The charge is the "unacceptable risk of injury" if the arm wasn't taken out of the natural range of motion then this can't exist

The word is risk not actual. Do we really want this to become common place in the game?

Of course it can, twisting a players arm behind his back even in 'natural range of motion' can cause injury. The notes even state that if Atkin hadn't have changed his position it would have been worse.

The daft thing about this whole saga is that it has happened when there was a ban which was pretty much universally accepted was warranted.

Oh and Risk doesn't mean something will happen, that's the whole point.

Cheers Lurch, that’s exactly what I thought. Cheers for confirming.

Yes, but the risk isn't "unacceptable" if he's not pulling the arm out of normal range of movement. There is risk in every single tackle on the rugby pitch, that's just the sport. The "unacceptable" would only apply if he is twisting out of the normal range of motion, because clearly the risk of causing injury there is high. He's almost never going to injure somebody by pulling their arm within the natural range of motion

But again the appeal judiciary stated that it was only because catkin reacted and changed his position that the arm didn't go out of 'normal range'.

You put your arm where Atkins was and then think that there is someone twisting it - normal range of motion or not it could injure you.

It was a clear bit of fowl play that nobody seem to question when given a ban. well apart from Saints that is. The way it has subsequently been handled by the RFL is an absolute farce. For example there's no actual ruling, what happened did it get downgraded to a grade A, did the whole thing get thrown out because the appeal was flawed, I don't know why Saints fans are getting al uppity people are having a go at the RFL not Saints.

Handley in the squad

The verdict was he wasn't guilty of the charge he was faced with, which is why the entire ban got overturned

It was a chicken wing tackle. Naturally.

He's a flat track bully, I'll give you that.

So a 2 match ban just got wiped out to 0 because a third opinion ruled that the opinion of the ref, video ref, MRP and another appeal panel was all incorrect.

You don't think that's incompetence by the RFL?

So Reaper, youre ok with this becoming part of the game now the precedent is set?

that's the thing isn't it - they have talked about player welfare all year then let Knowles off on a 'technicality'

They've set a precedent which I'm sure will be used next year when a similar ban occurs.

Actually, it was the first appeal panel that ruled that the evidence saints presented was correct. They just decided to uphold the ban anyway for some reason. The second appeal panel was like actually if you accept the evidence then you can't uphold the ban.

I don't give a toss about the opinion of the original MRP, they've been getting everything wrong all season. They're e

No, the penalty and yellow card was fair, and all professional fouls should be punished with such



That said, I'm fairly sure the whole disciplinary system will change in the off season. It simply has to. This whole season has been a farce

What I certainly don't want to see is multiple people being dished out suspensions every week

Anyway, should be a cracker on Saturday! Even more so now with all this angst in the air. I expect the atmosphere to be electric.

I think we should win, but I'll never not have my rectum twitching with playing Leeds at OT. Hope we can put those demons to bed.

In all honesty cannot see that happening.The RFL disiciplnary are masters of shifting the goal posts to suit themselves, so that the precedent is nullified.

this farce really has dampened my excitement for the game TBH - however I'm sure when it gets to Saturday my mood will have changed.

It's a weird one, in some ways it's a free hit for us, nobody thought we would get here after the start to the season - wasn't there a poll on Sky Sports where about 90% of people voted that we wouldn't make the top six?

But, now we are there I obviously want us to win, however much I tell myself it's OK to lose as we weren't really expecting it.

You'll say thot now but come Saturday you'll be sucked into the heat of battle wanting to smash those dirty cheating scouse s

Also I really thought you'd challenge before the season started and I had tipped you for 2nd. Forgot to take into account how abysmal Agar is! Now you've got a good coach I'm pretty sure your squad will see you challenging going forward now. I'm certainly not taking you for granted on Saturday

Yes Smith has been an absolute revelation and is worlds apart from Agar, however I will say that we had a terrible run of injuries in that first half of the season and along with our utter inability to not get players banned contributed to our terrible start.

I would actually argue that with our recent run we are actually the in form side in SL, and I think even Saints fans will admit that they haven't been at their best in the second half of this season.

it should be an absolute cracker

No appealing against the scoreline when we beat you, mind

I want JJB to do a prematch interview and go all Kevin Keegan on jenna Brooks