So you think Wigan should have paid £60k-£70k for an 18 year old who had never played in the first team because he didn't want a full-time contract so he could finish his A-Levels?

You really need some new material - either that or at least string a decent argument together that can't be blown out of the water in an instant.

The point is that NINE non England eligible players have played for Wigan this year and you are likely to have EIGHT next season.

Two of the four players leaving to allow the new three aren't playing regular first team (Feka and Phelps) where as the incoming players certainly will - so next season, there will actually be a reduction in places in the Wigan first team for England eligible players in real terms.

From what I understand, Riddell/Phelps/Feka/Bailey will be off. That leaves Roberts/Carmont/Richards/Tommy/Hansen/Hoffman/Finch/Lima - 8 non England eligible players.

It is precisely because your youth set-up is so good that those sorts of numbers are so unpalatable.

i am slighly annoyed, not to mentoion nautious that I am being forced to agree with Wigan fans.

please stop this thread now

seasick??

See (no pun intended) thats how bad its made me feel.

An instant 10 pages there.

Wigan are not acting with the wider interests of the sport's future at heart. It has been very heartening this season to see all but one of the teams in SL put faith in English players and cut the numbers of overseas players. Look at Harlequins, who could now field an all English 17, despite the precarious nature of their very existence they have taken the view that the sport as a whole would benefit if England players were fielded, thus giving the sport a viable international aspect. Wigan are, as ever given their dark history, so blinded by the glint of silver from across the hill at successful clubs like Saints and Warrington that they would do literally anything to get around the rules and wring out any possible advantage. Now the live cap has meant blatant cheating is now no longer easy to do they look to other ways in order to go outside the spirit of not only the cap but also the sport and in this case look for dodgy, probably illegal passport loopholes to ensure they have twice as many overseas players as anyone else.

I'm guessing you've included Harrison Hansen there? If you want to split hairs Hansen is of Samoan descent and is just as England-eligible as Willie Manu, who was included in last weeks England training squad. Why is 8 out of a squad of 33 too many for Wigan but not too many for anyone else?

It's too many for everyone. It is especially noticeable at Wigan because they have a very strong youth set up and a chairman that not long ago was talking about his dream of an all English team but now looks to double the quota for his club.

so your team DONT have any overseas players then.
and how many academy players have your team supplied to all the other teams in the leagues because there are too many of them to play in their home town team or the first team of the academy that trained them up?

by the way thicko you can not have more overseas players than the quota allows!!!!

i think people are confusing Wigans youth development and overseas players. Those these are obviously linked, they arent the same. Wigan do have good youth development, nobody can sensibly deny that. They are up there with Leeds, Saints and maybe Hull as being the leaders in that respect.

But they are still going into next season with 8 overseas players, 3 of them new ones. Its an unacceptably high amount for Wigan, and its unacceptable for leeds to have 7.

Its the same at Leeds, whilst i would encourage us to bring in players the quality of Webb, Lauitiiti, Buderus and Eastwood, we should be forced to develop the Donalds, Lueluais, and Delanys ourselves.

Wigan are in a similar position. they should be forced to bring through decent english players instead of bringing in decent australian players. Who knows how much Ainscough would have improved the deficencies in his game had wigan been forced to persist with him, giving him SL game time over the past 2 years rather than just lumping for a Roberts or a Phelps.

For a club like Wigan? If we are signing players within the rules (which we are), and have a squad that fits both the salary cap and quota restrictions (which we do) then it CANNOT be "too many". Can it? In your opinion as a fan of a rival team it may not appeal to you, but it cannot actually be too many.

It seems people are making out that Wigan are breaking a secret code of conduct or "spirit of the game" by replacing current players with better players, shouldn't every club aspire to bring the best possible talent to their club in order to succeed? Of course ideally these players would be English, but if English players of sufficient calibre are not available, why should a team suffer? Wigan ARE producing quality young players, this can be seen in the likes of Farrell, Tuson, Sam and Joel tomkins, Charnley. But of course some aren't going to meet the standards required and so will leave the club. Others will be offered more money from other clubs. These players playing in super league, albeit at different clubs, still benefits the English game though doesn't it?

Ok so Thornley is a different case as he has left the sport. But as the point has been made already, no rugby league club signed him. He never even played first team rugby for Wigan. How many of you saying how great a loss he is actually saw him play and know how good he is? I'm a wigan fan who lives outside of wigan, I don't get to watch the under 20's etc and i've never seen him play. So i'm sure many of those lambasting Wigan for releasing such a quality young player are just jumping on the bandwagon, having never seen him play.

The problem I see is that with the quota being reduced the price of English players is surely being raised, as clubs need to sign more quality English players. Could the issue be that some overseas players are actually better value than equivalent English players? In my opinion the best way to approach the issue is not to attack the clubs signing overseas players, but look at why they are doing it. As has been said before, if home-grown players, or even english players, didn't count fully on the cap then maybe you'd see players like Thornely being offered more money (admittedly probably more than their worth) to stay?

they are doing it because it is easier, and a overseas players do provide better value.

They provide better value because we simply dont have that many english players coming through, so a 2nd/3rd tier aussie stuggling to make any money out in Aus like Charlie Leeano can come over here and get a decent full time wage. Sadly Leeano as probably a 4th tier australian as as good as most british players. So yes, they get better value and it is easier, why wouldnt they.

Thornley is a red herring, we should be producing 30 of him a year. But we arent. Why would a club spend all that money on developing him, spend all that money on his coaches, offer him a good contract if they can go out and get a ready made George Carmont? they wont, they are looking to seek a competitive advantage and there is a ton of them ready and waiting down under.

We need to make it in the clubs benefit to bring in huge numbers of youngters.

Thats not absolve the clubs though, they have been selfish and short-termist and failed in their duty to the sport