FORUMS > The Sin Bin > VW |
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| Is it a good time to buy VW shares or is the company finished? Will the scandal affect Audit, Seat, Skoda, Porsche, Bentley, Lamborghini et al too? Will other manufacturers be implicated. Will those of us unwittingly driving dirty diesel's get fined? Will the German-led EU hammer VW or be soft on it? Will executives get jailed? Should they be if the allegations are correct?
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| I wouldn't be surprised at all to see VW officials or executives be jailed in the U.S., along with massive fines and penalties.
The (now) home of the free market usually wastes no time in attacking a foreign business that's in direct competition with its own.
All of course in stark contrast to the banks.
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26.jpg Last league derby at Central Park 5/9/1999: Wigan 28 St. Helens 20
Last league derby at Knowsley Road 2/4/2010: St. Helens 10 Wigan 18:26.jpg |
Moderator
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| What VW has done is obviously going to be treated as fraud and heads will roll but you have to admire the hypocrisy of the yanks.
The top three selling vehicles in August were pickup trucks and in the number two slot with sales of 387,179 in the year to date was the Chevy Silverado which has a six litre petrol engine as standard with a 6.6 litre diesel as an option. Top seller was a Ford with a modest 2.7 litre as one option. Or you could go for 5.0L instead.
Emissions? What emissions!
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13373_1293476827.jpg "I need to be myself, I can't be no-one else":d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_13373.jpg |
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| Is what they did really worth a jail sentence for the top brass at VW?
Surely the fines and penalties imposed will be sufficient, and the dent in the companies profile from here on in enough of a punishment.
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40606.jpg :40606.jpg |
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| VW have deliberately cheated the regulations and defrauded their customers. This isn't just a case of a few maverick traders as he had to have been planned over a long time and sanctioned from the top. Their are sure to be some major class actions against VW.
The software could even involve other companies like Bosch and Siemens!
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International Chairman | 9721 | |
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icons077e_files/5885-54zedonite-msnicons.jpg regards
and ENJOY your sport
Leaguefan
"The Public wants what the Public gets" - Paul Weller:icons077e_files/5885-54zedonite-msnicons.jpg |
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| Quote: Lord Elpers "VW have deliberately cheated the regulations and defrauded their customers. This isn't just a case of a few maverick traders as he had to have been planned over a long time and sanctioned from the top. Their are sure to be some major class actions against VW.
The software could even involve other companies like Bosch and Siemens!'"
You should be delighted.Capitalism and GREED at the fore. Customers, who cares, they don't.
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50733_1530270912.jpg [color=#000000:ogl9gbum]"Back home we got a taxidermy man. He gonna have a heart attack when he see what I brung him."[/color:ogl9gbum]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_50733.jpg |
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| A slap on the wrist and business as usual I would have thought. Can't be seen to be punishing the 'wealth creators'.
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26.jpg Last league derby at Central Park 5/9/1999: Wigan 28 St. Helens 20
Last league derby at Knowsley Road 2/4/2010: St. Helens 10 Wigan 18:26.jpg |
Moderator
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| Quote: Lord Elpers "VW have deliberately cheated the regulations and defrauded their customers. This isn't just a case of a few maverick traders as he had to have been planned over a long time and sanctioned from the top. Their are sure to be some major class actions against VW.
The software could even involve other companies like Bosch and Siemens!'"
I bet whoever did it they thought they were doing nothing particularly wrong.
These engine management systems are constantly monitoring they way the car is being driven and altering the way the engine works including things like how much fuel is injected. They will have the engine behaving differently when it is idling then when tanking down the motorway and they always aim to have the engine be at its most efficient for how the car is bing driven.
Altering the behaviour when sat on a rolling road will just have been another mode of operation to some software engineer to program.
What is interesting is who specified the software to do this and why none for the people involved questioned if this was an acceptable mode of operation. It will have been specified, the spec reviewed, coded ,code reviewed, QA people involved the works as it was developed.
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| Quote: King Street Cat "A slap on the wrist and business as usual I would have thought. Can't be seen to be punishing the 'wealth creators'.'"
Ah but German wealth creators, not American ones. So expect the full reach of the U.S. state agencies to flex their muscles.
And, of course, VW doesn't contribute anywhere near as much to politicians campaigns and parties in the U.S. as others do and have a far bigger union presence. So the crackdown on this cheating, lying socialist organisation will be swift and harsh.
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2051.jpg The older I get, the better I was
Advice is what we seek when we already know the answer - but wish we didn't
I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full-frontal lobotomy
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kirkstaller wrote: "All DNA shows is that we have a common creator."
cod'ead wrote: "I have just snotted weissbier all over my keyboard & screen"
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"No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin." - Aneurin Bevan:2051.jpg |
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| I'm only surprised that people are surprised this has happened. Time will tell but when spot checks are done on other manufacturers' vehicles, we'll probably find that all, to varying degrees, have similar defeat software in their ECUs.
Some USVW execs will probably face jail time because unlike our fawning corporate laws, criminality does not have to come from board level down to be liable. The US EPA is also a very powerful organisation and takes breaches like this very seriously.
Around 15 years ago, I was involved in the vehicle emissions industry and assisted one major truck manufacturer in obtaining a Reduced Pollution Certificate to gain a reduction in VED. The RPC was introduced to encourage early adoption of the next stage of Euro particulate emissions legislation or the fitting of exhaust particulate traps. Particulate was measured by mass and by fitting a simple flow-through catalyst, I could reduce the particulate mass by over 10%, enough to gain RPC. The catalyst did not reduce any soot, all it did was reform the hydrocarbons that agglomerated to the carbon to water and CO2. Definitely not within the spirit of the law but way within the letter of the law
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Club Owner | 2874 | No Team Selected |
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8762_1295775855.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_8762.jpg |
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| I suppose we can all look forward to a whole new set of marketing calls -have you been missold TDI ?
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Rank | Posts | Team |
International Chairman | 14845 | No Team Selected |
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Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
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143_1357419061.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_143.jpg |
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| As it seems that EU and UK politicians (among others) were (allegedly) aware of all this it shows the hypocrisy at both political and business level in exploiting "green" concerns. I always take the attitude that most businesses who promote their green credentials are shysters and this scandal supports my prejudice. IMO he Germans promote a green political agenda via their EU power to benefit German manufactures - eg wind turbine makers and I guess via this scandal? So lets have a few politicians as well as VW employees facing the music (it ain't going to happen).
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Rank | Posts | Team |
International Board Member | 37704 | No Team Selected |
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May 2002 | 22 years | |
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2051.jpg The older I get, the better I was
Advice is what we seek when we already know the answer - but wish we didn't
I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full-frontal lobotomy
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kirkstaller wrote: "All DNA shows is that we have a common creator."
cod'ead wrote: "I have just snotted weissbier all over my keyboard & screen"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin." - Aneurin Bevan:2051.jpg |
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| Quote: Dally "As it seems that EU and UK politicians (among others) were (allegedly) aware of all this it shows the hypocrisy at both political and business level in exploiting "green" concerns. I always take the attitude that most businesses who promote their green credentials are shysters and this scandal supports my prejudice. IMO he Germans promote a green political agenda via their EU power to benefit German manufactures - eg wind turbine makers and I guess via this scandal? So lets have a few politicians as well as VW employees facing the music (it ain't going to happen).'"
Whereas we have a government that pre-2010 were promoting themselves as the greenest ever. While in partnership with the LimpDems, they were restrained from ditching their superficial environmental credentials entirely.
Since May, they have had no such restrictions and have gone balls-out to show just what they really think of the environment. This is epitomised by that economic illiterate Osborne's decision in July to tax cleaan power stations at the same rate as dirty ones. That decision led to DRAX losing 1/3 of its value and the cvompany announcing that it was withdrawing from developing Carbon Capture & Sequestration technologies.
Green tories my 'arris
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50733_1530270912.jpg [color=#000000:ogl9gbum]"Back home we got a taxidermy man. He gonna have a heart attack when he see what I brung him."[/color:ogl9gbum]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_50733.jpg |
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| Meanwhile back in the good ol' US of States, GM have announced the specs for the 2016 Chevrolet Silverado, the country's second best selling pick up truck. You can either have it with a modest 6 litre Vortec V8 or a slightly bigger 6.6 litre Duramax V8 turbo diesel.
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| They are ALL cheating the regulations. As is usual with high-profile cases involving the state vs a major international corporation - the alleged infringement is insignificant next to the politics surrounding it.
No different to the EU's incessant targeting of IT companies such as Microsoft and Google.
No one seriously believes the EU is motivated primarily by the customer's interests. It's all politics.
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