FORUMS > Hull KR > "who knows what the next 2 or 3 years has in store ?&qu |
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33809_1522680904.png 'Thus I am tormented by my curiosity and humbled by my ignorance.' from History of an Old Bramin, The New York Mirror (A Weekly Journal Devoted to Literature and the Fine Arts), February 16th 1833.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_33809.png |
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| Quote: berrigans bitch "I agree, however I believe the problem may be that although he runs a successful business, he appears not to be as successful with running the club, I believe this is because he is a fan and it gets personal who knows, however whilst this is happening I am not sure he will get the backing he wants, I believe it would be beneficial for the club to put in some-one who will approach it as a business venture, not be interested in fc and stay focused on their own club without petty rivalry, until this happens I am afraid the problems will carry on and investment will not be so forth coming.'"
Some interesting points. However, I think to date NH has done a spectacularly successful job of running the club - as a club, if not a business. Would we rather be breaking even each year in the Championship, with no prospect of ever getting a SL licence or be where Rovers are today, warts and all? I believe the B&W assessments of NH are made because they are fans and it gets personal - who knows?
If it had been treated as a purely business venture, Rovers would never have got a SL license. Also moving forward, would it not appear more incongruous for a profitable business venture to be receiving public money in such straitened times, rather than supporting an important community asset?
Tbh, I don't think sports clubs should benefit from public support. But they do and I don't see why Hull KR shouldn't ask for a slice of the pie. Though it might appear to be petty rivalry, reminding people of the support Hull FC have received is a useful political tool. Just speculating, but the £300k that was secured from the for the east stand extension may not have been won by somebody uninterested in the doings of Hull FC - there is certainly a competition for resources. It is both useful and, sadly, easy for NH to present Rovers (and by implication therefore, East Hull) as having had the rough end of things in recent years.
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fonds blancs/Sid.gif I have lost interest:fonds blancs/Sid.gif |
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| However, I think to date NH has done a spectacularly successful job of running the club - as a club, if not a business.
I could have done that as well by going £450,000 over budget for 3 years with no real assets to secure the debt against. How can you say he has done a good job ????? Team has done well but what has that got to do with a loss of £450,000 each year. Look at Widnes
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| I think part of the problem is that there is not enough local commercial money in the city for three top flight professional clubs.
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Mo. "Show Homer the exit Barney"
Barney. "There's an exit?": |
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| Quote: Nobeerineasthull "The flaw in your argument is that the directors are also the shareholders i.e. the owners of the club.
All business owners have to be ready to put money into their business when its needed.
If the director/shareholders want their money back, the business can repay them (as and when it can afford it) or they can sell it to someone else and get their money back that way.
There is no flaw in the argument. The directors of Hull SL are now after a few years having their loans (which they took out of the club in the first place) repaid over a period of time. Hudgell seems to be pointing out that the club has to stand on its own as does every sports club. It will be interesting to see if there is any "debt repayment" following SL's disatrous season just passed...I doubt it!
p.s.
The suggestion that the director/shareholders would simply demand their loans back and wind up the club in order to get it is fanciful as it would render their shares worthless.'"
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Mo. "Show Homer the exit Barney"
Barney. "There's an exit?": |
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| Quote: Kosh "Put the sock away. There is no 'rent' on the KC, for a start.'"
Who told you that? Was it the word famous "Wilf rent-free Rosenburg" by any chance?
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Mo. "Show Homer the exit Barney"
Barney. "There's an exit?": |
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| Quote: Vicenzo "Who told you that? Was it the word famous "Wilf rent-free Rosenburg" by any chance?'"
I meant to say "world famous" but it works just as well don'tyou think?
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40452_1335639638.jpg [img:218z2l9g]http://i40.tinypic.com/tz8ti.jpg[/img:218z2l9g]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_40452.jpg |
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| Quote: Mild Rover "Some interesting points. However, I think to date NH has done a spectacularly successful job of running the club - as a club, if not a business. Would we rather be breaking even each year in the Championship, with no prospect of ever getting a SL licence or be where Rovers are today, warts and all? I believe the B&W assessments of NH are made because they are fans and it gets personal - who knows?
That is the crux, to survive in top flight it has to be viewed as a business in order to survive, he may be great for the fans mixing in the east stand, on occasions passing remarks about his rivals (fc), kr fans love all this, nice and cosy..however he is losing half a million a year!! would you not sooner have more financial stability some-one who has no interest in us and is only focused on your club,or are you happy Hudge who loves to get one over his rivals and imo overspends in his quest to do this, Cooke, Dobson
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33809_1522680904.png 'Thus I am tormented by my curiosity and humbled by my ignorance.' from History of an Old Bramin, The New York Mirror (A Weekly Journal Devoted to Literature and the Fine Arts), February 16th 1833.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_33809.png |
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| Quote: Tarquin Fuego "
I could have done that as well by going £450,000 over budget for 3 years with no real assets to secure the debt against. How can you say he has done a good job ????? Team has done well but what has that got to do with a loss of £450,000 each year. Look at Widnes'"
You're assuming an investment budget of £0. And unless you are wealthy (ie would be willing and able to spend £1.35 million over 3 years), no you couldn't. On the other hand, I'm pretty confident that given a council-built state of the art stadium and a team that had just been to Old Trafford, that I could have matched the performance of Hull board over the same 3 year period.
I do look at Widnes - they are a very good comparator. They were rescued from administration by a wealthy benefactor in 2007. They have have a lovely, but rarely very full, stadium that was built in partnership with Halton Borough Council, where they host their Championship and NRC fixtures. All of which reflects rather well on the Stewardship of NH, IMO.
The team has done well and that has been crucial making the club more than mere SL makeweights. In fact many clubs use the performance of their team as an important metric of success.
You ask how I can say he has done a good job. Well look at where the club were when he started and look where they are now. I'm hardly a lone voice in the wilderness on this
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6505_1460484023.jpg [i:10za56ci]Hold on to me baby, his bony hands will do you no harm
It said in the cards, we lost our souls to the Nameless One[/i:10za56ci]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_6505.jpg |
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| Quote: Vicenzo "Who told you that?'"
It's a matter of public record.
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40452_1335639638.jpg [img:218z2l9g]http://i40.tinypic.com/tz8ti.jpg[/img:218z2l9g]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_40452.jpg |
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| Quote: Mild Rover "You're assuming an investment budget of £0. And unless you are wealthy (ie would be willing and able to spend £1.35 million over 3 years), no you couldn't. On the other hand, I'm pretty confident that given a council-built state of the art stadium and a team that had just been to Old Trafford, that I could have matched the performance of Hull board over the same 3 year period.
I do look at Widnes - they are a very good comparator. They were rescued from administration by a wealthy benefactor in 2007. They have have a lovely, but rarely very full, stadium that was built in partnership with Halton Borough Council, where they host their Championship and NRC fixtures. All of which reflects rather well on the Stewardship of NH, IMO.
The team has done well and that has been crucial making the club more than mere SL makeweights. In fact many clubs use the performance of their team as an important metric of success.
You ask how I can say he has done a good job. Well look at where the club were when he started and look where they are now. I'm hardly a lone voice in the wilderness on this
Catalans ?
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33809_1522680904.png 'Thus I am tormented by my curiosity and humbled by my ignorance.' from History of an Old Bramin, The New York Mirror (A Weekly Journal Devoted to Literature and the Fine Arts), February 16th 1833.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_33809.png |
Moderator
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| Quote: berrigans bitch "That is the crux, to survive in top flight it has to be viewed as a business in order to survive, he may be great for the fans mixing in the east stand, on occasions passing remarks about his rivals (fc), kr fans love all this, nice and cosy..however he is losing half a million a year!! would you not sooner have more financial stability some-one who has no interest in us and is only focused on your club,or are you happy Hudge who loves to get one over his rivals and imo overspends in his quest to do this, Cooke, Dobson'"
That may be true for Rovers, [igoing forward[/i, but the fact 11 teams (I'll discount Bradford's very small loss this year) are losing money, shows that clubs are often not viewed as a business, were profitability is paramount. They have often been and will likely continue to be a way for wealthy men to get their kicks, [iin many cases[/i.
The link you seem to be making between the losses and NH's keeness to get one over on Hull, is a false one. They are not linked. Signing Cooke added quality to a squad struggling against relegation and Dobson was hardly a luxury signing - we need a SH and he has turned out to be a good 'un. If it hadn't been them, it would have been somebody else on a similar wage.
As for the businessman/fan approach - whichever works at the time. If the club needs to tighten its belt in coming seasons, so be it. A period of consolidation after one of rapid growth would not be the greatest hardship.
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fonds blancs/Sid.gif I have lost interest:fonds blancs/Sid.gif |
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| Quote: Mild Rover "You're assuming an investment budget of £0. And unless you are wealthy (ie would be willing and able to spend £1.35 million over 3 years), no you couldn't. On the other hand, I'm pretty confident that given a council-built state of the art stadium and a team that had just been to Old Trafford, that I could have matched the performance of Hull board over the same 3 year period.
I do look at Widnes - they are a very good comparator. They were rescued from administration by a wealthy benefactor in 2007. They have have a lovely, but rarely very full, stadium that was built in partnership with Halton Borough Council, where they host their Championship and NRC fixtures. All of which reflects rather well on the Stewardship of NH, IMO.
The team has done well and that has been crucial making the club more than mere SL makeweights. In fact many clubs use the performance of their team as an important metric of success.
You ask how I can say he has done a good job. Well look at where the club were when he started and look where they are now. I'm hardly a lone voice in the wilderness on this
He has racked up massive , ever increasingy seemingly unrepayable , LOSSES. If the team doesn't perfrm so well this year then the extension in East stand will be pointless and another LOSS will be recorded again. My whole point is that he seems like someone wanting to get out as I have never heard so much from him in the media, about how 'tough' the job is and how he has thought many times about getting out.
I think he would like to be a BIG fan of the club , enjoying corporate hospitality every week , but not responsible for running it anymore as it is a ballache of a job handling losses.
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Black Backgrounds/The%20Swedish%20Chef.gif Hull KR play off wins = just the one.:Black Backgrounds/The%20Swedish%20Chef.gif |
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| How many sporting clubs break even? Most of the premiership football teams don't. Any one putting money into a team will not expect to get it back; If you can find someone else to share the expenditure the that's what you'll try and do.
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40452_1335639638.jpg [img:218z2l9g]http://i40.tinypic.com/tz8ti.jpg[/img:218z2l9g]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_40452.jpg |
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| Quote: Mild Rover "That may be true for Rovers, [igoing forward[/i, but the fact 11 teams (I'll discount Bradford's very small loss this year) are losing money, shows that clubs are often not viewed as a business, were profitability is paramount. They have often been and will likely continue to be a way for wealthy men to get their kicks, [iin many cases[/i.
The link you seem to be making between the losses and NH's keeness to get one over on Hull, is a false one. They are not linked. Signing Cooke added quality to a squad struggling against relegation and Dobson was hardly a luxury signing - we need a SH and he has turned out to be a good 'un. If it hadn't been them, it would have been somebody else on a similar wage.
As for the businessman/fan approach - whichever works at the time. If the club needs to tighten its belt in coming seasons, so be it. A period of consolidation after one of rapid growth would not be the greatest hardship.'"
really..not sure that is the view by your board..Celtic not happening though he turned it down
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17490_1406583406.jpg First there was wisdom
Then there was knowledge
Now there is only information:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_17490.jpg |
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| Quote: Vicenzo "Lets just have a look at this. A club in SL finds it cannot compete at the top level just on gates and sponsorship. In order to maintain their status the directors of the club lend it large amounts of money to enable this. The loans pile up and at some point the directors start wanting their money back. Does this sound familiar to any fans from across the City?
So which is better - for a club (or any business) to owe money to its owners or to owe money to external creditors, such as a bank?
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