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| A lot of softballs in that interview, I guess the price that has to be paid for him to break his silence.
Not filled with confidence when he points to London having paid the price for a nomadic past, when surely we are the ultimate example of a club that is a shadow of its former self and that happened exclusively when we were playing at Odsal.
If we could get any kind of real answers out of him, it would be interesting to know why we've been fed this "Nigel is a minority shareholder, he has no interest in the actual club" rubbish for nearly two years when most people who take an interest knew this was coming.
The club's had an easy ride over the past 18 months cos of Covid, but the fact is in the last full season we were challenging for promotion and knocked Leeds out of the cup. Now we've sold all the players, not even in Bradford and getting stuffed left, right and and yet all the pre season guff was how we were fully stable now thanks to Sawyer, Wood and Co. I fear 2021 will have a lot of chickens coming home to roost for us - maybe the trade press will start asking questions then rather than telling us to suck it up. Given they didn't even bother covering the announcement that the former RFL head had taken over at the club in the last remaining paper last week, I won't hold my breath.
The sad thing is, present company excepted, most fans left probably don't care. Results this year might change things, but I doubt it. Will just see JK sacked first rather than asking why on earth the former champions of the world are getting thumped playing a home game in Dewsbury in front of 1000 people on a Monday night
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| To be fair comparing to the 2019 team that was clearly funded on sand doesn’t give a fair reflection. On paper the 2019 team beat Leeds and pushed for promotion but once again was unsustainable.
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| Quote ="Betsy Bulls"To be fair comparing to the 2019 team that was clearly funded on sand doesn’t give a fair reflection. On paper the 2019 team beat Leeds and pushed for promotion but once again was unsustainable.'"
Do you agree with the position the club is in now and the decisions that have been made since? If not then its kind of a moot point in my wider argument, but I know what you're getting at. Let's not forget we were told when we went for SL promotion when Toronto went bust we were SL Ready...!
I'm not interested in another cutting our cloth debate, but we've let promising young players go and brought in Danny Brough who won't be cheap so it's not like we've got no money. I don't think you can look at some of the plodders out on the paddock in a Bulls shirt this season and think that's stability. There are plenty of other teams with a worse budget than us that would currently play us off the park. That's my issue, Sawyer, Wood et al are yet another emperors new clothes.
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| Quote ="amberavenger"Do you agree with the position the club is in now and the decisions that have been made since? If not then its kind of a moot point in my wider argument, but I know what you're getting at. Let's not forget we were told when we went for SL promotion when Toronto went bust we were SL Ready...!
I'm not interested in another cutting our cloth debate, but we've let promising young players go and brought in Danny Brough who won't be cheap so it's not like we've got no money. I don't think you can look at some of the plodders out on the paddock in a Bulls shirt this season and think that's stability. There are plenty of other teams with a worse budget than us that would currently play us off the park. That's my issue, Sawyer, Wood et al are yet another emperors new clothes.'"
Would you care to elaborate on what our budget is and which clubs are spending less and what their budgets are?
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| Quote ="amberavenger"Do you agree with the position the club is in now and the decisions that have been made since? If not then its kind of a moot point in my wider argument, but I know what you're getting at. Let's not forget we were told when we went for SL promotion when Toronto went bust we were SL Ready...!
I'm not interested in another cutting our cloth debate, but we've let promising young players go and brought in Danny Brough who won't be cheap so it's not like we've got no money. I don't think you can look at some of the plodders out on the paddock in a Bulls shirt this season and think that's stability. There are plenty of other teams with a worse budget than us that would currently play us off the park. That's my issue, Sawyer, Wood et al are yet another emperors new clothes.'"
Up until yesterday, I thought the club had done a reasonable job stabilising things after Chalmers had spent more money than we had, again. Crucially last season they’d avoided administration by paying off all the creditors Chalmers had left. I don’t know what effect Covid has had on the club finances but I thought there may have been a surplus due to staff furlough. After the reserves were cut, up to 10 players were released (are these the young players you mean?) as they had no way of being played.
I suppose it all depends on how much club funds are being diverted into the stadium.
Would this be a good season if we finished mid table, back at a slightly improved Odsal, with our academy renewed for another 5 years and no hint of an administration event? I would say that would fit an acceptable season for me. If all those things happened and we got into playoffs, I would call it a good season.
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| Without Nigel Wood and others, the club would of gone into Administration again in 2019, it appears Nigel Wood can't win as if he didnt step up he would of got blamed for it, now he has stepped up he is getting blamed for it, look at the accounts under Chalmers and what they are now. With the introduction of the squad booster and a limited budget on players it appears we are now trying to manage on an affordable scale, you then get fans complaining we aren't spending enough which is what caused the problems in the first place.
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| The recruitment can’t be left at the door of Sawyer and Wood. You can argue the signings are where we are as a budget but we surely have to be as happy as we can be that we are (I hope) living within our means
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| Quote ="bulls2487"Without Nigel Wood and others, the club would of gone into Administration again in 2019, it appears Nigel Wood can't win as if he didnt step up he would of got blamed for it, now he has stepped up he is getting blamed for it, look at the accounts under Chalmers and what they are now. With the introduction of the squad booster and a limited budget on players it appears we are now trying to manage on an affordable scale, you then get fans complaining we aren't spending enough which is what caused the problems in the first place.'"
He's the reason Chalmers owned the club, if in fact he actually owned it all. People from within the RFL coughed 'Nigel Wood' whenever Chalmers and the Bulls were mentioned, for instance when he arrived from NZ without the money to open a bank account so had to use the RFL's account for season tickets. He's neck deep in this going back 9 years.
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| Quote ="Highlander"Up until yesterday, I thought the club had done a reasonable job stabilising things after Chalmers had spent more money than we had, again. Crucially last season they’d avoided administration by paying off all the creditors Chalmers had left. I don’t know what effect Covid has had on the club finances but I thought there may have been a surplus due to staff furlough. After the reserves were cut, up to 10 players were released (are these the young players you mean?) as they had no way of being played.
I suppose it all depends on how much club funds are being diverted into the stadium.
Would this be a good season if we finished mid table, back at a slightly improved Odsal, with our academy renewed for another 5 years and no hint of an administration event? I would say that would fit an acceptable season for me. If all those things happened and we got into playoffs, I would call it a good season.'"
I don't think they are unreasonable expectations.
Personally I think as 2020 was an enforced fallow year for the Championship, its given the illusion that the club has been stable for 18 months. Whilst other clubs have used it as an excuse to regroup and crack on - what we have needed for a long time - it seems everyone from the board room down look to have been happy with the bare minimum.
Given we have a speedway fan group begging for money to repaint Odsal, I'm not convinced money is being funneled into the stadium
Could be a long old season. A mid table finish is looking pretty good right now.
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| Quote ="bulls2487"Without Nigel Wood and others, the club would of gone into Administration again in 2019, it appears Nigel Wood can't win as if he didnt step up he would of got blamed for it, now he has stepped up he is getting blamed for it, look at the accounts under Chalmers and what they are now. With the introduction of the squad booster and a limited budget on players it appears we are now trying to manage on an affordable scale, you then get fans complaining we aren't spending enough which is what caused the problems in the first place.'"
Bit of a bizzare statement to suggest people would have blamed Nigel Wood for not stepping up in 2019. The only person to blame if the club went into admin would have been the people involved in running the club at the time. Surely that wasnt Nigel, was it....?
I haven't seen any complaints asking us to spend more money, more to be more considerate on the money we do spend - eg Danny Brough?
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| We cant be accused of not spending money. Brough and Murphy wont have come cheap. However I think the main issue again is a bloated squad of average at best unproven players.
The squad is Kears responsibility, as is the "tactics" we have continued to use during his time.
I get stability but on the field we are a sinking ship and no 38yr old is going to stop that when the other players around him arent up to the job.
Plenty of squads that cost far less look much better at this moment in time.
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| Quote ="bullinenemyland"Plenty of squads that cost far less look much better at this moment in time.'" Sheffield and Swinton are a prime example of this. Their squads looked fitter and more creative than ours on what I can only assume is a smaller budget than ours.
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| Quote ="bullinenemyland"We cant be accused of not spending money. Brough and Murphy wont have come cheap. However I think the main issue again is a bloated squad of average at best unproven players.
The squad is Kears responsibility, as is the "tactics" we have continued to use during his time.
I get stability but on the field we are a sinking ship and no 38yr old is going to stop that when the other players around him arent up to the job.
Plenty of squads that cost far less look much better at this moment in time.'"
Yep I agree. It would seem that we have spent disproportionately across the squad as things stand. No point bringing in Danny Brough if the pack is unfit and lacking quality. Unfortunately we look to be carrying few passengers and John Kear has to take responsibility for that. He is in year 3 of his rebuild so he will need to get this bunch playing for him or the pressure will mount. It's still early days so I'm loathed to press the panic button but we look a long way behind a lot of clubs and it is difficult to see how we can turn things around in such a short space of time.
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| Quote ="M@islebugs"He's the reason Chalmers owned the club, if in fact he actually owned it all. People from within the RFL coughed 'Nigel Wood' whenever Chalmers and the Bulls were mentioned, for instance when he arrived from NZ without the money to open a bank account so had to use the RFL's account for season tickets. He's neck deep in this going back 9 years.'"
He was involved in selecting the owners yes, he did attend Bulls games from January 2017 as was seen on a regular basis, What I am getting at is without him stepping up to Full ownership we would of gone into Admin in November 2019, another 12 point deduction or relegation to League 1(which would of got carried over due to Covid-19) or no one came in and the end of club again. Would you prefer a year where we finish mid table or bottom of the league and relegated?
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| Quote ="Bully_Boxer"Yep I agree. It would seem that we have spent disproportionately across the squad as things stand. No point bringing in Danny Brough if the pack is unfit and lacking quality. Unfortunately we look to be carrying few passengers and John Kear has to take responsibility for that. He is in year 3 of his rebuild so he will need to get this bunch playing for him or the pressure will mount. It's still early days so I'm loathed to press the panic button but we look a long way behind a lot of clubs and it is difficult to see how we can turn things around in such a short space of time.'"
I appreciate what John Kear has done for the Bulls but I think we need to look at a younger coach with fresh ideas. E.g someone like James Ford or Danny Ward other clubs seem to be going down that route Eamonn O'Carroll at Newcastle and Rhys Lovegrove at Keighley. Lee Greenwood at Dewsbury would be a good shout.
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| Quote ="bulls2487"I appreciate what John Kear has done for the Bulls but I think we need to look at a younger coach with fresh ideas. E.g someone like James Ford or Danny Ward other clubs seem to be going down that route Eamonn O'Carroll at Newcastle and Rhys Lovegrove at Keighley. Lee Greenwood at Dewsbury would be a good shout.'"
I am not calling for Kear to be sacked, he has done enough in the game to be given some time to pull things together this year. I must admit though, over the years I have always seen John Kear coached sides to be consistently difficult to beat even though the rugby isn't always the most exciting to watch. I can live with that if it gets results, but I'm not sure he ever quite achieved that so far at the Bulls. He has often worked on tight budgets as well so he should in theory be a good fit for us.
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| Quote ="bulls2487"He was involved in selecting the owners yes, he did attend Bulls games from January 2017 as was seen on a regular basis, What I am getting at is without him stepping up to Full ownership we would of gone into Admin in November 2019, another 12 point deduction or relegation to League 1(which would of got carried over due to Covid-19) or no one came in and the end of club again. Would you prefer a year where we finish mid table or bottom of the league and relegated?'"
Hi guys been a while since i was on here.. Wasnt NW reponsible for appointing Mark Green & Chalmers ? instead of the other syndicates including Mr & Mrs Koucash ? Seems to me he orchastrated his rise to chairman a long time ago... interesting to see how this pans out.. He saved us yes he did but we are miles away from being anything other than mid table... agree totally with a new young coach, would like to see Rowan Smith given another go if he was interested.
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| And a new commercial director [urlhttps://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/sport/19224058.bulls-name-pitts-new-commercial-director/[/url
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| Quote ="smiffythebull"Hi guys been a while since i was on here.. Wasnt NW reponsible for appointing Mark Green & Chalmers ? instead of the other syndicates including Mr & Mrs Koucash ? Seems to me he orchastrated his rise to chairman a long time ago... interesting to see how this pans out.. He saved us yes he did but we are miles away from being anything other than mid table... agree totally with a new young coach, would like to see Rowan Smith given another go if he was interested.'"
With regards to NW he was part of the RFL hierarchy at the time though I'm far from sure it would ever have been his sole decision, in fact I doubt very much that it was. That the RFL, as a controlling group were responsible, there is no doubt in my mind, they were guilty as charged.
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| It's hard to know but he was effectively the RFL so I'd say it's at his door.
There was an article in the T&A which quoted Chalmers saying Rimmer and Wood told him in the December before liquidation that he and Lowe would get it but they'd have to ride out a couple of bumps first.
If we end up a cock up like at Fax we'll not come back.
The worrying thing now is, after watching the CC this weekend and seeing where the other 3 SL championship winning clubs are, I don't think I'd care. There's little skin left on this dead horse.
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| Quote ="Scarey71"It's hard to know but he was effectively the RFL so I'd say it's at his door.
There was an article in the T&A which quoted Chalmers saying Rimmer and Wood told him in the December before liquidation that he and Lowe would get it but they'd have to ride out a couple of bumps first.
If we end up a cock up like at Fax we'll not come back.
The worrying thing now is, after watching the CC this weekend and seeing where the other 3 SL championship winning clubs are, I don't think I'd care. There's little skin left on this dead horse.'"
I'd say Wood's tenure has absolutely no bearing on whether we 'come back' or not. This club's chances of being back at the top of the game died a long time ago.
The money is gone, the crowds are gone, the quality players are gone. This is what we are now, a mediocre championship side.
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| Quote ="Nothus"I'd say Wood's tenure has absolutely no bearing on whether we 'come back' or not. This club's chances of being back at the top of the game died a long time ago.
The money is gone, the crowds are gone, the quality players are gone. This is what we are now, a mediocre championship side.'"
Unfortunately correct. The young players coming through now barely remember us even being in SL never mind when we actually won anything. We've become like Huddersfield were in the 70s/80s, a side that was great years ago, playing in a museum piece ground in front of dwindling crowds. I remember back in those days RL commentators would go on about how good it would be to see Hudders back in the big time and reminisce about players like Lionel Cooper. It was all long before my time. It's getting like that now when us old fogies talk about past players.
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| Quote ="Bullseye"Unfortunately correct. The young players coming through now barely remember us even being in SL never mind when we actually won anything. We've become like Huddersfield were in the 70s/80s, a side that was great years ago, playing in a museum piece ground in front of dwindling crowds I remember back in those days RL commentators would go on about how good it would be to see Hudders back in the big time and reminisce about players like Lionel Cooper. It was all long before my time. It's getting like that now when us old fogies talk about past players.'"
That's a very helpful analogy, Bullseye. I'm sure many of us recall standing on crumbling terraces at Fartown, now those crumbling terraces are our own! Another analogy - certainly if we don't get back to Bradford soon - would be Swinton.
The way Huddersfield got out that particular rut was the arrival of Ken Davy with his large bank account. Not sure there's a 'Ken Davy' around for us, or surely they would have emerged sometime over the past few years?
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| Quote ="Bullseye"Unfortunately correct. The young players coming through now barely remember us even being in SL never mind when we actually won anything. We've become like Huddersfield were in the 70s/80s, a side that was great years ago, playing in a museum piece ground in front of dwindling crowds. I remember back in those days RL commentators would go on about how good it would be to see Hudders back in the big time and reminisce about players like Lionel Cooper. It was all long before my time. It's getting like that now when us old fogies talk about past players.'"
I guess there is some analogy there but I wonder if Hudds will ever get back to where they were? By that I clearly don't mean in the top division but at the top of it, winning lots of trophies consistently, that sort of thing
. It was strange to hear commentators, I think it was on Sky, wondering out loud about who was going to challenge the clubs who have won the championship and, as still one of the only 4 to do so, we got a mention.
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| Quote ="paulwalker71"That's a very helpful analogy, Bullseye. I'm sure many of us recall standing on crumbling terraces at Fartown, now those crumbling terraces are our own! Another analogy - certainly if we don't get back to Bradford soon - would be Swinton.
The way Huddersfield got out that particular rut was the arrival of Ken Davy with his large bank account. Not sure there's a 'Ken Davy' around for us, or surely they would have emerged sometime over the past few years?'"
Funnily enough a crumbling Fartown was exactly what I was thinking of. A place that had certainly seen better days. As you say Davy was the key for them. We've never had anyone like that behind the club in its entire history. Our successful periods 1940-1950, 1977-85, 1996-2006 were never due to a big money backer so perhaps we don't need one? The success in each case was down to the club having good, trustworthy and reliable people in charge with a vision and the appointment of enthusiastic and highly qualified employees. Names like Harry Hornby, Trevor Foster, Joe Phillips, and Harry Womersley inspired everyone under them. I know Caisley had his faults but he brought in some good people like Peter Deakin and others who transformed the club. We need people like that again. Is Nigel up to task? His record doesn't suggest so and the lukewarm tones of his recent interview don't inspire confidence.
Swinton and maybe Oldham are examples of great clubs that were cut adrift from their communities at the time. I'm not sure either have ever recovered. Let's hope we aren't following in their footsteps, even a period of treading water at Odsal in the mid to lower part of the championship is better than becoming nomads. Some day our Prince will come...
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