Defensive stats from Saturday.



McGuire 8 tackles, 5 missed tackles.

Tomkins 16 tackles, 2 missed tackles.

Meaning what?

sums up what a muppet you (and others) are!

i can understand people calling for him to be dropped, but why would you wish for a player never to represent his country again? bar of cause hatred of the player / club he plays for, which then nullifies anything else you have said.



i'm not to keen on leon pryce, both as a person & a player, but nothing would make me happier then to see him ripping aus/nz to shreds.

Meaning Hodges was kept quiet by Ellis.

Don't go jumping in with your paranoid all defensive boots on. Smith and Peacock could have done with bringing theres last week! (joke

)



I like McGuire and enjoy watching both him and Leeds play the game to the level they do, they are the premier club in SL, and generally the most entertaining to watch.



What i mean is that in Tomkins and Eastmond we have a partnership with massive potential, as opposed to a lad who had massive potential but has not made it at the top level, for McGuire to get another crack and offer average International at best generally performances means that this partnership has failed. Every player is overtaken by someone younger and hopefully better.



I have nothing against McGuire or Leeds but i hope this combination flourishes meanin he and Pryce can hang up there International boots that have been tried tested and generally speaking failed and concentrate on an arena more suited to there skills of top level domestic rugby.

Correct on all counts.



I watched Myler off the ball an awful lot in that game and he really impressed me. he was far more vocal and authoritative than McGuire and was the one calling the shots, pushing players into position etc.



This, more than what he actually did with the ball in hand (which wasn't too bad either) really impressed me.



I couldn't agree more that you decide on 6 & 7 and you play them as much as you can.

But are either Myler or Tomkins/Eastmond better than Burrow?

Still England's loss will be the Rhinos' gain.

Not sure about Myler yet but i would say that Tomkins and Eastmond are.

that Tomkins was twice the player that Mcguire was in defence

If barely adequate constitutes actually taking on the Australian defence testing them and creating opportunities on debut than most our halves since Gary Schofield have done combined then I agree.



The fact is Sinfield and McGuire were too busy trying to keep it in the old Loiners boys club, once this combination was broken in the second half Tomkins got a chance to work.



I actuall thought Sinfield was poor when playing at 13 but played well from the hooking role where i would have liked him to start this game as Roby is nothing short of garbage regards his delivery.



Eastmond, regardless of where you play him plays as though he is a half, much in the same way as Sinfield and Farrell often played the same game regardless of what shirt was on there back.



Tomkins and Eastmond combined on several occasions as a half back pair and always looked dangerous when doing so.

You were doing so well up to that point, when your paranoid delusional fantasies kicked in. Are you seriously suggesting that Tomkins was starved of ball in the first 40 because those nasty older boys wouldn't pass to him?





Btw. he created a grand sum total of two opportunities in that second half. One with the chip for McGuire, the other with the final ball to Ellis. Let's not get carried away and pretend he was ripping the Aussies to shreds every time he got his hands on the ball eh?

Lets wait and see what they produce before you make a statement like that.

[url=http://live.nrlstats.com/matches/nrl/match2709.htmlAn alternative source for the defensive stats.[/url



Tomkins misses higher or so it seems?

I think Sinfield and McGuire simply relied on there relationship its nothing to do with being nasty just trying to take on the Aussies with the partnership they are familliar with.



In no means do i claim he was ripping the Aussies to sheds but it was a far superior attacking display than we have seen from most other halves against top opposition except perhaps Long vs the Aussies in his last ever game.



International rugby is about more than ability it is about having the right mindset, and while McGuire certainly has that mind set at domestic level he shows weakness in this area at the top level, great domestic player but just missing that extra something that both Tomkins and Eastmod seem to have, for want of a better description, a no fear attitude all the great half backs need.

When have they shown "that bit extra" that you speak of then????

He also left Lockyer grabbing at thin air with a superb change of pace (off his right foot I might add) before Hodges tried to drop him on his head (Shenton chance). He also outjumped Billy Slater for a bomb and found a quality offload, which Briscoe unfortunately went the wrong way with. That's four superb pieces of play in a half against the tournament favourites. Maybe you'd like to point out 4 similar bits of skill from Lockyer or Thurston in the game?

Watch what they do in a game and what they do well and read so quickly when situations arise.

This Leeds/Wigan/Saints p155ing contest is just getting silly now.



I will support and hope whoever plays on saturday has a good game against NZ.

I know. All I'm trying to say is that Tomkins was excellent on Saturday, probably the stand out halfback on the pitch. Of course Lockyer and Thurston were very good as well, but they had Inglis and Hodges outside them and Tomkins had Shenton and Smith.

So if either Tomkins or Eastmond play poorly you aren't going to let your club bias and jealousy creep in and boo them off and complain about them for a week on a message board and demand they never play international rugby again?

McGuire has been on borrowed time since he lost that yard of pace that made him such an exciting young player. His strength was as a try scorer with his backing up ability and the speed not to be caught. IMO he is a scrum half and not a natural 6. (Burrow is a better 7 with a superior kicking game and the ability to run with pace at the defence) Danny is an instinctive player but has never been able to read or control a game the way Sinfield does. He has become an international 6 mainly due to the lack of quality opposition for this position.



All three players that were dropped were guilty of repeated defensive errors against Australia and should have tightened up after the first couple of tries. Had they done so and saved 2 converted tries we would not have lost.



However playing a slow prop in the second row was equally catastrophic and meant that for all of the first half Australia could create an overlap on their left wing. IMO this error and the fact that Smith took until half time to correct it was the main reason we lost the game. He has repeated this same mistake so who will provide the cover this time? If Sinfield is to be used again at acting half then it will have to be Burgess until the 2nd rowers come off the bench



Eastmond has enormous talent and deserves his start. Tomkin is the future and Mcguire has had his chances so I would go along with that also. But I am not a fan of Fox on the wing as he runs sideways too much so I would have retained Smith on the wing as he is tougher and cover for fullback (Although he should not have been in the squad as he is deserting to Union) Bridge at centre is worth a try.



This time our forwards have to step up to the mark because the NZ pack are tough, fit and mobile. Just to bash them up the middle will not be enough.

No and I never did when Pryce Wellens Long Etc failed to in and England/GB jersey.













Can you just give me a hand to get of this very high horse now please.

Your my hero

Correct yet the coach, who planned this hasn't had nearly the roasting these players have had who were playing to his game plan.