People seriously worried about games with no atmosphere?

They are going to get 10,000 a game, at least for their first season. Because they have been getting 7,000+ a game in the Championship. How many do Salford / London / Wakefield get for a home game - it's certainly nowhere near 10,000!

This is credible, sustainable expansion with a well supported club who started at the bottom, the usual argument against franchises being entirely artificial clubs in parts of the country with no love for the game starting life in the top flight.

There is a credible plan for a 2nd Canadian club in 2021 and, if that takes off, it wouldn't surprise me if we had New York shortly after.

Rugby League failed in any meaningful top flight expansion unit Catalan Dragons came along - I think Toronto could be the second success story.

They are also the World's only trans-Atlantic sports team, which has to count for something and will surely attract some publicity and sponsorship.

i meant and you obviously ignored games in England with no away support such as we already have with Catalan and London this year

Unless I’m mistaken there was no difference in their salary cap

Their away following by champ standards was not that bad to be honest - about 150 - 200 ish

3 teams will play toronto twice away with these silly loop fixtures, hopefully those teams will be chosen as the wolfpacks' on the road fixtures so each SL team and fans can visit toronto next season

I'll take a gamble here, that Catalan at home is much lower on your list of "go see" games, than it is to the top.
Even as a Trinity fan, I'd rather watch us play Huddersfield or Salford at home than Catalan and once the novelty wears off with Toronto, it will very likely be the same.
Let's not even go into the cost of trying to go to the away fixture.
I was lucky enough to see Trinity at every away game last season, although (luckily) I only managed one of the London, Wigan and Saints games but, Toronto can only be a one off.
Remembering that Ottowa are joining the League soon and although thet would help Toronto's position, just as Toulouse in the top flight may help Catalan (apart from them fighting over the same player pool), it will be a negative as far as both cost and "killing" another home fixture, plus the likely demise of another English club.
Is this really what we want for our sport ?

As for the "we've had 100 years" argument. This is just nonsense.
Throw in a couple of wars and the game almost being bankrupt in the late 80's/early 90's and you get a completely different slant on that argument.

Toronto have shown what can be done with decent marketing and promotion of the game and the one thing that we need to do is learn from that.

The infighting within the sport and lack of proper planning have been shocking over the years.

Grand final aside, our major events are badly planned and even more badly promoted.

Finally, can someone please disclose the "masterplan" for the sport and expansion, assuming that there is one


Most people seem to disregard anything before SL began, anyway

I would love to see what Toronto's sponsorship and commercial deals are like for next season? Would be interesting to see how they compare financially with the other clubs.

I would assume their own marketing department dwarfs the rest of SL.

A successful Toronto side will do more for the sport over 10 years than (yet another) northern team supported by one man and his dog.

I don't know how people can object to Toronto really.

Absolutely, over 8200 average this season despite been near the foot of the table for most of it.
Makes you wonder what the crowds might be if they can start to achieve some success.

Not at this stage. But they need to bring something. I don't care if that's any of
scintillating play (something the game lacks)
a trophy challenging side
big crowds,
Any of those will make the game more vibrant and justify their place.

How does Toronto's ground comply with the minimum standards for a super league ground as set by the RFL there is no cover from the elements for the spectators when you watch a game played there its like a beer festival with a constant stream of people continually walking in front of the crowd making there way to one of the numerous beer tents whilst the game is in progress.

Watching Toronto is like a beer festival?

Even more reason to go. None of this designated sporting grounds nonsense we have at places like the DW and KCOM where you are not allowed alcohol within sight of the playing area.

Statistically speaking it rains about 1 day a week in summer months. So the chances of getting soaked on a game day are, er, about 1/7.

No more or less than someone who has been following it for 55 seconds.

What? People are enjoying themselves? Lots of them? At a rugby league game?

This must be stopped.

plus also they was drink out of tins which wouldn't get passed over here

No they’re not. In the same way as Tomkins isn’t classed as overseas for Catalans.

Even if they are what does that matter for a new franchise? The alternative is that the money given to SL clubs from the TV is cut by 3/4’s and that money is spent on creating and growing a massive network of amateur clubs that grow into semi-pro and finally professional clubs in Canada.

Now if you’re happy for every SL club to give up £1.5m a year, every year for 40 years then that’s a potential alternative. However given the modern nature of media and people leisure habits I would say that’s much more risky than trying to engage people in Canada with a successful team that costs the game very little over here. In fact SL clubs will profit from having Toronto in the league.

So you agree there ground doesn't comply to the minimum standards set by the RFL

Seems I am one of the few who want to see them succeed, but I wouldn't go as far as saying they're sustainable, certainly not just yet.

Yea and I don't care. It will still be way better than a visit to Wakefield.

Me neither. Then again, I worry about the sustainability of plenty other clubs too.

even maintaining their current attendances would put them firmly in the mid table of superleague clubs, and many are new to RL, so they're already bringing something more to the game

It will be interesting to see how Canadians react to possibility/reality that they will lose much more home games next season, than in the previous 3 years. I am looking forward to this.....

So far Toronto has been a success.

The test will come when reality hits and mid-table mediocrity sets in or worse, relegation.

Some clubs can survive this, but not all can.
The distance is a challenge, not from a fan point of view. (many away attendances are so small now anyway). But from a player and club perspective. If Torontos additional also adds much needed finance to the game then clubs will bear the additional travel costs.

If after 2 years clubs are no better off in real terms, then you can see clubs having to call it a day travelling all thst way. You can't see Toronto bank rolling the entire leagues travel costs indefinitely.

Personally I want it to succeed. You could argue for a promotion with no relegation next year if the marketing side works and another growth club is on the cusp of promotion.

No harm in a double promotion to 14 teams.

Well done Toronto welcome to Super league, finally something different than the usual stuff year in year out. Apart from the worrying off field issues with Court cases for not paying companys i'm happy as pie they're in Super league.
I can't see a big change in personnel at all i think 2-3 out with the same number coming in.
Can't wait to see if i can afford the away match at their stadium

It will be much easier for them to attract crowds, sponsorship, TV coverage, players and media interest now they are in the top grade.
It has been a remarkable effort to fund the side and attract a good fan base in an area where the game was unknown while playing in semi professional comps.
Now they have a professional side in a professional comp, and thanks to their efforts of the last few years, they have already developed a fanbase.
Next year they will be able to access TV coverage of away games of broadcast quality, and they should be able to get that on local TV, so that alone will get in fans and sponsorship they haven't dreamed of till now.
I think they have done the hard bit.
Now the people they have had to chase for 3 or 4 years will be knocking at their door, looking to jump on the bandwagon.