Indeed
It's most significant that Le Penn's share of the vote, although strong in the first round at 35%, didn't budge in the second round and she again polled 35% (or pretty damn close).
My prediction of 6/7 weeks ago was bang on



Thankfully the vast majority of French, German, Dutch and English voters have said NO to the far right.

Having said that, something has to be done to slow the exodus from Africa, which seems to be the main influx of people into Europe.

What people voting for the unknown !
That would never happen in good old Blighty





You talk about no manifesto, which is still probably better than utter nonsense and drivel.

Yours

Snowflake

Indeed. That's a bit difficult for the populists though.

IMO there needs to be a combination of pressure and incentives on certain countries with the aim of improving conditions there. Only when issues such as war, poverty and the effects of climate change are addressed will the migration slow down.

Think Africa needs a country to "do a Turkey" when it comes to dealing with migrants. It will cost billions but it would prevent a lot of migrants coming to Europe. Trouble is nowhere in Africa seems anywhere close to Turkey in being able to do that.

Simply pulling up the drawbridge and ignoring it won't work.

I agree.
It's a crazy state of affairs when gangs of criminals can be allowed to charge desperate people significant cash on the "chance" of getting to Europe.
Although it would be utterly wrong to deny refuge to genuine asylum seekers, permitting "organised" mass movement is just wrong, on a number of levels.

It would seem harsh to rescue these people and return them to the port that they left but, without something like this, the problem will continue to grow.

As you suggest, with some dialogue and even some "incentives" between the most affected nations, on would expect that the numbers could be heavily reduced.

Of course, it suits some factions to portray all of this as "free movement" within the EU but there are multiple issues and they clearly need addressing.

Western countries need to agree a common approach to "persuade" the worst countries to sort themselves out. They also need to sort out neighbouring countries to ensure they can look after refugees.

It costs money - the reason for the foreign aid budget. Otherwise they'll turn up anyway.

A lot of what is wrong with Africa is down to western policy (e.g Libya) and it would be in our long term interests to sort it out.

Radicalisation always increases in chaotic places and situations. Sort that out and people turn away from it. However it's easier said than done.

It's a long term problem that won't be sorted overnight and doesn't play well with populists and electioneering.

Have they? We are leaving the EU (UKIP influenced) and we are about to vote in a hard Brexit leader on a landslide majority like never seen before. That's hardly socialism.

The Frogs were never going to vote for the right. If one country in the EU epitomises socialism its them. Unions, strikes, nationalism, overly complex and expensive workers rights, high welfare bill........

And in other news, the Tories have stolen another of Labour's policies on energy tariffs.

Although the UK followed Mr FArage out of Europe and he would be described as "Right Wing", people now look to have abandoned UKIP, which is certainly a NO or non, to the right wing.

T May is trying to please everyone at the moment left, Right and in between.
She'll probably appear on TV with all her Scottish "relatives" soon, it's no wonder we've had strong winds this week.
She appears to be following Trumps campaign and is just saying anything that sounds popular.
No credibility whatsoever.

She is just copying Blair who copied Clinton - it all about presentation something completely lost on the likes of Corbyn, McDonald and Abbot.

Of course they have UKIPs job is done now pass it to the Party who will deliver it. Its no different to a salesman opening the door of a client and winning the contract. Once that happens pass it to the specialist/techs to deliver the product



She could offer nation saving policies such as add 4 more public holidays to the 8 we get, Remove the parking fees at hospitals or critically tax private health insurance to a higher rate. At least we know we are in good hands under the red flag



Its creditworthy listening to Corbyn, Abbott and the rest of the reserves he has on his bench

Let’s say from the two evils French chose Macron, but still looks like they are not very happy.
These days I often meet French people, very few want to live in France, most of young people move to French speaking Belgium and Switzerland, sometimes to Germany, Netherlands or States.
I have spoken with a 29 year old French living in Germany, and he claims that for him it is impossible to live in Paris and have the same quality of life like he has in Germany. He’s got a good job in logistics and earns nearly twice more than in France, he can afford to buy apartment in Berlin [urlhttps://tranio.com/germany/berlin/apartments/[/url while in Paris he says no one of his age can, he feels more secure abroad, speaking no German and being a foreigner.

What point are you trying to make ?

I had some visitors from France a couple of months ago and they were explaining how the electoral system worked over there and they called the result exactly how it ended, with Le Penn getting 35% but remaining at 35% in the second round and that the remaining voters would line up against Le Penn in the second round.
At least they turned their backs on the hard line right wing.
Germany has taken huge numbers of immigrants and been the most "welcoming" nation, numbers that massively dwarf those coming into the UK.
The housing issue is a problem in all capital cities and perhaps more and more will follow the New York model, where everyone lives in the suburbs and commutes into the city to work.
We have just the same problem in London and it's just as bad in Dublin.

A bit off topic, but, you don't appear to know much about New York or London

What, ordinary people priced out of living in the capital cities ?

So MOST young French people go to live abroad do they? Interesting 'fact' that.

Quantify 'ordinary'.

Firstly, that's not what you said, you said "everyone" and secondly, as far as New York is concerned I presume that you were basing your misguided opinion on Manhattan, rather than the five boroughs that make up New York City? Quite a lot of people live in Manhattan anyway admittedly in expensive real estate, but, in the Bronx, Brooklyn, Queens and Staten Island there are plenty of neighbourhoods where "ordinary" people live.

The City of London is a different animal altogether, but, then I do wonder what you think qualifies as London in your model?

Let's go for, anyone on "average" wages, wanting to live within 15/20 mins of "The City", especially if they want to buy a property.
Places that would cost £200,000 in the north of England, comfortably selling at over £1,000,000.

Of course, people who have lived down there and not "cashed in" their property can afford to live in "Central London" but, unless you are on mega bucks, you aren't going to be able to buy there.
Of course, there are some exceptions.

A substantial amount of people from Hoboken and jersey city commute the short distance across the Hudson to manhattan . Unfortunately some of the working class areas in these communities have been gentrified . Property prices have shot up, pricing the average wage earners out of the market. As in London if you bought years ago you are quids in or should I say dollars in.
As in London some of the journey times people undertake to commute to New York from outlying areas are staggering.

So, the first murmurings today of the EU wanting to regulate clearing of their own transactions, 70% of which take place in the City and which generate huge revenue for our financial sector.

Also, listening to the Conservative MP, Bill Cash, on 5 live today, it seems like much of the groundwork for the Brexit negotiations is already laid out and remaining in the single market or access to it are not going to be possible, regardless of the make up of the new coalition government.

Where are all the Brexitiers who said that there would be no problem getting a free trade deal.

No worries. Putin is now looking after the USA and UK.

What a FOOKING mess we are in. Our lead negotiator is as Thick as mince and as lazy as a toad. www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 45911.html And we are currently being manipulated by a group of individuals who are more interested in their power games to be next Tory leader than representing the national interest. Gove Hammond. Davis et al.

What a FOOKING mess we are in. Our lead negotiator is as Thick as mince and as lazy as a toad. www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 45911.html And we are currently being manipulated by a group of individuals who are more interested in their power games to be next Tory leader than representing the national interest. Gove Hammond. Davis et al.

Quote ="Durham Giant"What a FOOKING mess we are in. Our lead negotiator is as Thick as mince and as lazy as a toad. www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 45911.html And we are currently being manipulated by a group of individuals who are more interested in their power games to be next Tory leader than representing the national interest. Gove Hammond. Davis et al.'" You're citing an Indy article and expecting it to be taken seriously? Especially one quoting a man called a 'career psychopath' by David Cameron ffs, and known for stabbing Johnson in the back, for being Gove's wing man, and for being incredibly bitter about the Brexit process which has left him in the cold? FFS, the Tories could find a cure for cancer and the Indy would immediately condemn them for not doing it quickly enough and for not having enough working class black Muslim lesbians from tower blocks on their team.

Quote ="Durham Giant"What a FOOKING mess we are in. Our lead negotiator is as Thick as mince and as lazy as a toad. www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 45911.html And we are currently being manipulated by a group of individuals who are more interested in their power games to be next Tory leader than representing the national interest. Gove Hammond. Davis et al.'" You're citing an Indy article and expecting it to be taken seriously? Especially one quoting a man called a 'career psychopath' by David Cameron ffs, and known for stabbing Johnson in the back, for being Gove's wing man, and for being incredibly bitter about the Brexit process which has left him in the cold? FFS, the Tories could find a cure for cancer and the Indy would immediately condemn them for not doing it quickly enough and for not having enough working class black Muslim lesbians from tower blocks on their team.

In your imagination?



I'm sure you can google a couple of examples, but as far as I - and pretty much everyone with any modicum of intelligence - have always known, leaving the EU means leaving the single market - for the simple fact the feckin idiotic ideal of freedom of movement has been judged a failure by the British Electorate not only in the EU Referendum, but also the General Election. Why would anyone expect to reject one part of the single market and benefit from the rest?

For clarity, it also means leaving the customs union (or the protectionist customs barrier as it should be known).

No-one ever said it would be easy. We should never have ended up in the grip of the EU in the first place. Extracting yourself from a protectionist cartel is never easy, but it is necessary.

Ideally, we can agree a sort of single market/customs union 'lite' - without the stupid ideals but many of the benefits, even if they come at some minimum tariff, and I imagine that's what the aim is.

Quote ="Cronus"icon_lol.gif You're citing an Indy article and expecting it to be taken seriously? Especially one quoting a man called a 'career psychopath' by David Cameron ffs, and known for stabbing Johnson in the back, for being Gove's wing man, and for being incredibly bitter about the Brexit process which has left him in the cold? FFS, the Tories could find a cure for cancer and the Indy would immediately condemn them for not doing it quickly enough and for not having enough working class black Muslim lesbians from tower blocks on their team.'" More evidence for the story from more left wing sources The daily mail www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... mince.html London evening standard www.standard.co.uk/news/politics ... 90086.html The sun https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/4038242/e ... w-deepens/ Seems like you have turned into our own Donald Trump. Anything reported in the press you don't like is fake news.

Quote ="Cronus"icon_lol.gif You're citing an Indy article and expecting it to be taken seriously? Especially one quoting a man called a 'career psychopath' by David Cameron ffs, and known for stabbing Johnson in the back, for being Gove's wing man, and for being incredibly bitter about the Brexit process which has left him in the cold? FFS, the Tories could find a cure for cancer and the Indy would immediately condemn them for not doing it quickly enough and for not having enough working class black Muslim lesbians from tower blocks on their team.'" More evidence for the story from more left wing sources The daily mail www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... mince.html London evening standard www.standard.co.uk/news/politics ... 90086.html The sun https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/4038242/e ... w-deepens/ Seems like you have turned into our own Donald Trump. Anything reported in the press you don't like is fake news.