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| Two good wins to start the Reserves season 48 - 0 vs Bradford and 46 - 10 vs Cas, played some good rugby and scored some cracking trys. Plenty of the players still eligible for the Academy aswel. Always interested to see how the younger players are developing physically at the start of a season and we certainly look a big athletic team right across the park with 7 or 8 players somewhere between 6 ft 2 and 6 ft 6.
The Academy season starts this week after a cancellation to the opening round fixture.
Good promising start to Tony Smiths tenure.
The ever impressive Mark Butterill has a good set of players to work with this season, the U16's especially are a great intake, which more or less sweeped up all the best players in the Yorkshire league. Theres other good players in the group but the Names to watch out for imo:
Harry Smith - HB
Pressley Cassell - 13
Harley Thomas - FB/C
Callum Webster - BR/C
Joe Butterfield - Prop
Dylan Hutchinson - HB/FB
Marcus QareQare - FB/W
Jermaine Oladipupo - Prop
Jacob Stead - BR
The U15's intake missed a few players who are heading over to Lancashire, 2 going Saints, 1 warrington and Cas kept a couple in Yorkshire, but still a good intake, led by Zak Lloyd from Siddal, who's the best U15 in Yorkshire, and from what iv seen, in the country imo, big, fast, skillfull, intelligent. He can play anywhere, FB, 6, 13, Centre, SR...And he's excellent in all of them, interested to see where the club play him.
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Club Captain | 4719 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| Sounds like the production line is still working - thanks for the update.
Wasn’t our QareQare supposed to be the better brother..?
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"Sounds like the production line is still working - thanks for the update.
Wasn’t our QareQare supposed to be the better brother..?'"
Too early to say with ours being so young, he's certainly a classy player with great feet though, the potentials there.
I didnt see much of Jason at the same age so cant even compare on that front.
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Two good wins to start the Reserves season 48 - 0 vs Bradford and 46 - 10 vs Cas, played some good rugby and scored some cracking trys. Plenty of the players still eligible for the Academy aswel. Always interested to see how the younger players are developing physically at the start of a season and we certainly look a big athletic team right across the park with 7 or 8 players somewhere between 6 ft 2 and 6 ft 6.
The Academy season starts this week after a cancellation to the opening round fixture.
Good promising start to Tony Smiths tenure.
The ever impressive Mark Butterill has a good set of players to work with this season, the U16's especially are a great intake, which more or less sweeped up all the best players in the Yorkshire league. Theres other good players in the group but the Names to watch out for imo:
Harry Smith - HB
Pressley Cassell - 13
Harley Thomas - FB/C
Callum Webster - BR/C
Joe Butterfield - Prop
Dylan Hutchinson - HB/FB
Marcus QareQare - FB/W
Jermaine Oladipupo - Prop
Jacob Stead - BR
The U15's intake missed a few players who are heading over to Lancashire, 2 going Saints, 1 warrington and Cas kept a couple in Yorkshire, but still a good intake, led by Zak Lloyd from Siddal, who's the best U15 in Yorkshire, and from what iv seen, in the country imo, big, fast, skillfull, intelligent. He can play anywhere, FB, 6, 13, Centre, SR...And he's excellent in all of them, interested to see where the club play him.'"
butterill will want to go out on a high this year so im looking forward to seeing how these boys play matt ...sounds like a good group from what ur saying!
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| Butterill is leaving?
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| Quote Jack Burton="Jack Burton"Butterill is leaving?'"
thought it was the worse kept secret in the game that this is his last year at the club and he will be on the look out for another club for next season?
I rate him the lads done a great job said it for years now he will be another clubs gain its a shame like.
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Player Coach | 5049 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| Quote tomtom84="tomtom84"butterill will want to go out on a high this year so im looking forward to seeing how these boys play matt ...sounds like a good group from what ur saying!'"
Buterill will be a massive loss to the club.
Why is he actually leaving the Rhinos Tom?
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| Quote The Biffs Back="The Biffs Back"Buterill will be a massive loss to the club.
Why is he actually leaving the Rhinos Tom?'"
was told lack of opportunity and not getting the same backing and support as other coaches have had? One to watch i guess ..if i hear owt else Biff ill let you know. agree with you though be a loss for the club
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| Under 16s v Hull KR tonight with all players mentioned above in the game
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| 70 - 0 win for the Scholarship, solid start
Webster x 4
Cassell x 3
Lloyd x2
Thomas
Hutchinson
Diskin
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Club Captain | 4719 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| I’m wondering who the next couple of lads to break into first grade will be.
Would expect to see Sinfield wirh game time this season. Simpson was close before his knee injury. Who else do you guys reckon might be there or thereabouts?
Actually quite hard to get into our 17 at the moment.
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| Also can anyone see Field coming through into the Leeds back row at some point? Gannon/Field/Smith is a good sized and very skilful back row.
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"I’m wondering who the next couple of lads to break into first grade will be.
Would expect to see Sinfield wirh game time this season. Simpson was close before his knee injury. Who else do you guys reckon might be there or thereabouts?
Actually quite hard to get into our 17 at the moment.'"
Amazing how we go from a very poor show against cas to an irratic first half yesterday (yes there were some good periods but still irratic) then a great 2nd and now we've a 17 that's hard to get into!
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Club Captain | 4719 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| Quote Seth="Seth"Amazing how we go from a very poor show against cas to an irratic first half yesterday (yes there were some good periods but still irratic) then a great 2nd and now we've a 17 that's hard to get into!'"
It is a hard team to break into now as a young player because 6/7 lads have cemented spots overt the last year or two, and a couple more are on the verge. Some decent prospects like Muizz, Edwards and Broadbent not made the cut.
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| U 18's Academy started the season with an 84 - 0 win at Newcastle today
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Moderator | 32156 | Bradford Bulls |
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| Do you guys have a decent centre you can lend us on dual reg?
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| Quote Bullseye="Bullseye"Do you guys have a decent centre you can lend us on dual reg?'"
You'd probably have Max Simpson if he hadn't have done his ACL
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| Our Scholarship are live on the clubs YT channel today at 1pm.
Really young team selected, all but 3 of todays squad are U15's
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Club Captain | 4719 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Our Scholarship are live on the clubs YT channel today at 1pm.
Really young team selected, all but 3 of todays squad are U15's'"
Matt’s several players looked good but hard to judge given the quality of opposition. Our 9 and 10 looked handy.
Good to see some more big, mobile props in the system.
Who stood out for you mate?
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"Matt’s several players looked good but hard to judge given the quality of opposition. Our 9 and 10 looked handy.
Good to see some more big, mobile props in the system.
Who stood out for you mate?'"
Pressley Cassell was excellent while he was on the field, but he always is to be fair. Thought William Wilkinson and Jacob Hardey were good in the forwards. Interesting to See Harvey Butterworth at 9 in the second half, he's usually a 6 or 13 for Stanningley, he looked good. Caleb Rhodes made a big impact off the bench, nearly scoring a full lengther from a kick return ( He scored a near identical one for Birstal Victoria last week) good, Mobile prop.
Opposition well outmatched though, as you say.
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| Is this the age group you reckon has some real standouts?
Would like to see the team against better opposition to get more of an idea of their quality.
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"Is this the age group you reckon has some real standouts?
Would like to see the team against better opposition to get more of an idea of their quality.'"
Yeah the u16's has some really talented players, hardly any played yesterday though, was mostly u15's.
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| Really poor effort from the u18's last night, losing 30 - 34 to Huddersfield.
A just need to turn up to win attitude saw them losing by plenty midway into the second half, they switched on with 20 left and put a handful of unanswered trys on, but too little too late.
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978'" Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Really poor effort from the u18's last night, losing 30 - 34 to Huddersfield.
A just need to turn up to win attitude saw them losing by plenty midway into the second half, they switched on with 20 left and put a handful of unanswered trys on, but too little too late.'"
I was surprised by the team we put out. I know it's not all about winning at that level but give the debut's against the likes of Newcastle. McCormack at 6 has an impressive running game. Looks very promising. A night to forget for Sir Jack.
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| McCormack has got a bit going on in his game, could be good.
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Player Coach | 5049 | Leeds Rhinos |
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Morgan Gannon will make his comeback from his HIA injury and also whilst being stood down on health grounds by the club for almost 2 months in the Rhinos reserves this Friday V Hull FC reserves
https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/sport/rugb ... n-26684570
It will be great to see Morgan back out on the field.
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Morgan Gannon will make his comeback from his HIA injury and also whilst being stood down on health grounds by the club for almost 2 months in the Rhinos reserves this Friday V Hull FC reserves
https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/sport/rugb ... n-26684570
It will be great to see Morgan back out on the field.
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International Chairman | 11464 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| Excellent news may also be the kick up the backside that Bentley needs.
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| Jack Looks like he could do with a loan, far better than reserves level. Warren also looked good imo.
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| Aldridge looked good again today.
Have to say I’m not sure how many of these lads will make first grade other than Jack but good solid side.
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| I think most of our lads who played reserves could benefit from short loan spells at either SL or championship level. Walters is far above that level. Sinfield impressive again with his organisation & calmness. Ruan scored a great try hitting a great line behind the ruck. Was great to see Gannon get some game time and minutes back on pitch after having a few weeks out.
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| Gannon played in the halves when he came on didn't he?
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| Why are we so poorly represented in the Yorkshire origin squad? I don't really follow the academy game these days.
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Player Coach | 720 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| Quote Seth="Seth"Why are we so poorly represented in the Yorkshire origin squad? I don't really follow the academy game these days.'"
yes its a bit weird, we won the u18s grand final last season, and it seems quite a few of those players are still eligible for the u18s but arent selected in the squad
are they trying to select mostly u17s or something maybe?
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| The Yorkshire squad is mind boggling, unless the aim is to get hammered i just dont get it.
We should have 6 or 7 in, and that wouldnt include one of the 2 who actually did get in.
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| 64 - 0 win for our Scholarship against Bradford tonight, Harley Thomas and Joe Diskin with 3 trys apiece
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"64 - 0 win for our Scholarship against Bradford tonight, Harley Thomas and Joe Diskin with 3 trys apiece'"
Quality of opposition aside there was some lovely ball movement and skill on show there. Impressive stuff.
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Player Coach | 720 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"The Yorkshire squad is mind boggling, unless the aim is to get hammered i just dont get it.
We should have 6 or 7 in, and that wouldnt include one of the 2 who actually did get in.'"
predictably the Yorkshire team were easily beaten in the first game - unless theres many changes to the squad for the 2nd game i cant see much change in the result
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"The Yorkshire squad is mind boggling, unless the aim is to get hammered i just dont get it.
We should have 6 or 7 in, and that wouldn't include one of the 2 who actually did get in.'"
You called that one Matt.
Why does it very often appear that squad selections at junior level are politically picked?
Surely it's in the best interests of the sport that the best players are picked and regardless of which club they play for?
When are the Australian Schoolboys next touring over here?
This is another consideration for choosing the very best players for the county games and then also for England International selection based on those games.
2018 was the last time that England played against the Aussies when we won the 2 match test series.
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| Bit of positivity,
Im delighted with the Academy intake just announced, one of, if not the best intake in recent memory.
Some real top quality in amongst the 15 players.
I had wondered how many we would sign from this class, i hoped it would be into the teens, but was worried we might lose one or two to big offers elsewhere, or that we would deem 14/15 as too many for one intake.
Really Happy we have signed so many, especially that we have kept all the 'stand outs'
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Bit of positivity,
Im delighted with the Academy intake just announced, one of, if not the best intake in recent memory.
Some real top quality in amongst the 15 players.
I had wondered how many we would sign from this class, i hoped it would be into the teens, but was worried we might lose one or two to big offers elsewhere, or that we would deem 14/15 as too many for one intake.
Really Happy we have signed so many, especially that we have kept all the 'stand outs''"
Hopefully it will go a long way towards quieting zoom zooms negativity and personal attacks at the scholarship head coach... said this for years and never been more apt apt after this announcement matt where the club is failing in its junior development and the reason so many fall by the wayside within our academy and not kick on is because the lad butteril is not the academy head coach...im told the lad was made part time this last year? Madness by the club madness...anyway pressures on now for the academy to produce some first team players...they have the quality moving up now so no excuses.
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| Quote tomtom84="tomtom84"Hopefully it will go a long way towards quieting zoom zooms negativity and personal attacks at the scholarship head coach... said this for years and never been more apt apt after this announcement matt where the club is failing in its junior development and the reason so many fall by the wayside within our academy and not kick on is because the lad butteril is not the academy head coach...im told the lad was made part time this last year? Madness by the club madness...anyway pressures on now for the academy to produce some first team players...they have the quality moving up now so no excuses.'"
We are told this year on year , but very little ever comes through to first team level , as a club we do not seem to improve these players to any great standard
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| Agree 100% tomtom
I am a huge fan of the work Butteril does, he has consistently sent groups/players up to the Academy who look top quality prospects, they get to the Academy and too often dont kick on and generally look far less intelligent players despite being older.
Everyones entitled to their opinion, and maybe its me who's wrong, but for me, he's a brilliant coach/developer of talent, it amazes me how anyone with any knowledge of our Scholarship would think otherwise
I dont know if the logistics would work, but if it was up to me, i would have him full time and coach of the Scholarship and Academy.
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Bit of positivity,
Im delighted with the Academy intake just announced, one of, if not the best intake in recent memory.
Some real top quality in amongst the 15 players.
I had wondered how many we would sign from this class, i hoped it would be into the teens, but was worried we might lose one or two to big offers elsewhere, or that we would deem 14/15 as too many for one intake.
Really Happy we have signed so many, especially that we have kept all the 'stand outs''"
Positivity? You ain't from around here, are you boy?
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| Quote ArthurClues="ArthurClues"Positivity? You ain't from around here, are you boy?'"
Not quite so positive with affairs at first team level unfortunately, but yeah, credit where its due, really Happy with the work done in securing this intake
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Not quite so positive with affairs at first team level unfortunately, but yeah, credit where its due, really Happy with the work done in securing this intake'"
What's your view on Fergus McCormack? Do you think he can be a top level half in the next half dozen years. Same question for young Sinfield.
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| Like both of them, they complement each other well aswel, if we look at them as a pair, i certainly think they have the ability to be first team players.
Harry Smith is a very good half in this batch just announced, he could well be better than both. Him and Dylan Hutchinson are a quality 6 & 7 in this intake, a bit like Sinfield and McCormack, they fit well together, Smith the control at 7 with Hutchinson the X Factor//Run threat at 6
Between the 4 of them, its the first time in a long time i'v been excited by the Quality and depth we have at half back in our system.
As always though, need to keep working hard and have a bit of luck on their side.
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Player Coach | 5049 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| Quote tomtom84="tomtom84"butterill will want to go out on a high this year so im looking forward to seeing how these boys play matt ...sounds like a good group from what ur saying!'"
Any updates Tom if Butterill is still leaving?
Too many jobs for the old boys in the past at Leeds, with regards to them being given the role as head of Academy,when clearly Butterill is the man for the job
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| don't know to be fair biff hope not? wasn't something out this week about him doing a job at the uni? lad develops kids year on year but its within the academy that they never fulfill their potential in fact most go backwards? wouldn't surprise me if he left who could blame him if its jobs for the boys as you suggest
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| How come you cannot raise a reserve side to play Wigan this week? That is very worrying for a club of Leeds standing!
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| The reserves needs scrapping anyway.
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| Quote tomtom84="tomtom84"don't know to be fair biff hope not? wasn't something out this week about him doing a job at the uni? lad develops kids year on year but its within the academy that they never fulfill their potential in fact most go backwards? wouldn't surprise me if he left who could blame him if its jobs for the boys as you suggest'"
Butterill is coaching Leeds Beckett's RL team next season, taking over from JJB. It's a link between LBU & Rhinos; he's till got his Rhinos role as I understand it.
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| Quote Jack Burton="Jack Burton"The reserves needs scrapping anyway.'"
To what end?
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| Quote Jack Burton="Jack Burton"The reserves needs scrapping anyway.'"
What would that achieve?
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| Quote tigertot="tigertot"Butterill is coaching Leeds Beckett's RL team next season, taking over from JJB. It's a link between LBU & Rhinos; he's till got his Rhinos role as I understand it.'"
I really hope that he does stay at the club as he does a fantastic job of producing talented junior players.
He should be the head of the whole scholarship and academy systems IMO
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| Quote Zig="Zig"What would that achieve?'"
It would reduce the amount of games, and expenditure for clubs, and stop a player pool that isn't growing being diluted further.
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| Quote Jack Burton="Jack Burton"It would reduce the amount of games, and expenditure for clubs, and stop a player pool that isn't growing being diluted further.'"
It’s going to grow even less if players don’t have the option of playing for the reserves. A team like Leeds should have no
Problem finding a reserve team, where has the money gone?
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| Quote Zig="Zig"It’s going to grow even less if players don’t have the option of playing for the reserves. A team like Leeds should have no
Problem finding a reserve team, where has the money gone?'"
Please Zig, Don’t start another where has the money gone thread on here.
Agree though it’s pretty poor that Leeds can’t get a reserve team out.
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| Quote Sir Gregory ParsloeP="Sir Gregory ParsloeP"Please Zig, Don’t start another where has the money gone thread on here.
Agree though it’s pretty poor that Leeds can’t get a reserve team out.'"
Sorry Sir it was not my intention to stir up a hornets nest. I love rugby league and it concerned me when a team of Leeds’ standing are not able to fulfill their fixtures at any level. The future of the game looks bleak!
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| The club probably could get a reserve team together, they just don't want to. It serves no purpose.
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| Quote Jack Burton="Jack Burton"The club probably could get a reserve team together, they just don't want to. It serves no purpose.'"
Either way, Seems pretty poor if we can and can’t be bothered or can’t raise one.
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| Quote Jack Burton="Jack Burton"The club probably could get a reserve team together, they just don't want to. It serves no purpose.'"
How do those players get any playing time week to week though without it?
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| play for fev or the bulls I guess
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| Quote tad rhino="tad rhino"play for fev or the bulls I guess'"
Not enough spaces for every player in SL who's eligible and primarily going to play reserves. Player development in the past has really suffered for players just having no games to play.
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| Just allow a certain number of over age players to play in the academy. Most reserve players are academy players anyway.
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| Quote Jack Burton="Jack Burton"Just allow a certain number of over age players to play in the academy. Most reserve players are academy players anyway.'"
Wasn’t that how it used to work with the U23s? It’s perhaps a bit harder when the drop is to 18s.
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Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"The Yorkshire squad is mind boggling, unless the aim is to get hammered i just dont get it.
We should have 6 or 7 in, and that wouldnt include one of the 2 who actually did get in.'"
Quote mattsrhinos1978="Neruda"predictably the Yorkshire team were easily beaten in the first game - unless theres many changes to the squad for the 2nd game i cant see much change in the result'"
Quote mattsrhinos1978="The Biffs Back"You called that one Matt.
Why does it very often appear that squad selections at junior level are politically picked?
Surely it's in the best interests of the sport that the best players are picked and regardless of which club they play for?
When are the Australian Schoolboys next touring over here?
This is another consideration for choosing the very best players for the county games and then also for England International selection based on those games.
2018 was the last time that England played against the Aussies when we won the 2 match test series.'"
Lancashire wrapped up the academy origin series yesterday with a comfortable 44-16 win against Yorkshire
https://www.rugby-league.com/article/62 ... hire-16---
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Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"The Yorkshire squad is mind boggling, unless the aim is to get hammered i just dont get it.
We should have 6 or 7 in, and that wouldnt include one of the 2 who actually did get in.'"
Quote mattsrhinos1978="Neruda"predictably the Yorkshire team were easily beaten in the first game - unless theres many changes to the squad for the 2nd game i cant see much change in the result'"
Quote mattsrhinos1978="The Biffs Back"You called that one Matt.
Why does it very often appear that squad selections at junior level are politically picked?
Surely it's in the best interests of the sport that the best players are picked and regardless of which club they play for?
When are the Australian Schoolboys next touring over here?
This is another consideration for choosing the very best players for the county games and then also for England International selection based on those games.
2018 was the last time that England played against the Aussies when we won the 2 match test series.'"
Lancashire wrapped up the academy origin series yesterday with a comfortable 44-16 win against Yorkshire
https://www.rugby-league.com/article/62 ... hire-16---
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| Are we in a white rose crisis period?
SL table has Yorkshire sides in 6th (KR), then 8th, 9th, 10th, 11th, 12th...
Rhinos Academy out of top 4 I believe, Yorkshire well beaten in origin series... we seem strategically off the pace this side of the hill, and really this is comparing to Wigan, Saints, Wire and Leigh.
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| Well taken tries from Frater and Lumb last night against Wigan
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| Fraters a bit of a dark horse to make it, he's absolutely rapid, powerful and quite skillful, never been regarded as one of the stars of this group, but he's really developed well over the last 12 month
Been a weird season for our Academy, loads of talent in the backs, but a combination of barley ever plaing our strongest team and a poor set of forwards has seen some poor results.
Lumb
Thchebembe
Smith
N McCormack
Frater
F McCormack
Sinfield
Is a very good, exciting back line
The only 2 forwards who have really impressed me are Ben Littlewood at prop and Hooker Mason Corbett
Last night was actually a decent performance considering Wigan are a good team, 4 of the 9 above wernt playing and we had a man sent off just before half time
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Fraters a bit of a dark horse to make it, he's absolutely rapid, powerful and quite skillful, never been regarded as one of the stars of this group, but he's really developed well over the last 12 month
Been a weird season for our Academy, loads of talent in the backs, but a combination of barley ever plaing our strongest team and a poor set of forwards has seen some poor results.
Lumb
Thchebembe
Smith
N McCormack
Frater
F McCormack
Sinfield
Is a very good, exciting back line
The only 2 forwards who have really impressed me are Ben Littlewood at prop and Hooker Mason Corbett
Last night was actually a decent performance considering Wigan are a good team, 4 of the 9 above wernt playing and we had a man sent off just before half time'"
I was wondering what the respective strengths of the sides were. I know winning isn't everything at that level, but it would be good to see us getting the better of the likes of Saints and Wigan on a regular basis. On the face of it last years Championship winning exploits look like a flash in the pan, but hopefully that's not the case. Agree about Frater.
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| Frater has a young Ryan Hall vibe dare I say it.
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| Got a bit of Leroy Rivett in his game for me
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| Let’s hope I’m right mate!
Excited to see young Qareqare develop he looks a good prospect - has that granite Fijian heritage. Bit of Marcus Bai about him (I know he wasn’t Fijian)…
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| Leeds looking at bringing in hooker Harvey Smith from Wakefield, not heard much about him but highly rated apparently?
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| Seems highly rated but this is a position we have literally 4 players already stacked up in.
Eseh would be strategically a much more useful signing but maybe yet again we'll go where the easier signing is. We don't seem to fare well whenever another club is interested in the same player as us.
It does again send signals that RH isn't happy with Jarrod O'Connor or Johnson entirely at 9, this coming after the Danny Levi rumours.
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"Seems highly rated but this is a position we have literally 4 players already stacked up in.
Eseh would be strategically a much more useful signing but maybe yet again we'll go where the easier signing is. We don't seem to fare well whenever another club is interested in the same player as us.
It does again send signals that RH isn't happy with Jarrod O'Connor or Johnson entirely at 9, this coming after the Danny Levi rumours.'"
Given this and rumours of wanting to bring a hooker in, I’ll be surprised if Johnson is still here next year
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| If we sign another hooker I think he’ll go yes.
Or, with another off-season he might be starting hooker with the others coming through.
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"If we sign another hooker I think he’ll go yes.
Or, with another off-season he might be starting hooker with the others coming through.'"
I'm in no way in the know, however I am on nodding acquaintance with somebody who knows Corey's family. I was told when we were in for Levi that Corey would ask for a release if it came to pass. I imagine the same would apply if Powell were to be signed.
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| Yes if he was blocked for 2 years by a senior I think he’d go - I’m not sure whether Powell is worth losing younger lads over - Levi fair enough.
If we sign Smith then you’d imagine Johnson would be above in the pecking order so he would stay.
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| If we sign Sam Powell, for me that will be a crystal clear message of our ambitions.
Utter mediocrity.
Wigan have done superb business so far ahead of next season.
This would be more excellent business by them.
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| Wigan have recruited well and early, but I still think Leeming will be found out there. He's a good pack up and runner, but his defence is too soft, and I don't think Wigan will like that.
Keighran and Walters are obviously good signings.
Powell would be ok, but entirely depends on who we bring in at 7. Smith likes his 9s to be distributors and good defenders, which is where Powells strengths are. He also comes from a winning environment, and has plenty of experience to add to O'connor.
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| Wigan's win in the academy semi final against Warrington has been reveresed due to Wigan making 12 subs instead of 8. Warrington will now play Saints in the GF
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| Quote Jack Burton="Jack Burton"Wigan's win in the academy semi final against Warrington has been reveresed due to Wigan making 12 subs instead of 8. Warrington will now play Saints in the GF'"
What, no Yorkshire team?
What a surprise....
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| Quote Simmo71="Simmo71"What, no Yorkshire team?
What a surprise....'"
We did win it last year you know?
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| Mackenzie Turner, Bailey Aldridge, Kai Morgan, Will Shaw, Tobias Gibson, Zach Mcswiney, Tom Stephens, Blake Morgan, Jack Johnson, Mark Nelson, Riley Sunderland, Neil Tchamambe all on the out list for the reserves / academy
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| I’m not super surprised at any of these to be honest. I think the club has high hopes of a couple of our other wingers and various others such as Corbett.
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| is the academy starting to produce again? I know others watch games regularly
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| Really hard to say Tad: we went through a period of forwards graduating (Smith, Oledski, Holroyd, Walters, Gannon, O’Connor) who are all at first grade level. Corey Johnson 50/50 too.
Newman has come through but injury prone. Other than that nobody has stuck in the back line for a very long time.
I think that might change and we have a raft of backs coming through. Edgell and Lumb already on the fringe, Simpson could make the grade if recovered, then Webster, Frater, Smith, Qareqare, the McCormack brothers are all good prospects. Sinfield there or thereabouts too or course.
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| let's hope then.
cheers jim
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| Jim / Matt
Any thought on Presley Cassell?
I guess it’s now or never for some of these players.
Thank you very much.
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| Quote Sir Gregory ParsloeP="Sir Gregory ParsloeP"Jim / Matt
Any thought on Presley Cassell?
I guess it’s now or never for some of these players.
Thank you very much.'"
Not seen enough of him myself - Matts is the real expert.
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| Pressley Cassell is outstanding, he's got everything you could want in a modern 13:
Big
Skillful
Athletic
Intelligent
Tough
Leadership
I would put him right up there with Gannon at the same stage of their careers
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Pressley Cassell is outstanding, he's got everything you could want in a modern 13:
Big
Skillful
Athletic
Intelligent
Tough
Leadership
I would put him right up there with Gannon at the same stage of their careers'"
Cheers Matt, I’ve not seen him in awhile but that’s what is was hoping you’d say.
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| It‘a true we do have a very strong crop of young players coming through currently. I know some complained about letting Tchambe go, but that tells you something about how confident the club are in other wingers in the system.
As soon as we fix the first team we have a trickle feed of quality coming through.
I’m still not sure whether Gannon will end up at prop or 13 rather than second row.
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| Marcus Qare Qare, Ned McCormack, Ben Littlewood training with the first team this pre season. There is a few more too but I’m unsure who they are, maybe Jack Iceton
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| Frosties , do you know what position Jack Iceton plays ? Cheers
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| Quote Frosties.="Frosties."Marcus Qare Qare, Ned McCormack, Ben Littlewood training with the first team this pre season. There is a few more too but I’m unsure who they are, maybe Jack Iceton'"
I don't believe someone under the age of 50 is called Ned.
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| Quote Sir Gregory ParsloeP="Sir Gregory ParsloeP"Frosties , do you know what position Jack Iceton plays ? Cheers'"
I don’t, however I know he crossed over from the Bulls academy mid season so we must of seen something there.
Also, Leo Aliyu has signed a professional deal and will have a squad number for the new season I believe
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| Quote Frosties.="Frosties."I don’t, however I know he crossed over from the Bulls academy mid season so we must of seen something there.
Also, Leo Aliyu has signed a professional deal and will have a squad number for the new season I believe'"
Leo is quite athletic isn’t he? bit like AJ Wallace was.
Really could do with a couple of lads developing and making first grade over the next couple of years.
Squad numbers will be good to see - wonder if Kershaw will be announced same time.
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| I was impressed with Lumb when I saw him play v Wigan in the academy and reserves games.
Just a note, watch out for Jack Farrimond from Wigan, he will be 2nd year academy in 2024 but I think he'll also get a 1st team squad number. Not wishing to hex him but he's as good at this age as Edwards and Tomkins IMO..
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| Good news is that Ben Littlewood, Marcus Qare Qare, Riley Lumb, Jack Smith, Leo Aliyu, Jack Iceton, Ned McCormack are still part of the first team training set up.
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Quote Rogues Gallery="Rogues Gallery"
a note, watch out for Jack Farrimond from Wigan, he will be 2nd year academy in 2024 but I think he'll also get a 1st team squad number. Not wishing to hex him but he's as good at this age as Edwards and Tomkins IMO..'"
I hope that you do far better with this prediction than your last one Brian
Quote Rogues Gallery="Rogues Gallery"I really want to see how Hanley goes at fullback. I've seen him play at #1, #4, #5, #6 and #13 at junior, scholarship and academy grades.
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=539794&start=22630
At academy level he was better than Welsby and a really good organiser at #1'"
Quote Rogues Gallery="The Biffs Back"Big shout that Rogues
Although I must admit that I have to disagree with you as IMO Hanley has never been anywhere close to Welsby's class yet at any level
Let's see if Hanley kicks on to make it in SL but I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't tbh as i'm not as impressed with his talents as you are
I hope that he proves me wrong'"
Did Umlaya prove you wrong?
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Quote Rogues Gallery="Rogues Gallery"
a note, watch out for Jack Farrimond from Wigan, he will be 2nd year academy in 2024 but I think he'll also get a 1st team squad number. Not wishing to hex him but he's as good at this age as Edwards and Tomkins IMO..'"
I hope that you do far better with this prediction than your last one Brian
Quote Rogues Gallery="Rogues Gallery"I really want to see how Hanley goes at fullback. I've seen him play at #1, #4, #5, #6 and #13 at junior, scholarship and academy grades.
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=539794&start=22630
At academy level he was better than Welsby and a really good organiser at #1'"
Quote Rogues Gallery="The Biffs Back"Big shout that Rogues
Although I must admit that I have to disagree with you as IMO Hanley has never been anywhere close to Welsby's class yet at any level
Let's see if Hanley kicks on to make it in SL but I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't tbh as i'm not as impressed with his talents as you are
I hope that he proves me wrong'"
Did Umlaya prove you wrong?
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| Looking forward to watching some academy again this year - the side has some good talent.
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| Who are the ones to watch out for this season? Are the younger Mccormack, and Cassell the stand-outs in the u18s?
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| Quote Neruda="Neruda"Who are the ones to watch out for this season? Are the younger Mccormack, and Cassell the stand-outs in the u18s?'"
Yeah couple of good hookers, wingers, FB (Lee Smith’s son), generally a talented group I think.
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| 2nd year Academy (u18) is a pretty poor group imo, but with 2 very good players in Fergus McCormack at 6 and Mason Corbett at hooker. Lee Smiths son, Kai, is an interesting prospect at fullback, he's got great feet but really small, any kind of growth spurt/filling out could certainly see him emerge. Theres a couple of decent forwards who hovered around the Yorkshire team last year, but Anybody, other than the 3 mentioned, would have to make a big jump to be regarded as a first team prospect or even a top prospect among their age group imo
The first year Academy group (u17) is the one iv been banging on about for the last 3 year, its one of the best in the last 20 year, imo. Its got a potential superstar 13 in pressly Cassell, 2 very good, big, props in Joe Butterfield and Jayemm Oladipupo, Jacob Stead is an athletic, physical back row who runs really good lines, 2 quality halfs in Harry Smith and Dylan Hutchinson, Smiths ahead of where Sinfield or McCormack were at the same stage imo, the 3 quarters have got some real prospects in Marcus QQ, Callum Webster and Harley Thomas while Joe Diskins the ultimate utility who can play 9, Half and 1 and is a player who has developed hugely over the last couple of year. An intriguing 'flyer' is Elliot Fox who played half for Stanningley but the club seem to prefer him at 9, he's electric out of dummy half and is one of the most fiery/aggressive young players iv seen, along with Diskin, could be late bloomers in an already quality group.
The 2nd year Scholorship (u16) is a good/great group, with 3 headline acts, Jacob Hardy is like watching Stevie Ward at the same age, brilliant prospect at Backrow or 6, Zak Lloyd is another top quality talent, and equally as good, who can play anywhere from 1, centre, 6 and backrow. Harvey Butterworth is the third, plays 6 or 13 for Stanningley but played a lot of 9 at Leeds. Theres some really good forwards in the group, Hughie Tinkler, Will Wilkinson, Cobi Ellis and Caleb Rhodes. The backs are not of the same standard although Will Hunter at half or FB looks the real deal, he plays for Shaw Cross in the second division so reserving judgement due to the level of competition, he does look very good though.
Wont go into too much detail on the first year Scholorship (u15), other than it looks a strong group on paper and includes all the best players from the best 2 teams in Yorkshire, 5 from Lock Lane and 9 from Kippax.
Plenty of good players i haven't mentioned who could certainly overtake some of the ones i have, but one things for certain, we can not knock the club with regards to youth recruitment, since Bastion rejoined, its been exceptional. We just need to get that development step right once they reach the Academy, too many, too often have not progressed as hoped from Scholorship to Academy over the last few years.
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| Thanks as usual Matts great summary. Looking at some who haven’t made it in recent years; one of the main reasons is physical size (Mustapha, Edwards, Sutcliffe). Broadbent thought he was worth more than Leeds, Walters similar, and Dupree seems to have slipped the net somehow (attitude?). Dupree looked good at junior level not sure what happened with him.
We seem to have produced a clutch of lower SL/champ standard players without many making the grade with Leeds.
I do think the players coming through now have generally better quality.
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| Gonna bob this one as a sticky as I do find this subject fascinating and like to try to keep up to date with the latest from you guys who are more adept at getting to games.
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| Anybody know how Hudson got on last week for the reserves?
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| U18's season starts tonight against Saints
Not sure what the injury situation is, but suprised at the team selected
Think we'l struggle but hopefully proved wrong
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| Are you watching it Matts?
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| Im not Jim, thankfully
To be honest, im becoming a bit frustrated with our youth setup, recruitment of talent is top notch, but at some point that needs nurtured into developing a winning mentality...our reserves and Academy always seem to be the dumbest team on the pitch, to the point that im almost suprised when either team win a game these days...especially against decent opposition
To be fair iv said previously, our top age academy are not a great group talent wise, expected them to lose tonight..would just be nice if they suprised you now and again...from what im hearing, its the familiar story of plenty stupid errors and not being able to defend them, much like the reserves on saturday
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| We don’t seem to adapt too well to the new tackle rules somehow.
Like you said vaguely odd selection though, several names missing that I’d have expected to see.
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| Im maybe being a little harsh...but i do feel we dont put enough emphasis on the importance of winning at this age.
It may be old school thinking but
You knew the goldens were ready for the next step..because they went out and dismantled everyone at academy level. While you see the talent in our system now, the results dont suggest theres a group of players superior to their peers
But like i say, im maybe being too harsh, next year will be more of an indicator...the first year academy group are exceptionaly talented, when they're more mature 2nd years, who will be supported by 3 or 4 excellent talents from this years scholorship...if they are not a dominant side then somthings gone wrong in their development
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| In amongst all the gloom it's great to see the reserves get a win at Saints.
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| Quote ArthurClues="ArthurClues"In amongst all the gloom it's great to see the reserves get a win at Saints.'"
Absolutely, scholarship got a win against Hull FC this week too
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| Quote ArthurClues="ArthurClues"In amongst all the gloom it's great to see the reserves get a win at Saints.'"
Indeed it was Arthur, good win aswel, in that, on paper, we looked to have a good team out, and probably stronger than the Saints line up, but too often recently, we dont show that on the field at this level.
Was good to see them go away to Saints, and get the job done. Sinfield with another trademark try, he should be putting pressure on Frawley before long if they both continue their respective starts to the season.
Scholarship is the one constant at the club, always well coached. Actually started pretty poorly against Hull, who should be a decent side themselves, but hit their straps in the second half and put them away comfortably
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| You just have to hope that the club really does have faith in Sinfield as the future and that Frawley is only a stop gap until Sinfield is ready.
We really don't want to have to scour the market for a 7 again in the next couple of years.
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| That’s up to Jack to improve and take the opportunity - his D has been very suspect at open age so far. If he can strengthen up and get his technique right he has a lot of ability.
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"That’s up to Jack to improve and take the opportunity - his D has been very suspect at open age so far. If he can strengthen up and get his technique right he has a lot of ability.'"
It's also down to the clubs ability to coach and develop talent
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| Quote Simmo71="Simmo71"It's also down to the clubs ability to coach and develop talent'"
Nail on head
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Nail on head'"
How highly do you rate Mark Butterill Matt?
He seems to be a coach that consistently delivers the scholarship players to the older academy groups year on year, but he never gets a chance to coach the older groups or move up the coaching ladder.
IMO he should be the head of the academy structure at the club.
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| Quote The Biffs Back="The Biffs Back"How highly do you rate Mark Butterill Matt?
He seems to be a coach that consistently delivers the scholarship players to the older academy groups year on year, but he never gets a chance to coach the older groups or move up the coaching ladder.
IMO he should be the head of the academy structure at the club.'"
Rate him massively Biff, think he's an excellent coach
Dont know his personal circumstances so not sure if he would want it, but for me, the more time our young players are coached by him, the better off the club and the players would be.
Imo, far too often over the last several year, our Scholarship players look better drilled and more intelligent rugby players at 16, than they do in our Academy at 18, despite the scholarship spending a fraction of the time together
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Rate him massively Biff, think he's an excellent coach
Dont know his personal circumstances so not sure if he would want it, but for me, the more time our young players are coached by him, the better off the club and the players would be.
Imo, far too often over the last several year, our Scholarship players look better drilled and more intelligent rugby players at 16, than they do in our Academy at 18, despite the scholarship spending a fraction of the time together'"
A very good assessment that Matt
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| I’m at the academy game today at a beautiful looking HQ in the sun. Really looking forward to seeing the lads play today, I’ll give you some thoughts after - couple of potential future first graders on show hopefully.
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| Poor result against a team made up of players left over after we've signed the ones we want
Again, young team,11 first years, but would expect better.
Fair play to the Cas coach, he's clearly doing a great job and getting the best out of his players
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Poor result against a team made up of players left over after we've signed the ones we want
Again, young team,11 first years, but would expect better.
Fair play to the Cas coach, he's clearly doing a great job and getting the best out of his players'"
Accepting that Leeds looked too young and struggled with Cas’s physicality, I’m still not seeing much in this crop to get excited about to be honest.
Cassell will probably make first grade SL. McCormack has talent but needs size. Diskin impressed me; he’s much more physical than he was. Can put a shot on like his Dad too. Not sure what his best position is..
Webster was alright again but I’m not sure if he’s going to stand out. Qareqare needs to get his head in better places in D and might be too small. Stead went well. Oladipupo is a big unit for his age. Nobody else did much for me today unfortunately.
Matts is it the age group under this one you’re more keen on?
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| No Jim, its this age group, but they're all in the first year at Academy level, 11 played today, which is a lot this early into their Academy careers. The second years are a poor group, so not much support other than McCormack and Corbett
The first years are the best players in the country in that age group, or they were when signed to Scholarship, and still were throughout scholarship until joining the Academy, lets see how they develop now they're in the Academy!!
I trust John Bastion when he says we they are an outstanding group, i dont trust our Academy to develop them
But as i said in an earlier post, next season, when this group are all second years, will be a true indicator, if they arnt a dominant side then, somthings gone seriously wrong.
The year below are not as deeply talented across the group, but they have 2 or 3 brilliant prospects
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| Thanks Matt.
Nicely, I hope you’re wrong about the coaching but I didn’t see much cohesion or shape again today. Skill level wasn’t great although you can see Cassell has good hands.
If Oladipupo is a first year he’s a bit of a beast.
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| Yeah Oladipupo is a first year Jim
I hope im wrong aswel, if there is even a wrong or right, its just my opinion really, but its a long standing opinion based on progression of players that far too often get overtook and left behind by their peers once they reach Academy level.
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Yeah Oladipupo is a first year Jim
I hope im wrong aswel, if there is even a wrong or right, its just my opinion really, but its a long standing opinion based on progression of players that far too often get overtook and left behind by their peers once they reach Academy level.'"
It’s hard to look at sides like Cas outperforming us at this level when we pretty much have pick of the crop regionally and have dedicated coaches and S&C for the juniors with all our facilities.
Then again one year development at 16-18 makes a huge difference. We struggled physically against Cas, who had a couple of lads close to open age size.
First time I’ve seen a few of those boys live. Considering most aren’t going to be near first team for another 2-3 years there is some potential there. Liked Cassell - he does have a bit of everything doesn’t he? Also he has a bit of aggression which all the top forwards have.
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| Whats the answer then matt? i see it like you i try and go watch the scholarship and academy as much as possible,night and day when it comes to how both sides play and how players develop, saw ur earlier post about wanting butteril to coach the academy and im of that ilk too ,it's no fluke that the bloke gets the best out the kids in the scholarship and he was chevs assistant when they won the academy grand final a few years back,do we know if he wants to do it? im guessing not as its as clear as to everyone who watches the games within our lower levels that he's the bloke to lead this talented group moving forward unless he doesnt want to do it? players and parents speak highly of him on the hill at stanningley so somethings going on? its baffled me for years this subject and we have talked about it for years now.the lad cannot want it simple as that.
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| How much of this is coaching, and how much of losing games like these is down to them picking a young side so that they’re challenged more?
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| 100% both jim but last year the group didn't even make the playoffs and i'm fully aware of the argument it's not about placings etc but a club the size of leeds with the talent it recruits should be successful at all levels and making playoffs as a minimum, 5 sides were better than our academy last year?where were older eligible players yesterday? not playing because they haven't been developed and the club must see the younger kids as being better? i agree with matt this is the most talented group the club has had for years,if they are not showing signs at end of the year and early next it's clearly the coaching and those in charge of the development at those levels, hide behind age all we want we should not be outplayed by castleford at home at that level?
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| Quote tomtom84="tomtom84"100% both jim but last year the group didn't even make the playoffs and i'm fully aware of the argument it's not about placings etc but a club the size of leeds with the talent it recruits should be successful at all levels and making playoffs as a minimum, 5 sides were better than our academy last year?where were older eligible players yesterday? not playing because they haven't been developed and the club must see the younger kids as being better? i agree with matt this is the most talented group the club has had for years,if they are not showing signs at end of the year and early next it's clearly the coaching and those in charge of the development at those levels, hide behind age all we want we should not be outplayed by castleford at home at that level?'"
Out played at home might be a bit of an exaggeration tbh, a team with 11 first years lost on what was essentially goalkicking.
I feel like the difference in physicality was obvious on how many times we were held up over their line, and how easily they were able to force themselves over on our line with players on them.
Definitely not the best performance but I think there were some promising signs from some individuals, but Mccormack could do with some more support/strike from the other half and fb I think
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| Quote Neruda="Neruda"Out played at home might be a bit of an exaggeration tbh, a team with 11 first years lost on what was essentially goalkicking.
I feel like the difference in physicality was obvious on how many times we were held up over their line, and how easily they were able to force themselves over on our line with players on them.
Definitely not the best performance but I think there were some promising signs from some individuals, but Mccormack could do with some more support/strike from the other half and fb I think'"
Granted but we have been before in regards to last season & this group is a lot stronger across the board they wont be judged on the first two games or even the first 10 but if theres no signs of development like last year then questions need to be asked, dress it up how you like if a club like leeds rhinos who gets its lions share of the best players doesnt get in the top 5 somethings not right. Time will tell though.
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| Cas obviously have a decent enough crop at this level. They turned Wigan over a couple of weeks ago too. Very obviously Leeds are leading with a young side in the academy, and preferring reserves for the second years.
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| Quote excruciatingterror="excruciatingterror"Cas obviously have a decent enough crop at this level. They turned Wigan over a couple of weeks ago too. Very obviously Leeds are leading with a young side in the academy, and preferring reserves for the second years.'"
I guess the concept is that this challenges higher quality youngsters more, I can get that on one level.
On the other hand though it makes it more likely the teams will lose games, which I’m not sure is ideal. It also could increase risk of injury playing lads older and stronger (or men with reserves). It also accelerates the gifted players through where maybe sometimes it would be better for them to hold back and learn and train for longer before “making it”.
Dunno, pros and cons of any approach.
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| Quote excruciatingterror="excruciatingterror"Cas obviously have a decent enough crop at this level. They turned Wigan over a couple of weeks ago too. Very obviously Leeds are leading with a young side in the academy, and preferring reserves for the second years.'"
Second part is incorrect, there are no second years playing for the reserves and missing Academy, they arnt good enough, the best 2 second years are McCormack and Corbett and they play for both
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| The doom and gloom continues. We only beat Cas by 24 points last night!!
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| That was Scholarship, which always recieves the praise it deserves
You should probably read the thread before posting
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| Extremely poor, error filled, performance from the reserves today in defeat to Warrington
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| Edgell and Littlewood played pretty well, as did Aliyu, Warren, Robinson, Smart, Campbell. Lumb had some errors but once he strengthens up he is tall and fast and evasive.
Boys against men at times but just like first grade, slack errors and penalties killed us.
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| Error after Error, dumb play after dumb play and penalty after penalty, very much like the first team, that is the story of our reserves and Academys season to date during their combined 1 win with 4 defeats.
But ’we'l learn from that' and 'we'l take plenty of positives away'
Problem is, they seem to take too many positives and not enough learning.
Another coach named Smith who should be firmly on the hot seat
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| Rohan smith, grix, walker and T Smith just inspire zero confidence as a coaching team it just all looks amateur.
Clubs usually have structures plays and calls that are consistent throughout the age groups and various teams, I shudder to imagine what that looks like for Leeds.
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| I thought Jack Sinfield looked more robust than last season, he has worked on his physicality.
Generally Wira looked physically more mature - but again when you’re playing opposition like that, you have to out-skill them and we failed to.
The ref allowed Warrington to lie on at the ruck to a ridiculous level too, it was embarrassing.
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| How are the games looking under the new rules?
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| Quote Jack Burton="Jack Burton"How are the games looking under the new rules?'"
I couldn’t see much evidence they’ve been applied mate. Night and day from last year, common sense may just have prevailed.
I was more bothered about the ref allowing Wire to lay on literally 5 seconds per ruck at times.
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"I couldn’t see much evidence they’ve been applied mate. Night and day from last year, common sense may just have prevailed.
I was more bothered about the ref allowing Wire to lay on literally 5 seconds per ruck at times.'"
I heard a quote from someone in the media that so far in SL the number of tackles making contact with the head has gone from around 12% to 3%, albeit a small sample size so far. So perhaps they're being lenient in the reserves because the adjustments made to the rules in SL is already having the desired effect on reducing contact with the head.
I agree on the play the ball. I'd like to see if the PTB speed has increased, because it still looks a mess and is policed inconsistently
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| It’s great that head contacts have been reduced, the interpretation has eased now and let’s hope we’re about where we need to be.
Bentley’s concussion issue was making a tackle though; this is not uncommon.
We have to make a hard job easier for refs and keep the rules as effective but simple as possible. Honestly I’d be blowing the pea out for some of the crappy spoiling tactics in the ruck. Sometimes I feel Leeds players could be better at finding their fronts but some of that is physical.
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| U18s well beaten by Wigan tonight. Presumably we'll hear we fielded a very young team and it will be invaluable for their development. May well be true. GH keeps repeating we currently have the best crop of youngsters for 20 years. I get to as many Academy and Scholarship games as I can and I'm struggling to see the same thing. I see us beaten regularly by the Wigan and Saints of this world which doesn't fill me with any confidence we'll be closing the gap any time soon. Would be very happy to be proved wrong though.
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| Ive watched a lot of these first years youngsters through the junior game. Im not gunna mention no names. It seems to me that they are giving the ones who are on the biggest contracts all the game time. They are obviously not performing. There are players who i think who are not getting picked i think should be picked who are better than the ones who are. Players who are picked not getting enough time on the field. Surely this is still a results business, even at this age. Time for the axe for a few for a while maybe ?
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| The only first year not playing regular who deserves to be is Dylan Hutchinson, but he's got Fergus McCormack in front of him so thats undersandable at 6, i personaly think Hutchinson is a better player and fullback than Diskin, so i would play him there...The club seem to love Diskin however.
Other than that, all the best first years are getting plenty of game time.
Unfortunately, our coaching and development at this level just isnt good enough, all other clubs players become tougher and more intelligent rugby players when they move from Scholarship to Academy, ours go the opposite way. Its not good enough and the club need to stop treating the appointments at Academy level as an afterthought and start looking for best in class for that level
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| Decent turnout in the cold for the U16s tonight.
Standouts for me were Dan Stelfox at prop; big lad with great leg drive. Back row of Lloyd, Tinkler and Jacob Hardy all good.
Halves had good craft. Centres also looked ok, Ellis has decent height and could be interesting once he fills out.
Some weak D from some players at times but overall comfortable win with a couple of well taken tries.
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| Didn’t see the Reserves game but report sounds like Sinfield and Ned McCormack knocking on the door. Hudson another injury - hamstring this time apparently.
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| And yet another defeat
Club stance: best crop in 20 year
Tony Smiths performance with said crop over Academy and reserves: won 1 lost 6
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| Thing is Matts that the academy has only ever produced a couple of first teamers a year even in the golden decade.
The team can lose but you have one or two who go on to make it - that’s actually okay. Flip side of course is that winning games and titles at junior level is a general signal of health.
Looking at our pool, I’d say Jack Smith, Lumb, Cassell, Oladipupo, Gannon we know about, Lloyd, Stelfox, Simpson, Littlewood, Ned McCormack…. All decent chances of making first grade.
There is some quality in there especially at back row and centre.
I do think we’ll see more juniors staring to push into the first team over the next few years than we’ve seen for a while. I do agree that I’d like to see more evidence of their potential with team results though.
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"Thing is Matts that the academy has only ever produced a couple of first teamers a year even in the golden decade.
The team can lose but you have one or two who go on to make it - that’s actually okay. Flip side of course is that winning games and titles at junior level is a general signal of health.
Looking at our pool, I’d say Jack Smith, Lumb, Cassell, Oladipupo, Gannon we know about, Lloyd, Stelfox, Simpson, Littlewood, Ned McCormack…. All decent chances of making first grade.
There is some quality in there especially at back row and centre.
I do think we’ll see more juniors staring to push into the first team over the next few years than we’ve seen for a while. I do agree that I’d like to see more evidence of their potential with team results though.'"
Jim, im fully aware of the talented players we recruit into the club, theres even more you havnt listed that are more talented than some you have, im also under no illusion that a talented junior does not guarantee a first grade player...But the minum requirement should be a dominant Scholarship intake/player, maintain that into their Academy careers, remain best in class within their peer group, we dont come close, nearly as much as we should
What a club has to do, is to give them the best possible chance of reaching maximum potential, for a club like leeds, that should be best in country, and it isnt anywhere near. The facility's are there, the coaching isnt. You seem to watch a few games like myself, but we are watching through a different lens if you are seeing any kind of learning or mental development in the way these lads are playing, each game is a mirror image of the last...Errors, stupid decisions, weak mentality, bad habits which wernt there in scholarship and generally just not as resilient as the opposition.
The current situation isnt new, its the latest in a long line of poor decisions at Academy/reserves level, so looking historicaly at the pattern of players developing isnt something to eleviate some criticism from the current set up, its more frustrating they haven't yet changed stance on how they operate...Results at this level matter, development coaches hiding behind the cliche phrases associated with development are usually the poor ones. Lads who were best in class at Scholarship but then cant win a game at Academy and reserves and look generally less intelligent players at 17/18 than they did at 15/16, is an issue, They are being cought up and overtaken by their peers
The historic issue since the goldens was 2 fold, recruitment and development, Thankfully we have addressed the recruitment side of our junior programmes, we had become poor, we are now very good, but the development side is not where it needs to be and will eventually harm the recruitment side again.
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| I’m not totally disagreeing with you Matts. You’re looking at team performances as a homogenous thing; what I’m saying is that it’s not the be all and end all at junior grades to win all the time, because realistically you might have only 1 or 2 players from an entire intake make the grade.
I.e. the most important thing is that we have a couple of genuine potential first graders in a given year, ideally. If their colleagues aren’t as good then the team will lose.
Your view around the lack of quality in coaching and development - it does look valid on face value and maybe it is a problem as you say.
A million factors can derail youngsters from success: some lads mature far earlier and look world beaters at 15, and then very ordinary when their peers catch up physically. Girls, booze, attitude all have big parts to play. Generally junior scouts tend to over-focus on attack rather than D in my view. Lots of players look okay going forward but don’t have the grit for defence.
I share lots of frustrations with the errors and lack of cohesion the teams seem to show mate. The big caveat again is what impact playing younger-age players has on that. One year at that age makes a big difference to size and strength, and it shows in results. But also that could be an excuse - I don’t know enough about the set up or behind the scenes.
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"I’m not totally disagreeing with you Matts. You’re looking at team performances as a homogenous thing; what I’m saying is that it’s not the be all and end all at junior grades to win all the time, because realistically you might have only 1 or 2 players from an entire intake make the grade.
I.e. the most important thing is that we have a couple of genuine potential first graders in a given year, ideally. If their colleagues aren’t as good then the team will lose.
Your view around the lack of quality in coaching and development - it does look valid on face value and maybe it is a problem as you say.
A million factors can derail youngsters from success: some lads mature far earlier and look world beaters at 15, and then very ordinary when their peers catch up physically. Girls, booze, attitude all have big parts to play. Generally junior scouts tend to over-focus on attack rather than D in my view. Lots of players look okay going forward but don’t have the grit for defence.
I share lots of frustrations with the errors and lack of cohesion the teams seem to show mate. The big caveat again is what impact playing younger-age players has on that. One year at that age makes a big difference to size and strength, and it shows in results. But also that could be an excuse - I don’t know enough about the set up or behind the scenes.'"
And your looking at team performance as having no bearing on how players are developing, when the reality is that its the best indicater, both individual and collective..
Iv been pretty clear regarding the mitigation of many 1st years playing in the academy and how next year really needs to be the year that the talent shows on the field, im pretty sure you have responded to those posts Jim. But those first years are already showing bad habits in games that wernt previously there
A million factors can also be present at other clubs...So why, over a sustained period, do Wigan and Saints not suffer from the same pitfalls...Coaching, Development and environment would be my opinion. Are Leeds scouts the only ones who focus on attack rather than D? If so, why dosnt that show up in Scholarship games?
Best crop in 20 year is a bold statement from the club, one i happen to agree with, we're not just talking 1 or 2 in a group of less talented... but the results on the field dont show it. Results, and performance, on the field are determined by a group of talented players being developed and coached well...1 win in 7 this year jim, from grand final winners 2 year ago when Butteril got involved for a year (no coincidence) and to your point about age, a grand final won with many first years playing regularly, to finishing mid table the year after under Smith, with many of the same players, a year older and more physically developed, but looked 3 year less mentally developed with half the toughness or resilience...Sometimes facts, maybe dont confirm, but can back up an opinion
We bring enough talented players through the door that a couple will always make the first team squad every year or 2, that dosnt necessarily mean they have been developed well
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| Fair enough and now many of that academy winning side from 2 years ago are now in first grade at Leeds?
I think six of that squad are still at Leeds with the usual couple per age group in with a shout if making it.
Point is the majority of that winning team have already left Leeds.
Again, I don’t disagree the coaching doesn’t seem to be yielding the right performances this season.
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| Not as many as there should be because their development was then stalled under Smith
Point being, a poor coach can take the wind out of a players development and progress
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| Riley Lumb made his senior debut on the wing for Halifax yesterday, winning MOM in a 0-46 loss
It would be good if he could get a run of games there, if not here with all our injuries
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| Quote Neruda="Neruda"Riley Lumb made his senior debut on the wing for Halifax yesterday, winning MOM in a 0-46 loss
It would be good if he could get a run of games there, if not here with all our injuries'"
He is a player I think could make the grade, but he's way too light at the moment.
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| Good win for the Academy today, against a pretty good Hull team.
Plenty of first years playing again and among the try's, hopefully a confidence builder and they kick on from here
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| Anyone going to Stanningley today?
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| Good to see George Brown back at the club and playing tonight, another really talented half who was with us through Scholarship but went the RU route when his team mates, the current 1st years, joined the Academy
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Good to see George Brown back at the club and playing tonight, another really talented half who was with us through Scholarship but went the RU route when his team mates, the current 1st years, joined the Academy'"
Good result again there Matts - Brown came across well on his interview as well.
I have to say been increasingly impressed with Zak Lloyd, I really like the look of him in the back row.
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"Good result again there Matts - Brown came across well on his interview as well.
I have to say been increasingly impressed with Zak Lloyd, I really like the look of him in the back row.'"
Zak Lloyd is very good, always been regarded as a special talent, that can obviously change Plenty from u13's etc, but so far, he's progressing as expected, the position the club chose for him was always going to be interesting, he was the best player in Yorkshire playing centre, fullback and 6 coming through at Siddal.
As good as some of the talents are in the first year Academy group, and they are very good and very deep, Lloyd and Jacob Hardy, from our second year scholarship group, could very well be 2 of the best 3 talents in the whole system, along with Cassell, Harvey Butterworth is the third in the same intake as Hardy and Lloyd who's a top talent
Brown played his community rugby with Harley Thomas at Dewsbury Celtic, always had as good a show and go as you'l see, great talent to get back into the club and RL, and like you say, came across very well in his interview, mature beyond his years
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Zak Lloyd is very good, always been regarded as a special talent, that can obviously change Plenty from u13's etc, but so far, he's progressing as expected, the position the club chose for him was always going to be interesting, he was the best player in Yorkshire playing centre, fullback and 6 coming through at Siddal.
As good as some of the talents are in the first year Academy group, and they are very good and very deep, Lloyd and Jacob Hardy, from our second year scholarship group, could very well be 2 of the best 3 talents in the whole system, along with Cassell, Harvey Butterworth is the third in the same intake as Hardy and Lloyd who's a top talent
Brown played his community rugby with Harley Thomas at Dewsbury Celtic, always had as good a show and go as you'l see, great talent to get back into the club and RL, and like you say, came across very well in his interview, mature beyond his years'"
Lloyd seems to have everything, is he still 16 do you know?
Cassell is another obvious potential first grader as you say; we have a clutch of talented but slightly small outside backs too.
We aren’t going to struggle at back row or centre for a good while. I quite like Brown and Wade White too. Stelfox has some potential as well from the one time I’ve seen him play.
I’d like to see better defensive technique from some; I think at junior grades everyone gets excited about good runners but it’s only half the game. It’s one reason you can sense Cassell will make it because he has aggression and technique in D already. Interesting times.
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| Harry Smith is an interesting one at Half Back, watching him for West Bowling, he was the number 1 target in the whole country i hoped the club would secure in his age group, ahead of Cassell, Marcus QQ, Thomas etc...He hasnt quite hit my expectations as yet in a Leeds shirt, but he's someone Mark Butterill rates as one the best halfs he's ever had in the scholarship.
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Harry Smith is an interesting one at Half Back, watching him for West Bowling, he was the number 1 target in the whole country i hoped the club would secure in his age group, ahead of Cassell, Marcus QQ, Thomas etc...He hasnt quite hit my expectations as yet in a Leeds shirt, but he's someone Mark Butterill rates as one the best halfs he's ever had in the scholarship.'"
Just seen the highlights drop of us v Wakey and Brown looks very smart, impressive.
Thomas I'm not convinced about yet, he looks good going forward but I don't see much in his D currently.
Cassell is developing nicely, looks pretty physical now and he's a handful for any opposition. I could actually see him making the first team squad next year and getting a couple of appearances too if he continues. With the likes of him and Lloyd coming through, Gannon fingers crossed to recover from his head knock issues, that's a very decent amount of talent for the back row. Actually think Cam Smith will need to raise his game because these young lads have so much potential.
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| Anyone see the U18’s today? I see they got spanked at Saints
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| Nothing new unfortunately
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| Corey Johnson and Ned McCormack both excellent for Halfax yesterday
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Corey Johnson and Ned McCormack both excellent for Halfax yesterday'"
corey just needs a consistent run in a team his development has been hampered for years now someone needs to get a handle on it because theres a player in there matt
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| I agree, unfortunately looks like the ship has sailed, would have loved him to get the run of games o'conner got last season to really find out.
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Nothing new unfortunately'"
funny this one me and you are on the same page with regards to the coaching at the academy level.i spoke to a first team player thats come through the systems at leeds early in the week and he was unequivocal of his praise for the scholars coach buterill saying he is the leeds 'matty peet' when i asked why he has not got the gig he said it was either internal politics or he did not want the job? lad said he was a great coach well liked and respected by all the players and staff and parents i have watched both the academy and scholarship over a lot of years as well as coach in the community game and he comes across as a nice fella his teams play a good brand of football he is a winner as his record shows its all very strange indeed.
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| Quote tomtom84="tomtom84"funny this one me and you are on the same page with regards to the coaching at the academy level.i spoke to a first team player thats come through the systems at leeds early in the week and he was unequivocal of his praise for the scholars coach buterill saying he is the leeds 'matty peet' when i asked why he has not got the gig he said it was either internal politics or he did not want the job? lad said he was a great coach well liked and respected by all the players and staff and parents i have watched both the academy and scholarship over a lot of years as well as coach in the community game and he comes across as a nice fella his teams play a good brand of football he is a winner as his record shows its all very strange indeed.'"
He's a great coach, his record speaks for itself, really is a strange situation that has had me scratching my head for years, to the point that i now just assume he must not want to expand/change his role. Its such an obvious step, that the club would be foolish not to make otherwise, Oh hang on......
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| Good win for the 16s away at Saints last night
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| Quote Neruda="Neruda"Good win for the 16s away at Saints last night'"
sounded like a good win any highlights anywhere
any info on the game matt
lads have a good record to be fair over at saints at this level over the years
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| The scholars are a good group, enjoyable to watch. Hopefully youtube highlights will be forthcoming! Sound from the match report that Zak Lloyd was good again. Also kicked a conversion from the sideline - honestly watch out for the name, the lad is very good.
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| Matts do you know how bad Presely Cassel's injury was from the last game (or anyone else?). Looks like he was treated for cramp but looked like a potential ligament issue to me?
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| Has Simpson returned from injury and if not does anyone know when this is likely to be.
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| Cassell, Phillips and Qareqare playing for England academy tonight, being show on the RFLs youtube
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| Quote fanstanningley="fanstanningley"Has Simpson returned from injury and if not does anyone know when this is likely to be.'"
Think he is pretty close now, they are taking it slowly but unless he has had a setback he should be available for the reserves fairly soon.
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| Quote Sir Gregory ParsloeP="Sir Gregory ParsloeP"Think he is pretty close now, they are taking it slowly but unless he has had a setback he should be available for the reserves fairly soon.'" I don't know the timescale for his injury but I think he's now on 18 months I believe.
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| Ruan, Hudson and Donaldson all played for the reserves today against Salford which we won.
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| Quote chapylad="chapylad"Ruan, Hudson and Donaldson all played for the reserves today against Salford which we won.'"
won on the scoreboard but not the best game i was bored at times limping through the season reserves and 18s been meh for past few years now
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| Another big score for the u18s vs KR, seems this new 1 6 7 combo is really paying off in points after a good win against Cas last time out
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| a gimme the 18s should be putting cricket scores on
teams with a poor history of youth development the fact theygot 50 put on them aginst saints really shows where we are as an academy that spine for me will be judged against the big teams not the poor teams we have played and will be playing in the coming weeks
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| Quote tomtom84="tomtom84"a gimme the 18s should be putting cricket scores on
teams with a poor history of youth development the fact theygot 50 put on them aginst saints really shows where we are as an academy that spine for me will be judged against the big teams not the poor teams we have played and will be playing in the coming weeks'"
If beating Cas by a cricket score is a gimme, why did Wigan lose to them earlier this season?
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| The whole team isn’t going to make first grade. Most will end up in champ or “lower” SL clubs. Whereas it’s nice to win, the most important thing is that we have a handful of real talents in the system.
I believe there are 5-10 players across scholarship and academy with real chances. In addition we have McCormack, Smith, Simpson, Lumb and others who are already knocking on the door.
In other words, yes our competitors have some great youth talent but Leeds are starting to get the production line working again in my view.
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"The whole team isn’t going to make first grade. Most will end up in champ or “lower” SL clubs. Whereas it’s nice to win, the most important thing is that we have a handful of real talents in the system.
I believe there are 5-10 players across scholarship and academy with real chances. In addition we have McCormack, Smith, Simpson, Lumb and others who are already knocking on the door.
In other words, yes our competitors have some great youth talent but Leeds are starting to get the production line working again in my view.'"
jim a well balanced view but we should be challenging the bigger more established academys more than we have since chev left we have looked miles off doing that over the past 2 years
i watch the 18s and the scholars a lot and theres a lot of kids gone backwards in the academy its crazy to see if you know your rugby its glaring
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| Interested to get your take on which kids have gone backwards?
Maybe if they've gone backwards they're just not good enough? To make it at first grade at Leeds, in theory at least you should be close to international class or working towards that level. There just aren't many lads of that quality.
Granted there tends to be better talent across the hill, including some signings that are made from under our noses.
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| Quote KaeruJim="KaeruJim"Interested to get your take on which kids have gone backwards?
Maybe if they've gone backwards they're just not good enough? To make it at first grade at Leeds, in theory at least you should be close to international class or working towards that level. There just aren't many lads of that quality.
Granted there tends to be better talent across the hill, including some signings that are made from under our noses.'"
needed time to look through the squads as not familiar with them all some names for you that have regressed brennan jones corbett hartley taylor aliou gilmore hutchinson fergus mccormack phillips proud stephenson white all of which have gone backwards in terms of their on field and visual development at a rate of knots yes all might not be good enough but doesnt mean they regress like they have over the past 12-18 months in what is deemed an elite enviroment also who have we lost across the hill
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| What's happened to jack smith? He had some good performances in preseason but nowhere near the squad since?
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| Quote Seth="Seth"What's happened to jack smith? He had some good performances in preseason but nowhere near the squad since?'"
Just now back from an injury I believe, played in the reserves last game I think
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| Quote tomtom84="tomtom84"needed time to look through the squads as not familiar with them all some names for you that have regressed brennan jones corbett hartley taylor aliou gilmore hutchinson fergus mccormack phillips proud stephenson white all of which have gone backwards in terms of their on field and visual development at a rate of knots yes all might not be good enough but doesnt mean they regress like they have over the past 12-18 months in what is deemed an elite enviroment also who have we lost across the hill'"
A few of those lads are going to struggle for size to make grade in SL in my view.
I might agree on Fergus, he was looking on the fringe of first grade not so long ago, and now has been shifted from 6 to fullback and I'm not sure what his path to first grade is now. As sixes, we probably have two or three even younger players who look better prospects, albeit not quite with his running game.
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| Quote tomtom84="tomtom84"jim a well balanced view but we should be challenging the bigger more established academys more than we have since chev left we have looked miles off doing that over the past 2 years
i watch the 18s and the scholars a lot and theres a lot of kids gone backwards in the academy its crazy to see if you know your rugby its glaring'"
I guess when you say you know your rugby you mean you watching it. Do actually know what it takes for these youngsters to commit and train hard. Not all are on full time contracts and have other commitments like college and apprenticeships. Not to mention dealing with things like becoming a man. All to have pratts like you pulling them down. Im guessing you've never actually picked up a rugby ball either looking back through your past posts. Clown!
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| Quote Skullcrusher="Skullcrusher"I guess when you say you know your rugby you mean you watching it. Do actually know what it takes for these youngsters to commit and train hard. Not all are on full time contracts and have other commitments like college and apprenticeships. Not to mention dealing with things like becoming a man. All to have pratts like you pulling them down. Im guessing you've never actually picked up a rugby ball either looking back through your past posts. Clown!'"
my bad 'plugger' i wasn't aware that all the academy players under walker that won a grand final were all full time professionals and didnt have to contend with all the off field issues you raised? i bow to the superior knowledge you gained by playing 3 second team games for east leeds. clown
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| Has anyone seen much of Toby Warren?
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| Another game against one of the big 3 Lancashire teams, another disapointing defeat, hope tony smiths performance is part of the review Blease will undoubtedly hold
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Another game against one of the big 3 Lancashire teams, another disapointing defeat, hope tony smiths performance is part of the review Blease will undoubtedly hold'"
Agreed. Do you think Cassell will go onto to be a first teamer,, Matt?
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| Quote ArthurClues="ArthurClues"Agreed. Do you think Cassell will go onto to be a first teamer,, Matt?'"
Yeah, im confident he will, got everything needed to be a quality Super League player
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Another game against one of the big 3 Lancashire teams, another disapointing defeat, hope tony smiths performance is part of the review Blease will undoubtedly hold'"
You would bloody well hope so. The academy has been a mess for a few years now.
I was told that it had got better in the last year or so but defeats like these certainly put a dent in things.
Hopefully its something now Brad is staying he can cast an eye over and make a shrewd appointment.
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| Another awful performance from the academy tonight, going down to Bradford
Really poor
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Another awful performance from the academy tonight, going down to Bradford
Really poor'"
Were you at the game Matt? Was it really as poor as that?
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Another awful performance from the academy tonight, going down to Bradford
Really poor'"
A must win game, too. Surely Grix has to go. Are the players really that average, or just really poorly coached? How can we ever be confident of moving forward at 1st team level when the pipeline just seems so mediocre?
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| Bradford weren’t even at full strength, that’s a real bad loss that one.
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| Bradford's first win this season
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| Quote ArthurClues="ArthurClues"A must win game, too. Surely Grix has to go. Are the players really that average, or just really poorly coached? How can we ever be confident of moving forward at 1st team level when the pipeline just seems so mediocre?'"
I thought it was Tony Smith coached the academy?
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| Quote FGB="FGB"I thought it was Tony Smith coached the academy?'"
Yep, think you are correct. Anyway, off with his head!!!!
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| Blease said in the pod interview that increasing the quality and the number of coaches at all junior levels is one of his top priorities. About time.
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| Something's gone desperately wrong somewhere. At half back we've got Sinfield, who debuted in 2022. Before that the last Academy halfback to play first team was Lilley way back in 2015. Compare that to players who have come through almost every other club in the same time and its embarrassing. A club with our resources can only produce two halfbacks in ten years, one of whom was never good enough and the other yet to really look like the real deal?
It does look finally as though we're starting to see progress with the lads breaking into the first team this year. But if there's one lesson it surely has to be you cannot stop prioritising juniors. There is no harm in finding a Luke Gale even while you have Sinfield, Burrow and McGuire ahead of them. There definitely is harm in good players retiring and not even a glimmer of a replacement coming through.
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| Thing is, if you have the wrong people in the wrong positions then your going to run into self made problems down the line.
We went away from a winning formula, appointing the best we could find regardless of club affiliation etc into a "Jobs for the boys" mentality, now were having our backsides tickled due to this. It been a sword of Damocles problem for many a year as many with greater expertise and insight have constantly maligned and opined.
No disrespect / arrogance implied but we are supposed to be one of the biggest teams in the country, if we want to get to the top consistently and dare I say "cost effectively" then this will only occur (with current salary cap rules etc) with a strong academy pipeline and excellent coaching / scouting respectively.
If this means we have to go to another team and poach / entice them then so be it, we should always be looking to surpass our rivals not catch up / draw level. The coaching side is where the real bang for the buck is, there's no salary cap and we shouldn't scrimp on this side. Go out and get the best we possibly can.
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| Quote Ex-Swarcliffe Rhino="Ex-Swarcliffe Rhino"
We went away from a winning formula, appointing the best we could find regardless of club affiliation etc into a "Jobs for the boys" mentality, now were having our backsides tickled due to this. It been a sword '"
Nail on the head 
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| 2nd year U16's are strong, 9 players from Kippax and 5 from Lock Lane, all the best players from the best 2 teams in Yorkshire, players to look out for:
Robin Smith - Prop
Jack Mears - 13/6
Brennen Townend - Back Row
Jacob Tooala -
Sonny Hetherington - /Fullback
With quite a few more good prospects
1st year U15's, really strange intake, with just 6 of the 20 actually playing in the top division of the Yorkshire League, the other 14 scattered between divisions 2 and 4 and RU. Quite a few of the obvious better players in the Yorkshire league are crossing the penines to Wigan/Warrington etc, on the surface, it looks like we've missed on quite a few. Some could be decisions on what the club think they can become, rather than what they are now, but know we missed on one with big potential who chose Huddersfield over us.
The best U14 team in this age group are West Hull, but we dont seem to look anywhere other than our doorstep these days, which is really dissapointing, Kells U14 in Cumbria are a great team, with lads going to Wigan/Warrington, who recruit from all the hotbeds, but we dont bother. On a side note, the Scholarship players of the year at Saints and Warrington were lads from Siddal
But yeah, apologies for waffling on, strange, but interesting, intake of first years this year
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| Blease has mentioned that targeting juniors from Yorkshire based RU clubs is going to be something they're going to try and do more of.
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| Think Matts is spot on with his assessment of scouting.
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| Tony Smith leaves the club with Chev likely to take his role.
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| Weird. Heard mixed things about Tony but I guess with all the other stuff going off around the club and Blease wanting to make his mark / take advantage of Brad Arthurs advice maybe a good clear out and a refocus is the best for all.
Hopefully with the appointment of Langley and with his stint in the RU code he might have some inside leads into the mesh of juniors / RU clubs that were now looking into. Theres a lot of untapped potential within them for sure, so having someone who was involved in those circles cant be a bad thing and may pay off.
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| I used to work with someone who ended up at Headingley his brother is the kit man.
Nice fella part of his job talent spotting youngsters.
Only problem he did not drive.
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| How do we rate our forward pack heading into the new season.
Potential starting pack:
8. Jay Oladipupo
9. Harvey Butterworth
10. Joe Butterfield
11. Jacob Stead
12. Zak Lloyd
13. Presley Cassell
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| Quote The Eclipse="The Eclipse"How do we rate our forward pack heading into the new season.
Potential starting pack:
8. Jay Oladipupo
9. Harvey Butterworth
10. Joe Butterfield
11. Jacob Stead
12. Zak Lloyd
13. Presley Cassell'"
Extremely talented pack, if developed correctly, should be the best pack in Academy rugby, by a distance.
But there lies the problem, development. Mentioned in the pre-season thread, i cant believe the lack of physical development these second year academy lads look to have had over the last 12 month, granted thats the backs, but they looked tiny, like they hadnt been in a gym for the last year.
Fortunately, the packs got plenty of natural size
7.Smith
6.Brown
Two quality halfs, with Jacob Hardy, who can play backrow, 6 or centre, potentially the best player out of all of them, to fit in somewhere aswel.
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| Yeah to be honest I thought the young backs who played on Boxing Day looked tiny which is worry in the modern game.
Agree the halves look an exciting pair but do we have any big centres coming through ?
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| Quote The Eclipse="The Eclipse"Yeah to be honest I thought the young backs who played on Boxing Day looked tiny which is worry in the modern game.
Agree the halves look an exciting pair but do we have any big centres coming through ?'"
Jacob Tooala and sonny Hetherington are both in their 2nd year of Scholarship this coming season, both among the best in the country in their age group, both play centre for their community clubs. Both got good builds, Hetherington in particular, he's well over 6ft already
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| Ned Mccormack out for the season and Max Simpson out for a further 8 week with a hamstring according to Peter Smith
Its actually unbelievable how many long term injuries our Academy players pick up
Clubs bloody cursed
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| Quote mattsrhinos1978="mattsrhinos1978"Ned Mccormack out for the season and Max Simpson out for a further 8 week with a hamstring according to Peter Smith
Its actually unbelievable how many long term injuries our Academy players pick up
Clubs bloody cursed'"
It really is starting to feel that way. Call in the priests!
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| Hamstrung by hamstrings.
Quite bizarre how many our out with hamstring injury
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Player Coach | 1478 | No Team Selected |
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| Very disappointing news along with Sivo. I have high hopes for McCormack and Simpson and the latest Simpson setback is very concerning.
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Player Coach | 720 | Leeds Rhinos |
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 https://postimg.cc/yDD31g0L" align="left" alt="">  https://i.postimg.cc/kgcQyWGP/20250308-110043.jpg" align="left" alt="">A young reserves team starting their season today
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 https://postimg.cc/yDD31g0L" align="left" alt="">  https://i.postimg.cc/kgcQyWGP/20250308-110043.jpg" align="left" alt="">A young reserves team starting their season today
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Player Coach | 720 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| Nice 22-30 win to get the ball rolling. Interesting to see Qareqare continue playing on the wing after playing and centre and FB previously
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| Great to see the Academy lads beat Wigan by a convincing margin tonight. Good sign.
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| Good to see, missing a couple of our better players aswel. This is the year we need to see it from this group, they were a great scholorship intake, with big expectations, now theyre all top age academy, with a few outstanding first years in the mix aswel, they should be expecting to be the team to beat, good start.
Its been a good start for our development programme
2 from 2 for reserves 1 from 1 for academy 1 from 1 for scholarship
I mentioned Jacob Tooala and Sonny Hetherington to someone asking about young centres in our system earlier in the thread, both started well for the scholarship on thursday night
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International Chairman | 9670 | Leeds Rhinos |
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Feb 2002 | 23 years | |
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| Saw the footage of Tooala scoring from his break. Most impressive thing was his athleticism and balance.
We’ve got a player there if he develops…
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International Chairman | 9670 | Leeds Rhinos |
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Feb 2002 | 23 years | |
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| Saw the footage of Tooala scoring from his break. Most impressive thing was his athleticism and balance.
We’ve got a player there if he develops…
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Club Captain | 2757 | No Team Selected |
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Jan 2020 | 5 years | |
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| mattsrhinos1978:
Good to see, missing a couple of our better players aswel. This is the year we need to see it from this group, they were a great scholorship intake, with big expectations, now theyre all top age academy, with a few outstanding first years in the mix aswel, they should be expecting to be the team to beat, good start.
Its been a good start for our development programme
2 from 2 for reserves 1 from 1 for academy 1 from 1 for scholarship
I mentioned Jacob Tooala and Sonny Hetherington to someone asking about young centres in our system earlier in the thread, both started well for the scholarship on thursday night
A couple of weeks back the club announced they weren't going to partnering up with championship clubs for loan deals. Instead they are going to treat the reserve competition with the respect it should deserve. Great decision in my opinion. Let these kids play together (and hopefully) win together.
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International Chairman | 7501 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| This is something I thought might come from the review that`s been undertaken nationally. All clubs should have a reserve team made up of players from the first team squad that plays each other like the first team does with league places and and play off competition at the end of the season. Games could be played as a double header or midweek to mirror the first teams fixtures. That way there would be no need to loan out players to keep match fit as reserve games would be more competitive.
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International Chairman | 9670 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| If we had genuine franchising (maybe this is coming back…) then the reserve comp could be a mandatory thing (amongst many others) for any team to qualify for SL.
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Player Coach | 1478 | No Team Selected |
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Aug 2009 | 16 years | |
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| Is Tooala the son of Alfie who played for Leeds Tykes?
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International Chairman | 11464 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| mattsrhinos1978:The Eclipse":28khz4d6]How do we rate our forward pack heading into the new season.
Potential starting pack:
8. Jay Oladipupo
9. Harvey Butterworth
10. Joe Butterfield
11. Jacob Stead
12. Zak Lloyd
13. Presley Cassell[/quote:28khz4d6]
Extremely talented pack, if developed correctly, should be the best pack in Academy rugby, by a distance.
But there lies the problem, development. Mentioned in the pre-season thread, i cant believe the lack of physical development these second year academy lads look to have had over the last 12 month, granted thats the backs, but they looked tiny, like they hadnt been in a gym for the last year.
Fortunately, the packs got plenty of natural size
7.Smith
6.Brown
Two quality halfs, with Jacob Hardy, who can play backrow, 6 or centre, potentially the best player out of all of them, to fit in somewhere aswel. Hardy looks one hell of a prospect.
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Player Coach | 720 | Leeds Rhinos |
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Jul 2009 | 16 years | |
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| fanstanningley:
Hardy looks one hell of a prospect.
He really does. Does anyone have any opinions on where he'll end up position wise? It's good to see another exciting back prospect coming through anyway
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Jul 2017 | 8 years | |
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| 6 would probably be his best position, but would be quality anywhere in backrow or centre aswel.
With the make-up of this years Academy, i could see him playing a lot of centre. If i was going to pick a team to win a game from this years squad, it would be:
1. Hutchinson
2. Webster
3. Hardy
4. Thomas
5. Marcus QQ
6. Brown
7. Smith
8. Butterfield
9. Butterworth
10. Oladipupo
11. Stead
12. Lloyd
13. Cassell
14. Diskin
15. Stelfox
16. Tinkler
17. Whittingham
Hardy, Lloyd, Butterworth, Stelfox, Tinkler all first years
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| When you add the likes of the McCormack's, Smith, Simpson and Littlewood to the pool of young players outside of the first team it does look promising. We just need to make sure a few of them come through and hopefully become stars. Any view on the potential of JJB's young lads?
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| Good to see the reserves beat Saints 48 - 0. ECW got a couple. Frawley played too.
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International Chairman | 7501 | Leeds Rhinos |
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Aug 2002 | 23 years | |
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| Arthur said yesterday Frawley would play in the reserves and needs to up his game. Injuries come and he needs to be ready to step in or words to that effect.
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