FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > Cas fined £40k |
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| Quote: Dettoriman "The whole situation is an absolute Joke, from top to bottom.
I know a few of the lads involved And i know they have now been Banned from the ground, As a result of the fine, First of all, if Castleford Tigers had thrown them out and banned them on the day, We couldnt have been fined at all, So to wait 10 weeks, Then ban them is just stupid, The damage was already done
As for the fine, How can it be imposed when a match commissioner, There to listen out for such chants, Didnt include anything in his Report, There was only 1 registered complaint, And hardly anyone in the ground heard it. The club when made aware played the Respect message over the tannoy
More to the point, These werent thoughtful chants, It was probably just something that came to the lads minds, Who sang before they thought about it As a joke, To put an International player off his game, Nothing else
I know Castleford have been advised to seek Legal action as they can tie the RFL up in knots and claim compensation for our name been dragged through the mud, Unfortnately, Richard Wright darent do this'"
Again, would you have said the same if this had been Martin Offiah getting racist abuse?
What did Cas wait 10 weeks to ban the perpetrators?
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| Quote: gary numan "No it's not. You have a very narrow minded approach to this , focusing only on your chosen demagraphics. In time as your mind broadens you will come to realise that everybody deserves equal respect to do otherwise breeds resentment.'"
you see this is why it is a very superficial understanding of discrimination.
Whilst it may seem logical to 'treat every abuse the same' it is superficial in the respect that it ignores the deeper meanings and history behind certain forms of abuse. To give you the greatest credit would be to say that you have a very naive outlook towards it.
You seem unable to appreciate that there is, and is meant to be, different degrees of abuse expressed. You seem unable to see that words defined by the differing degrees of power they hold, hold differing degrees of power. Some words exist solely to cause offence. That is the reason they exist. Look in a dictionary, some words are mildly offensive, some offensive and some extremely offensive. Extremely offensive words exist solely to cause extreme offence, and they are used purely in relation to their extreme offence.
Attitudes are similar some are hatefilled, widely, dearly, held discriminatory attitudes, some arent.
Some attitudes have, in the not so distant past led to real persecution and discrimination, some havent.
It is ludicrous to pretend that anything that can be put into the broad brush label of 'discrimination' is exactly the same. It is naive and superficial
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| Quote: Dettoriman "
I know a few of the lads involved And i know they have now been Banned from the ground, As a result of the fine, First of all, if Castleford Tigers had thrown them out and banned them on the day, We couldnt have been fined at all, So to wait 10 weeks, Then ban them is just stupid, The damage was already done
'"
if Cas had identified them at the time, the club could could have banned them at the time - and as you say might have avoided the fine. As you knew them, what did you do to help the club achieve that?
Quote: Dettoriman "
I know Castleford have been advised to seek Legal action as they can tie the RFL up in knots and claim compensation for our name been dragged through the mud, Unfortnately, Richard Wright darent do this'"
Perhaps because he's had real legal advice, from an actual lawyer.
And perhaps because he, and his actually qualified legal adviser, recognise that the club's name wasn't dragged through the mud by the RFL but by the cromagnons - sorry 'lads' - who thought that homophobic abuse of a payer would be funny or in any way acceptable. And our name continues to be dragged through the mud by posters who excuse what they did, frankly, imo.
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| Quote: tb "if Cas had identified them at the time, the club could could have banned them at the time - and as you say might have avoided the fine. As you knew them, what did you do to help the club achieve that?
'"
I didnt know them at the time mate, I was in the Railway end, In fact, I didnt know there was any chanting until a read it on the forum, it wasnt until a few weeks later that i found out which group it was who was singing it, But the club could have accessed the Dvd footage during the game, And banned them there and then
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| Quote: Dettoriman "I didnt know them at the time mate, I was in the Railway end, In fact, I didnt know there was any chanting until a read it on the forum, it wasnt until a few weeks later that i found out which group it was who was singing it, But the club could have accessed the Dvd footage during the game, And banned them there and then'"
The DVD footage doesn't focus on the crowd all game though does it - it focuses on the game, and even then, didn't Cas say it was inconclusive to hear the chants?
They weren't banned because no one thought it would go to and fine and therefore didn't do anything about it.
It was only until the fine appeared that someone told the club, named and shamed them and they got banned in a bid to help get the fine overturned.
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| Fair enough. But equally, anonymous faces on a DvD are anonymous faces on a DVD, until and unless you can name or identify them - I don't expect the club to know every member of the crowd by sight.
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| Quote: Fully "The DVD footage doesn't focus on the crowd all game though does it - it focuses on the game, and even then, didn't Cas say it was inconclusive to hear the chants?
They weren't banned because no one thought it would go to and fine and therefore didn't do anything about it.
It was only until the fine appeared that someone told the club, named and shamed them and they got banned in a bid to help get the fine overturned.'"
Well one of their mates the other day told me, One of the guys banned, Wasnt even at the game, Although he is part of that group. Apparently he didnt attend the match, Obviously Might not be 100% true
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| Quote: Dettoriman "Well one of their mates the other day told me, One of the guys banned, Wasnt even at the game, Although he is part of that group. Apparently he didnt attend the match, Obviously Might not be 100% true'"
He might have been the one that started with a steward at Salford then?
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| Quote: SmokeyTA "you see this is why it is a very superficial understanding of discrimination.
Whilst it may seem logical to 'treat every abuse the same' it is superficial in the respect that it ignores the deeper meanings and history behind certain forms of abuse. To give you the greatest credit would be to say that you have a very naive outlook towards it.
You seem unable to appreciate that there is, and is meant to be, different degrees of abuse expressed. You seem unable to see that words defined by the differing degrees of power they hold, hold differing degrees of power. Some words exist solely to cause offence. That is the reason they exist. Look in a dictionary, some words are mildly offensive, some offensive and some extremely offensive. Extremely offensive words exist solely to cause extreme offence, and they are used purely in relation to their extreme offence.
Attitudes are similar some are hatefilled, widely, dearly, held discriminatory attitudes, some arent.
Some attitudes have, in the not so distant past led to real persecution and discrimination, some havent.
It is ludicrous to pretend that anything that can be put into the broad brush label of 'discrimination' is exactly the same. It is naive and superficial'" Words are just that words, offence is what you attach to the word. What is offecive to some isn't to others. Just like it is deemed that some people can say a word and its acceptable that if somebody else used it it would cause outrage. If somebody was to scream into somebody else's face FAt BARSTEWARD!!!! would the recipient consider it not so bad because there isn't any history behind, I doubt it, i rather think they would feel many things , intimidated, offended etc... why should an incident like that be considered less because it doesn't fall into one of your protected subjects?
It seems to me that you are very much interested in shouting for just certain sections of society (are you a student/teenager?) over compensating when you should be looking to make sure EVERYBODY is treated equally. To do otherwise is devisive.
I won't be replying to many times on this subject as i can't see you seeing sense on this subject, but one day you will.
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| Quote: gary numan "Words are just that words, offence is what you attach to the word. What is offecive to some isn't to others. Just like it is deemed that some people can say a word and its acceptable that if somebody else used it it would cause outrage. If somebody was to scream into somebody else's face FAt BARSTEWARD!!!! would the recipient consider it not so bad because there isn't any history behind, I doubt it, i rather think they would feel many things , intimidated, offended etc... why should an incident like that be considered less because it doesn't fall into one of your protected subjects? '"
yes, yes they would. Anybody with an ounce of sense would understand the difference between you shouting fat barsteward at them, and you calling a black man a slave or a gay man a faggot.
They may feel intimidated, they may feel offended. But they would still understand the difference. Well anyone with an ounce of sense would, and that clearly doesnt cover everyone as we can see.
Quote: gary numan "
It seems to me that you are very much interested in shouting for just certain sections of society (are you a student/teenager?) over compensating when you should be looking to make sure EVERYBODY is treated equally. To do otherwise is devisive.
I won't be replying to many times on this subject as i can't see you seeing sense on this subject, but one day you will.
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| F**k me looks like the Castleford fans did'nt learn they lesson did they.They were at it again today with with loads of anti Thomas chants and racist chants towards wellar Huarki.Some of them even got chucked out of the ground before the game even started and what bad losers they are throwing pints of beer into the Crusaders fans when Crusaders scored the winning try.PS giving Thomas abuse dosent even bother me and this is the first time i have commented on the subject im just telling you what i seen and heard today
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| Quote: tarian crusader "F**k me looks like the Castleford fans did'nt learn they lesson did they.They were at it again today with with loads of anti Thomas chants and racist chants towards wellar Huarki.Some of them even got chucked out of the ground before the game even started and what bad losers they are throwing pints of beer into the Crusaders fans when Crusaders scored the winning try.PS giving Thomas abuse dosent even bother me and this is the first time i have commented on the subject im just telling you what i seen and heard today'"
Good one, how about the reports of the stewards attacking the Cas fans then?
Saying there was racist chanting is libel, and I will be showing this post to the CTSC/the club themselves and hope they take action against YOU personally for posting libellous and quite frankly disgusting comments, a complaint has been lodged to the RFL about the behaviour of your stewards being overzealous and attacking Cas fans and separating fans who were having a conversation with Crusaders fans.
As for the Thomas stuff, he brought it on himself, he was always going to get abuse at this game for being a media hungry little prat dragging a great clubs name through the dirt over 15 teenagers chanting NONE OFFENSIVE things HE DIDN'T EVEN HEAR.
Sounds like you're just trying to cause crap reporting on things that didn't happen, now jog on
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| What were they chanting then if you heard it?
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| Quote: Gaslight "What were they chanting then if you heard it?'"
I was at the end behind the sticks and to be honest I didnt hear any racist chanting from Castleford Fans But their chav element were singing "YMCA" and "where's your boyfriend gone" FACT
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