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| Moderator | 36786 | Hull FC |
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| Jul 2003 | 22 years | |
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| Jan 2025 | May 2023 | LINK |
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| Quote Vicenzo="Vicenzo"Mind you, he is a scientist so his mind is probably way ahead of mere mortals!'"
I've mentioned this before, but you have some rather strange ideas about scientists.  |
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| Club Owner | 7735 | No
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| Feb 2004 | 21 years | |
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| Mar 2025 | May 2022 | LINK |
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| Quote Gordon Gekko="Gordon Gekko"There is no absolute proof that this person exists unless long term liabilities (£737k) are made up of directors loans from the said 'person' which would lessen the overall net liability somewhat in the short/medium term.
Also if you want a direct comparison with the performance of Hull you would have to look at Hulls books after their first S/L season, the season which these accounts are produced for. Remember Hull have had 7 years of S/L handouts to get where they are now.
Neither Clubs accounts make particularly good reading but nor do most RL clubs, and with Hull about to commit £2m to their training facility i would say theirs are about to take a turn for the worse as there is no evidence that this money can be raised without considerable borrowing, thus incurring more debt.'"
Why, did rovers not trade during the period they were not in SL?
What was the average gate in '07? Close to 8000, yet a loss of over £400k. Thats the worrying part.
Agreed that neither sets of A/cs look good, but you are off the mark with your comment about Hull proposed investment. At last they will have a few more tangible assets to their name which will match off the liability of any borrowings when first recognised, therefore that should not impact on the net asset / liability position. |
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| Club Owner | 7735 | No
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| Feb 2004 | 21 years | |
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| Quote Vicenzo="Vicenzo"I've said many times that abbreviated accounts do not give enough information to form a real opinion. I have sent for Rovers to look at but I will say about yours, unlike you I do not look at them like an accountant but as a director/investor. I calculate that the present situation is that they are in a negative position to the tune of £1.573 million. I calculate this by completely removing the intangibles, halving the tangibles to reflect the true (firesale) valuation and removing the debtors amount which we have all agreed (I think) do not belong in the accounts to y/e 2007 as they are apparently for the following season. Lets be honest, if the club folded in the October of 2007 you could hardly count them could you?
Remember, I do not do "account speak" I look at the true value of the company (Hull SL) and this is the nearest to the truth. I do know someone who has seen the full balance sheet when he attempting to buy the club and he walked away from it saying there was an undisclosed "blackhole"'"
Having Hull SL's abbreviated accounts didn't stop you forming a fairly damning opinion in the past 
The tangibled you halved were only revalued to market value in the year to those accounts so halving them is unrealistic.
The fact remains Vince, that rovers lost over £400k in their first season in the top flight and have a must worse net liability position. If I recall you warned many Hull fans that the end of the world was just around the corner a few years ago on the back of some abbreviateds but you seem strangley calm about rovers situation. |
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| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 12741 | Hull FC |
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| Nov 2006 | 19 years | |
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| Quote Vicenzo="Vicenzo"I might add that I am more upset about Jimmy Bullards injury than the finances of both clubs put together!'"
How peculiar, Vince doesn't want to talk finances all of a sudden. 
I wonder why that is?  |
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| Player Coach | 682 | No
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| Nov 2006 | 18 years | |
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| Feb 2018 | Sep 2016 | LINK |
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| WHO BLOODY CARES??!!
You all really need to get out more 
Enjoy the season of RL coming up, that's what it's all about. |
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| Club Owner | 7735 | No
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| Feb 2004 | 21 years | |
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| Quote Vicenzo="Vicenzo"You do that, I couldn't care less. Like I said before, an abbbreviated balance sheet does not give a true story. If Hull SL are owed so much money at the end of 2007 (Oct) it can only be for the next season and is therefore not relevant to that years figures.I assume they issue invoices for snsorship etc for the next season but date them in the current financial year, it is not the way I was taught to run a company. If the Directors insist to their accountants that they wish it be included then so be it. I said at the beginning, I look at a balance sheet not throught the eyes of an accountant. I will go further and say that a companies true worth cannot be declared unless it goes into liquidation. That is why I say that if the debtors included in the 2007 y/e refers to the next year I am nearer the true valuation than what is shown. I have NEVER said anywhere that Rovers are in a better position than anyone else. As to Kosh joining in, its strange is it not that he choses to do so when he does not afford me the opportunity of doing the same thing on your boards. In fact, he went even further and banned some poor sucker because he suspected it was me. I'd like to see what part of the AUP covers such an action. Mind you, he is a scientist so his mind is probably way ahead of mere mortals!
Just for interest, who do you think will owe the company over £500k to the year ending 2007?'"
Thats the biggest load of tosh you have posted for some time.
A companies true worth is n othing to do with its balance sheet. Its what someone is prepared to pay for it. Usually what someone is prepared to pay for it is based on all the inherent factors which are virtually impossible to value (customer base, perceived quality, brand etc - or put another way, the companies future profitability potential).
You seem to confuse the role accountants have in business with your bad experiance of ONE which you chose in the past. Who do you think corporate finance and due dillegance are? |
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| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Club Coach | 461 | No
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| Feb 2005 | 20 years | |
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| Quote Mrs Barista="Mrs Barista"Hull have had more income over the last few years but have also had much high outgoings including a players wage bill of £1.6m vs one of £0.4m.
I agree that neither club is in a brilliant state financially but the size of the loss Rovers made in 2007 is pretty worrying considering the playing roster that season when Paul Cooke and Mick Vella were pretty much the only big names. The payroll costs will have increased in 2008 with Newton, Galea, Crossman, Jake Webster, paying James Webster for a full season and Dobson for half - this isn't speculation as the club are on the record that they were much nearer the salary cap in 08 than 07. Crossland has also said you've increased youth development expenditure so that's an extra drain on resources. The point is that unless something startling has happened to Rovers business model it's unlikely that 2008 accounts will show a much improved position so the debt figures could well increase.
I agree that FC's level of debt will increase with the new training centre, but depending on how any ground developments at Rovers are funded, so will theirs.
Now the accounts are finally available and a bit grim, I would challenge Hudgell's claim dismissing people speculating about Rovers finances as mischief-makers.'"
Judging by the number of postings from you on this board and the fact you bookmark anything relating to Hull KR you appear to have an addiction to the club. |
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| Player Coach | 5139 | No
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| Sep 2006 | 19 years | |
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| Quote Mild mannered Janitor="Mild mannered Janitor"Having Hull SL's abbreviated accounts didn't stop you forming a fairly damning opinion in the past
The tangibled you halved were only revalued to market value in the year to those accounts so halving them is unrealistic.
The fact remains Vince, that rovers lost over £400k in their first season in the top flight and have a must worse net liability position. If I recall you warned many Hull fans that the end of the world was just around the corner a few years ago on the back of some abbreviateds but you seem strangley calm about rovers situation.'"
The loss you are referring to should also take into account the fact that its a 15 months accounting period with the extra three months being Sept, Oct and Nov where income is virtually non existant, yet fixed costs such as salaries still have to be paid, this will clearly adversely affect the profitablilty of the company in that period.
The next accounts for a 12 month period will offer a much better indication of performance. |
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| Club Coach | 1802 | No
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| Quote Kosh="Kosh"I've mentioned this before, but you have some rather strange ideas about scientists.
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Like I said, when I am allowed to debate with you on all forums I will respond. I am waiting for the AUP which allows you to ban people who you THINK are someone else. It could be interesting. Over to you Homer! |
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| Quote Mild mannered Janitor="Mild mannered Janitor"Having Hull SL's abbreviated accounts didn't stop you forming a fairly damning opinion in the past
The tangibled you halved were only revalued to market value in the year to those accounts so halving them is unrealistic.
The fact remains Vince, that rovers lost over £400k in their first season in the top flight and have a must worse net liability position. If I recall you warned many Hull fans that the end of the world was just around the corner a few years ago on the back of some abbreviateds but you seem strangley calm about rovers situation.'"
The tangibles are halved to reflect not their "market" value but a firesale valuation. Even 50% is generous in those circumstances |
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| Club Coach | 1802 | No
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| Jul 2005 | 20 years | |
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| Quote Mild mannered Janitor="Mild mannered Janitor"Thats the biggest load of tosh you have posted for some time.
A companies true worth is n othing to do with its balance sheet. Its what someone is prepared to pay for it. Usually what someone is prepared to pay for it is based on all the inherent factors which are virtually impossible to value (customer base, perceived quality, brand etc - or put another way, the companies future profitability potential).
You seem to confuse the role accountants have in business with your bad experiance of ONE which you chose in the past. Who do you think corporate finance and due dillegance are?'"
"Due diligance" is something the accountants of Nat West, HBos,Sandfords,Lloyds TSb....etc. etc carried out over many years only to find in the end they had actually been valuing worthless bits of paper called "derivatives" etc.. Unfortunately for the world they had their noses
stuck so firmly in the corporate troughs, they failed to recognise this!
I rest my case! |
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