The only reason our forward pack is less strong is that we have two of our three best props missing. All of our playmakers and outside backs are guaranteed to suffer from this, as would those of any side in the league under the same circumstances. Roby was not the only hooker who fell short in some areas - KC's passing was wayward at times on Sunday.

I do think Roby is nowhere near the standards of passing, tackling and running he set 18 months ago. Some of this is to do with a decline in his abilities (probably through injury), but the majority is down to being worked out by defence coaches. He's a far, far better player than Higham, but i suspect he'll go the same way. I doubt Moore has the commitment or determination of Roby, but his skill set is far greater. Which means it's much harder for defences to plan for him

No mate, sorry if your not up to speed on rugby terminology.......when I say ball player, I mean someone with the ability to spot a gap and to put a runner through it etc..........

I haven't suggested that the King can kick, that's not what I am saying........We need an interchange hooker with the ability to do more than make one break a game and be a solid defender....

You are obviously a big Robes supporter, and there's nothing wrong with that. He is a decent player, he just doesn't have the basic skills to break down a solid defence. Just look at 100% of his contribution over the next few weeks, not just the stand out moments......

And if you suggest that he is more effective than the King, and can be as consistently dominent, then I am owned by your superior knowledge of the sport

Fair point, but I'm not looking at Sunday's game - everyone has an off day - I'm trying to be objective over a period of time - If our starting pack was at full strength, the play the ball would still be slow. That's one of the key points I am trying to get accross. Roby doesn't appear to have the inteligence to develop his game beyond being able to make the odd dart from dummy half on the rare occassion that a defender forgets to lie onin the tackle.......

ref Moore.

The OP stated that your pack is not as dominant thus Roby is unable to show the flair he has. Moore currently is behind a dominant pack. At Cas he wasn't and look at his performance for them.

I would say next year you need to work on the pack (Graham can't win a game on his own even with his commitment) whilst you still have KC for the 2011 season without him.

Good point, although the dominant pack comment is only part of the equation - I think our main issue has been the slowing down of the play the ball and Roby's problems dealing with this. It hasn't been an issue for the King, as he has a more powerfull game and more basic rugby league skills than Roby..........btw, think Moore will be back at saints next season -even if the King doesn't hang up his crown

The reduction in Roby's effectiveness is down to two things:

1 - The yearly decay of our squad, we get weaker in the forwards every year
2 - The RFL's decision to allow a longer 'wrestle' at the play the ball in an attempt to copy the NRL interpretation. This results in holding down going unpunished meaning there are no quick play the balls anymore.

No, he's a player who's main strength was his dynamic running from the quick play the ball. It took a mountain of work away from our props meaning they could have more impact.

Trent Barrett was easy the best player that season ! Under the current rules Barrett would have won it hands down!! Fact!! As he was voted players player!! Which is now man of steel !! Infact I think they changed the rules as it was quite embarrassing That roby got it infront of barrett and peacock that season!! The excuse peddled around was roby had a great trip down under?? The same tour peacock got voted world foward of the year?? How eddie hemmings and the other numties on the old mos pannel came up with roby I will never know!! Maybe he was arm wrestlein' the opposition interchanges for the half of a season he was sat on the bench??

I think roby is a great sl player!! Like a lot of players the other teams work em out a bit which has happend with roby!! He has to kick on again and I'm sure he will!!

It's a vicious circle then, unless they go back to allowing quick play the balls his contribution is nullified.

Problem for the coach to resolve tho - and he needs to do it pretty quickly.

He looked brilliant with a dominant pack and he was world class at times, but he should never of won MOS.

He is now Higham but better and thats all he is, I hope he improves his game for England but I can't see it. Someone told me ages ago that McIlorum would be better than Roby and a laughed in his face but judging on this season alone he has been better and IMO could now go on to be the better of the two.

McIlorum has similar distribution to Roby but can take the ball up much better as he is more physical and he is far better in defense.

Not sure on that one mucker. Roby is quality in defence, machine like. Robes stats would probably make McIlorums look weak on the opta stat thing on sky tv

Yes... You're right!

rlhttps://www.superleague.co.uk/statistics_player.php?hs1