either.

For balance the other clubs aren't running a perfect ship: Wigan's crowd decline this decade doesn't get highlighted enough, constant success and a team filled with local youngsters but the crowds are staying away?? Hull have serious issues with their stadium deal. Really there's only Leeds, Saints, Warrington and Catalan in a good place with rich owners, their own ground and good fan bases.

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Places in a league should be based on performances on the field that indicates the health and status of a club finance and followers go along with this.Just picking out a city an saying it could be a rugby league city has been proved not to work. We seem to constantly knock heartland clubs who compete and bring through players year on year. We just seem to be looking for sticking plaster solutions. In the face of a pandemic we need to just get fans back through the gates as soon as we are allowed and give them a great match day experience. If Newcastle are to be a SL team it will happen with time.Bigger question than new locations should be focusing on getting fans back through the gates at existing clubs. Debate is do we stick with set up or go 10 and 10 or 14 SL clubs thus makes the poss of Toulouse or Newcastle getting in SL greater.

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Quote: Leyther14 "Places in a league should be based on performances on the field that indicates the health and status of a club finance and followers go along with this.Just picking out a city an saying it could be a rugby league city has been proved not to work. We seem to constantly knock heartland clubs who compete and bring through players year on year. We just seem to be looking for sticking plaster solutions. In the face of a pandemic we need to just get fans back through the gates as soon as we are allowed and give them a great match day experience. If Newcastle are to be a SL team it will happen with time.Bigger question than new locations should be focusing on getting fans back through the gates at existing clubs. Debate is do we stick with set up or go 10 and 10 or 14 SL clubs thus makes the poss of Toulouse or Newcastle getting in SL greater.'"


Two leagues of 10 could work but the big factor is are SKY up for showing 1 game a week from SL2? If the gap in funds is reduced between the two leagues teams yo-yoing about between the two leagues wouldent be as bad, at the moment it is too boom or bust.

As things stand two leagues of 10 looks competitive and has a good geographical spread. Arguments could be made to include Newcastle and Barrow in SL2 due to the potential and on field performances respectively.

Catalans
Saints
Wigan
Warrington
HullFC
HullKR
Cas
Leeds
Wakefield
Toulouse

Huddersfield
Salford
Leigh
Fev
Batley
Bradford
London
Halifax
Widnes
York

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You could easily have 2 leagues of 10 full time should it appeal to the broadcasters. Have a third league set up but they must hit certain criteria to be eligible to move to SL2. Play each other twice with one magic round each, could cover the loss of home games by intoducing a group stage in the challenge cup.

The game for far too long has year by year watered down the top games to the point even the local derbies dont sell out due to being over used. Less is more and all that. Would give clubs a proper pre season to improve players which puts a better product on the field. Overburn and same old fixtures have contributed to many walking away from the sport IMO.

The trouble is we have changed our structure and got it wrong far too often for people to even take our game seriousley. Put something in place and let it grow.

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Quote: pmarrow "You could easily have 2 leagues of 10 full time should it appeal to the broadcasters. Have a third league set up but they must hit certain criteria to be eligible to move to SL2. Play each other twice with one magic round each, could cover the loss of home games by intoducing a group stage in the challenge cup.

The game for far too long has year by year watered down the top games to the point even the local derbies dont sell out due to being over used. Less is more and all that. Would give clubs a proper pre season to improve players which puts a better product on the field. Overburn and same old fixtures have contributed to many walking away from the sport IMO.

The trouble is we have changed our structure and got it wrong far too often for people to even take our game seriousley. Put something in place and let it grow.'"


Completely agree, they have overused Derby games and fixtures such as Wigan-Warrington. Two games against each team plus a Magic weekend is about right. The rest of the calander to be filled with a proper international schedule. I also thought a later start to the season worked well this year, better weather and fans not as skint as they are straight after Xmas.

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Quote: UllFC "For balance the other clubs aren't running a perfect ship their own ground and good fan bases]'"

Not so sure Catalans own their own ground, hence the council swimming baths, was assured over there that the mayor of Perpignan who was also the chairman of the RU club that they built the baths to stop the dragons ever having a better ground than them, believe what you will there, as for the rhinos, with the money they borrowed for ground improvements I think it will be a long time before they actually own their half of the ground, other than that I don't think your far off.

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Quote: pmarrow "

The game for far too long has year by year watered down the top games to the point even the local derbies dont sell out due to being over used. Less is more and all that. Would give clubs a proper pre season to improve players which puts a better product on the field. Overburn and same old fixtures have contributed to many walking away from the sport IMO.

'"


Do they" walk away" or do they just watch the third fixture on SKY Television? This being he point, the structure has to maximise the appeal to TV viewers?

Does showing a third Wigan.v.Saints fixture pull in more TV viewers than a first showing of Featherstone.v.Toulouse.......

SKY want bums on TV seats.....

The less you deliver SKY the less clubs we can support as professional outfits?

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Its too late now. The game will be semi pro in 5 years.

You only need to look at the cost cutting going on at St Helens and Wigan as evidence of that. Both clubs are preparing for it

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The big point in his article is "fixing" the current situation in a 2 year time frame (before the next TV deal).
The game is on it's booty and he's certainly right about the "International" debacle on Friday.

RL is run so very, very badly and it certainly needs to get a grip of itself.

To "save" the sport, I would go for a return to "franchising", which should at least protect super league.
However, the rest of the sport is in serious peril, right down to community clubs and RL in schools - worrying times.

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Quote: Poky "Its too late now. The game will be semi pro in 5 years.

You only need to look at the cost cutting going on at St Helens and Wigan as evidence of that. Both clubs are preparing for it'"


Do you think that the cost cutting is more to do with having their income slashed over the last 18 months ??
For clubs who would usually attract 15,000 fans to their games, who would buy, merchandise, foo / drink, lottery tickets etc, etc, to then have 4000 fans rolling up and not to be able to sell drinks and restricted opportunities to sell merchandise.
It's not difficult to see why they and every other club, are having to cut costs.
IF we can get back to meaningful crowds etc, things will begin to turn, in the short term.

However, the games failings go back to long before covid, it's just that there are now laid bare for all to see.
The mis season "test" was just one example of the mickey mouse administration that runs our sport.

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Quote: wrencat1873 "The big point in his article is "fixing" the current situation in a 2 year time frame (before the next TV deal).
The game is on it's booty and he's certainly right about the "International" debacle on Friday.

RL is run so very, very badly and it certainly needs to get a grip of itself.

To "save" the sport, I would go for a return to "franchising", which should at least protect super league.
However, the rest of the sport is in serious peril, right down to community clubs and RL in schools - worrying times.'"


The just protect Super League attitude is not good enough without the championship and community clubs and academies the whole sport will decline through lack of participation. We need a whole game plan. Not a just looking after the SL clubs.

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Quote: wrencat1873 "Do you think that the cost cutting is more to do with having their income slashed over the last 18 months ??
For clubs who would usually attract 15,000 fans to their games, who would buy, merchandise, foo / drink, lottery tickets etc, etc, to then have 4000 fans rolling up and not to be able to sell drinks and restricted opportunities to sell merchandise.
It's not difficult to see why they and every other club, are having to cut costs.
IF we can get back to meaningful crowds etc, things will begin to turn, in the short term.

However, the games failings go back to long before covid, it's just that there are now laid bare for all to see.
The mis season "test" was just one example of the mickey mouse administration that runs our sport.'"


You are correct that clubs have lost a lot of additional spending with games behind closed doors, a lot of merchandise sales are stuff like scarves that people only buy to wear at games in cold weather, then vests in summer etc. You can only do so much marketing to sell these online.

And yes Covid has just exposed long running problems in the game, its been mismanaged for at least a decade. We've gone from giving away the title sponsorship for free, to constantly changing the format, to hyping Toronto up then cutting them off...loyal fans of the game are fed up.

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