Good job Leeds are a grade A club or they could be struggling to stay in SL given the recent performances when the IMG reconfig happens.

Not sure there are many academy players who have a long term future at the club in SL. Who are you suggesting? Don't forget even if this year is a write off for us it wont be for the teams we are playing so the intensity and physicality will not drop off.

Upheaval and unrest, we have had several seasons of upheaval and unrest. I rather not experience anymore of that thank you very much.

Keep buying season tickets people it will get better next season........or maybe the one after or whatever

You do what you like but don't tell me what I should be doing. I'm sorry if I'm not a whinging fairweather supporter that can only get behind my team when they are winning.
I dispair reading on here these days, think I'm going to take a break from this forum

No need to do that. I'd say 98% of the posting on here is pretty polite even if it encapsulates many different viewpoints. The other 2% (mentioning no names) is downright juvenile. There's an ignore button at the top right of every post. I've only ever used it once but I found it pretty effective in reducing the craziness.

There's so many guises people will hide behind and those same posters use the same dialect,good for you take a break because the truth is too painful for you, this is a forum and is inclusive to everyone and their opinion is as valuable as the next or are you the doyen?

Given how the club has gone since 2017 it is hardly surprising there is a down beat feel to this board at present. A club the size of Leeds with the resources available to it should not be turning out the quality of rugby it is and has been for a number of years.

There are obvious issues on the rugby side of the business that cannot be swept under the carpet - poor recruitment, lack of development in the academy, poor coaching options etc. Even the most positive of posters - like Chris - cannot ignore the tangible evidence presented before them.

I think most posters on here mean well ,myself included. The club’s situation is dismal at the moment ,but nothing like the time half the south stand after one game marched over the pitch to hurl abuse at the bemused occupants of the north stand. The directors at that time had steered the club into virtual bankruptcy. Fortunately they managed to give way to Caddick who eventually brought in Hethrington the rest as they say is history. So I am always loathed to put the boot into the club management. However we are in a downward spiral with no signs of a halt to this situation.
I will always support the team but another couple of seasons of the current garbage ,could potentially cause some major financial problems.
As for Smith reluctantly I would let him continue next season, if no improvement is shown then fire him. That may well be even three or four games into the new season. Obviously we urgently need to strengthen the team in key areas, easier said than done. Remember the good old days when you could pick up decent players relatively easy , Moon from Salford a classic example.

That’s a pretty fair and reasonable assessment of the current situation. Probably the frustration is compounded by the excellent finish last season.
Then we followed up this season with utter garbage, added to the fact no decent players were brought into the club.

To be fair, it's all been a bit disappointing with Smith.
We literally scraped into the top 6 in the last game last year.
Then, granted, we had 2 very good away wins at Cats and Wigan.
But in all honesty, we were never in the GF. It was comfortable for Saints.
This got everyone excited about a new era, but really papered over the cracks.

This year has been a total disaster.
We've had our near full strength squad available for a lot of games, but have been absolutely dreadful most of the time.
Yeh a couple of decent wins along the way, but pretty much dreadful.
Smith has been exposed at times as unable to get the best out of a team.

FWIW, there's no point sacking him now.
I think we'll do what Warrington did with Powell.
He'll be given the chance to bring in some of his own signings in the off season to mould his team.
Then, he'll be given until July next season.
If we're doing well and have progressed, he'll stay.
If we're still struggling, he'll be sacked.

Having said all that, can't see our board splashing the cash the way Wire have done, but we'll see....

I think he is brilliant at bringing young players on but I'm not convinced his a coach at this level

Personally, I'm still undecided if hes the right person for the job but I just don't think hes had enough time to be completely judged on whether he is a good or bad coach.

Back end of last season we were great and managed to get to the grand final, this season we have been very inconsistent, sometimes great, sometimes shocking but like has been mentioned before, its not like we're getting hammered every week, just losing by small margins.

Like was mentioned above, i think he has half a season to prove himself and get the team playing consistently.

I also dont believe its right to put all the blame on Smith, some of the players performances, especially senior players, have been shocking.

Generally with a coach its difficult to judge until the team is really 'theirs'. That's certainly not the case with Smith. He signed mainly project players, with only a few of the first 17 having joined under him, and none in the really important positions, unless you count O'Connor as his pick.

Smith has overseen the departure of some of the players responsible for multiple years of dross. Players who were rubbish under multiple coaches but somehow stayed around as coaches came and went. This clear-out had to happen if we were to really move forward. Hard choices on moving players on had been avoided for far too long, and what could have been managed in a gradual way over multiple seasons has had to happen fast. This has undoubtedly affected morale and while I really don't like results this year, we've not been drawn into the relegation battle and should be in position to move forward next season.

I think its unfair to judge Smith too harshly on this year. He was brought in to turn the club around. The real test will be who he brings in, and how the team performs with his picks in key roles. It will be perfectly fair to judge him on how we go next year. Unless we sign another bunch of squad fillers....

Agree with most of this.
However, we haven't moved moved forwards this year, we've gone backwards.
Major surgery required for 2024.
I agree we should let Smith be part of that, but he needs backing with investment and he needs to deliver results.

Watching Goudemand he does a job, carries the ball and defends ok for his size, doesn't make many errors. But where's the point of difference in our pack, who's capable of a telling offload or breaking the line apart from 10 minute cameos from lisone and sangare. I hope after we sort the half backs problem theres a good replacement with that in mind for tetevano/Walters.

Also when you look at the importance of a coach in getting the best out of their players, how about briscoe who looked awful for us towards the end but is back to doing what he does well and doing it with enthusiasm.

I’m hoping Goudemand is Donaldsons replacement (I think he’s off contract this year.

In terms of point of difference personally I have bigger issue with the back row. Traditionally that’s where it would come from. We’ve got lots of workmanlike players there without any real impact.

I’d maybe argue Cam Smith is our point of difference when he’s not having to be involved In absolutely everything trying to make up for the halves.

Yeh he's a bit of a plodder really.
Clearly Cats don't need him.
Fine if he's a replacement for Donaldson, but given our current ambitions I expect he's the Tetevano replacement.

I wouldn't call him a plodder, he clearly trys to put himself about, just lacks the size or skill to really make and impact. Not dissimilar in that regard to Donaldson, so I hope he is the replacement. I've a lot of respect for what Donaldson has done but Goudemand seems a decent upgrade in that area, just not in a more influential role.

Just as a comparison Lam also inherited a squad and cobbled together players other teams deemed not good enough but are completely rejuvenated see Briscoe Charnley Mullhern etc is it a coincidence or good man management?

Good coaches, top coaches even, have a habit of making you say “wow look at the job he’s doing despite x and y” rather than “yeah we’ve done badly but that’s because of x and y”.

Smith is definitely the latter. I think next season will just be a repeat of this. If it starts off that way, get Smith the hell out of here.

and then it's start all over again.im with you though

Yup. But there’s always a chance Hetherington gets lucky with a coach. Hetherington needs to not be making rugby decisions. Everything he touches on that front turns to excrement.

Maybe Furner wanted to clear the dross and dead wood, never got a chance though did he, spy in the camp JJB saw to that. Squealing to friend and boss Sir Kev. Now rewarded with a " made up job " by GH