Removing Gadaffi and leaving a vacuum behind to be filled by jihadis has worked really well for Libya and the rest of us.

Cameron was eager to act as the international statesman when he was supporting airstrikes. Where is he now?

Shades of Iraq.

When you create these failed states you create opportunists for extremists.

Because the police don't have the resource to respond appropriately; Mrs May was warned directly of this by the Police Fed conference in 2013 - where an officer she had previously presented the Community Police Officer of the Year award to, stood up and said he had since resigned, because her cuts had decimated community policing, meaning that they weren't able to gather intelligence from local communities about activities like this, because there weren't enough of them.

Spin it however you like, but deploying the army is not an inevitable result of the threat level being raised to critical; that's happened twice before, without the army being used to replaced police - it's happened because our Tory austerity police force can't respond.

Every now and again the Police get stretched so we supplement them with the Army. Big deal. Why pay over the top for coppers we don't need day to day, plus it was an opportunity to drive out the dead wood As a result, tests taken by the Metropolitan Police in 2011 found that just 25 per cent of male officers and staff were of normal weight, with 52 per cent overweight, 22 per cent obese and 1 per cent morbidly obese. Of the women surveyed, 50 per cent were of normal weight with 32 per cent overweight, 16 per cent obese and 2 per cent morbidly obese. www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... tests.html Typical poorly managed public sector organisation

Every now and again the Police get stretched so we supplement them with the Army. Big deal. Why pay over the top for coppers we don't need day to day, plus it was an opportunity to drive out the dead wood As a result, tests taken by the Metropolitan Police in 2011 found that just 25 per cent of male officers and staff were of normal weight, with 52 per cent overweight, 22 per cent obese and 1 per cent morbidly obese. Of the women surveyed, 50 per cent were of normal weight with 32 per cent overweight, 16 per cent obese and 2 per cent morbidly obese. www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... tests.html Typical poorly managed public sector organisation

Why should police staff be watching their weight any more than you or me?

Rather distressing posts from Fire men who were not allowed to attend for "health and safety reasons". https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_ ... ction_list

Rather distressing posts from Fire men who were not allowed to attend for "health and safety reasons". https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_ ... ction_list

Because I sit in an office all day as a job. They are expected to chase criminals and being fat doesn't help that.

Yep - Bobbies spend their working hours chasing stripey jumper clad bad guys down our streets.

You're an idiot.

I'm afraid you're displaying your ignorance there. Police staff don't chase criminals. Police officers do that.

As a former member of police staff I speak from experience.

Your figures quoted police officers AND staff. I'd be interested in the figures for just officers.

Sometimes facts don't fit with your prejudice.

Come back when you've got the right numbers before slagging off people that keep you safe.

22 years in the Army tells me there is no place for fatties in an active job like the Military and Police. Go on tell me all the England rugby team are clinically obese on the scale.

If they aren't chasing criminals they should be privatised.

In the bar one night you're getting beaten up by 6 blokes. You have a choice of assistance, would you pick a Constable Fred Astaire, or a Constable William "The Refrigerator" Perry?

Please don't talk common sense, it's not welcome in modern Britain. Also, your post was hate speech, i shall be reporting you to the thought crime division.

Good day, sir

It's hard to disagree with any of this.

However, what "hard & unpopular" decisions do you want our politicians to take ?
Everyone seems to acknowledge that the UK's involvement alongside the Bush administration was wrong and "toppling" Hussain and Gadaffi has had an adverse effect on making that area or the world outside any safer.

How do you defeat an unseen enemy ?

Bin Laden was taken out but, there is always another mad man to take his place.
I dont think that "we" know how to solve this one.

I fully agree. What we can do though is make it far more difficult for those known or flagged up to the police and intelligence agencies to operate. We have to stop worrying about the possibility that we may offend somebody from a particular nation or of a particular belief by taking a hard line. This is not about discrimination, it is about doing all that is possible to keep the nation as a whole as safe as possible.

So, are you saying that if someone is being "watched" by the security services, that we intern them.
Lock them up indefinitely, just in case or, in this case ban someone born in Britain, from re entering the UK.
Whilst the sentiment is good, I just dont see how it can happen.
Those that have gone to fight/support in Syria and then come back to the UK, again, do we lock them up in some Guantanamo type compound and again, how long for.
I am not defending these mindless terrorists but, some of the suggestions coming out in the wake of this atrocity just dont work.
Is there a known target where we can "hit back" and what effect would this have ?
Would it help to solve the problem or aid the recruitment process for ISIS. ?

That's exactly what we do have to worry about; the more disaffected and disenfranchised these people are made to feel, the more open they are to being radicalised and exploited by ISIS and its ilk.

I understand that people feel hurt and want to hit back - but we've been bombing these places for years, and as at least one party leader has had the bottle to point out today, that has played a large part in creating the problem.

some of these things can happen if there is a will to make them happen. Will they work? impossible to say, but you won't know unless you try.

Obviously ISIS and the extremists out there, we will not be able to completely eliminate... they are living amongst us and those willing to die for a cause by any means, how do you stop that? you can't is the simple answer but again we have to make it as difficult as possible for them to operate and i think that is far from the case at the moment.

Or you make a knee jerk reaction and make things far worse because you did it with no idea of whether it would work or not.

If it's impossible to say then don't do it. The consequences are too serious for making policy on a whim. You need to properly weigh up the evidence.

There is no simple solution IMO. A lot of things need to happen and it can't just be done in this country. It needs to happen elsewhere too.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05 ... um=twitter Maybe security services need to improve a bit too?

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05 ... um=twitter Maybe security services need to improve a bit too?

How exactly do you plan to "make it as difficult as possible for them to operate" ?
Empty words and idle threats may make some people feel better but, it's just rhetoric.

They do but isn't the official line at the moment 3,000 plus on the flagged up list? that's a lot of fish to keep in the net.

What do you suggest we just let ISIS walk in anywhere they like and do whatever they want? These are not people with whom you can have a rational discussion.

Empty threats and idle words from who? If you are referring to our establishment you are bang on.

I don't think bombing is the answer, never was never will be and it is the contributor as to why we are where we are today imo.

It would be relatively simple for anyone to cause multiple deaths, with far, far worse casualties than Manchester. There is nothing we can do to prevent it, save locking everyone up. The best we can do is create an environment where people do not want to do it because they identify it is morally wrong.

Yes but are talking about real life not idealistic wonderment.

Do you think you could have talked Hitler out of doing what he did or Pol Pot or the genocide in Rwanda?