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Subscribe | Moderators: Admin, R.B.A , Anakin Skywalker , Mild Rover
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BLACK AND WHITES East is East,West is West, and never the twain shall meet. -------------------------------- "I" said the sparrow "With my bow and arrow.":33934.gif



Quote: Captain Dave "No matter how some of our monochrome chums dress it up , many are still just bitter that their pivotal player left them and joined Hull Kingston Rovers.

Once these individuals recognise this , they will be able to move on in life.'"

In my case,bitterly disappointed.(At the time.) icon_cry.gif

Then sod me if Shaun doesn`t walk the plank too. icon_biggrin.gifOH:

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Sell him tomorrow.
In fact give him back to Hull to see him and Long kick off.
Didnt keep us up. Webster and the rest did despite.
There, said it. icon_eek.gif

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Quote: barton baird "In my case,bitterly disappointed.(At the time.)
I know it was a double whammy for you Bart , but at least you've managed to keep your sense of humour. icon_biggrin.gif

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Quote: blakeysrobin "Sell him tomorrow.
In fact give him back to Hull to see him and Long kick off.
Didnt keep us up. Webster and the rest did despite.
There, said it.
icon_smile.gif

So was it as smart move by Hudge to sign him in hindsight?

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Quote: Big Dave T "Hindsight's a wonderful thing. At the time it was a smart move. A player of undoubted talent, joining the club he'd supported since chilhood; a match made in heaven you'd like to think. A couple of years down the line it wouln't appear so. I still think that he's been a bigger loss to Hull than he's been a gain to Rovers. He's still another year on his contract with Rovers and he's playing for a contract with someone the season after; so he's plenty of time to prove he's as good as should have been on paper.

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Quote: Pudsey Robin "Hindsight's a wonderful thing. At the time it was a smart move. A player of undoubted talent, joining the club he'd supported since chilhood; a match made in heaven you'd like to think. A couple of years down the line it wouln't appear so. I still think that he's been a bigger loss to Hull than he's been a gain to Rovers. He's still another year on his contract with Rovers and he's playing for a contract with someone the season after; so he's plenty of time to prove he's as good as should have been on paper.'"


FWIW he has been our single biggest loss in the last few seasons. We've struggled to replace him with a creative half too with the likes of Head, Dykes and Thorman. (who all on paper should have done the job but much like Cooke at Rovers have been largely disappointing)

Is the problem for Cooke the way that Morgan uses him? At FC Cooke was our main ball player alongside the likes of Jason Smith. When ive seen Rovers play Cooke seems to be pushed to 2nd receiver or 3rd reciever a lot and i cant recall him hitting his big cut out pass on more than a couple of occassions. For some reason it looks like Morgans tactics are anti-cooke?

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Quote: Big Dave T "FWIW he has been our single biggest loss in the last few seasons. We've struggled to replace him with a creative half too with the likes of Head, Dykes and Thorman. (who all on paper should have done the job but much like Cooke at Rovers have been largely disappointing)

Is the problem for Cooke the way that Morgan uses him? At FC Cooke was our main ball player alongside the likes of Jason Smith. When ive seen Rovers play Cooke seems to be pushed to 2nd receiver or 3rd reciever a lot and i cant recall him hitting his big cut out pass on more than a couple of occassions. For some reason it looks like Morgans tactics are anti-cooke?'"


Depends on your definition of disappointing. Thorman never has been as good as Cooke. As for Dykes And Head, their problems were being fit, especially Dykes, as when they were actually on the field, they were very good.

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Quote: Big Dave T " For some reason it looks like Morgans tactics are anti-cooke?'"


I think it's more a case of Pro-Dobson to be honest. They are both capable of controlling the play, but Dobsons's work is more consistent and at a faster pace. Cooke is an enigma as a stand off, as he plays more like a scrum half. There were times last season when it all clicked and they were an outstanding pair. Unfortunately, this was the exception rather than the norm. 2010 is a big year for Cooke, as he has to perform to secure his future, and its been a lot of years since he had that type of pressure on him.

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Quote: El Chupacabra "Depends on your definition of disappointing. Thorman never has been as good as Cooke. As for Dykes And Head, their problems were being fit, especially Dykes, as when they were actually on the field, they were very good.'"


Its debatable, Thorman when through a period of playing internationals and was signed up to go to Oz. On that basis he would be as good as Cooke, different kinds of players though. (personally i agree that Cooke has always been a better player than Thorman but their records may disagree)

Agree too about Dykes and Head not been fit, sadly though due to that they didnt fill the gap that Cooke left.

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Quote: The Goroka Gene-ius "I think it's more a case of Pro-Dobson to be honest. They are both capable of controlling the play, but Dobsons's work is more consistent and at a faster pace. Cooke is an enigma as a stand off, as he plays more like a scrum half. There were times last season when it all clicked and they were an outstanding pair. Unfortunately, this was the exception rather than the norm. 2010 is a big year for Cooke, as he has to perform to secure his future, and its been a lot of years since he had that type of pressure on him.'"


Here's a debate then, as i see Dobson as been more of a running 6 rather than a passing 7, would rovers be a better team to shift more responsibility to cooke use Dobson in a lesser role?

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'Thus I am tormented by my curiosity and humbled by my ignorance.' from History of an Old Bramin, The New York Mirror (A Weekly Journal Devoted to Literature and the Fine Arts), February 16th 1833.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_33809.png

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Quote: Big Dave T "Here's a debate then, as i see Dobson as been more of a running 6 rather than a passing 7, would rovers be a better team to shift more responsibility to cooke use Dobson in a lesser role?'"


I can't really debate that with you as I think Dobson is a pretty complete halfback - passing, running and kicking. That is a main reason behind Cooke been a bit peripheral, IMO. As he says in the recent HDM article, he and Horne complemented each other perfectly - neither have been as good consistently since Cooke left Hull (though there are other issues to bare in mind, of course). Cooke was the organizer, Horne the off-the-cuff creator. With Cooke-Webster there was an element of duplication, while Dobson does both (and works well with Galea or I'anson as a foil).
Because Cooke is right-sided and Dobson left-sided, taking a simplistic fan's eye view, you'd think the obvious thing to do would be to split them on the left and right respectively. Strangely, to me, when its been done that way its sometimes been in reverse. I think though that Morgan prefers to keep Dobson at the centre of things as much as possible.
A team may only need one experienced, well-rounded organizer, but you'd prefer 2 in the squad - but then one is likely to be frustrated. For me the debate is whether you play a second half beside Dobson, to share the burden but be in his shadow or go for a centre/back row type of stand-off - putting a lot of responsibility on Dobson but giving you a different dimension. Much as I like Cooke as a player, I can't see any argument for diminishing Dobson's role.

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Quote: Big Dave T "Here's a debate then, as i see Dobson as been more of a running 6 rather than a passing 7, would rovers be a better team to shift more responsibility to cooke use Dobson in a lesser role?'"


Absolutely not. As MR states above, your average Rovers fan has a vastly different opinion of Dobson's contribution than you, if you see him as a running 6. For example, I think Dobson's short kicking game in 2009 was the best in SL, and without him at 1st receiver, an awful lot of our tries would have gone begging.

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Quote: The Goroka Gene-ius "Absolutely not. As MR states above, your average Rovers fan has a vastly different opinion of Dobson's contribution than you, if you see him as a running 6. For example, I think Dobson's short kicking game in 2009 was the best in SL, and without him at 1st receiver, an awful lot of our tries would have gone begging.'"


and my question for debate was more around, do you think Rovers would have converted more opportunities or created better chances if Dobson wasnt always at 1st receiver and Cooke took some of it over. Gauging by your responses you think not. I dont have an opinion personally. Just an interesting debate to have.

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'Thus I am tormented by my curiosity and humbled by my ignorance.' from History of an Old Bramin, The New York Mirror (A Weekly Journal Devoted to Literature and the Fine Arts), February 16th 1833.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_33809.png

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Quote: Big Dave T "and my question for debate was more around, do you think Rovers would have converted more opportunities or created better chances if Dobson wasnt always at 1st receiver and Cooke took some of it over. Gauging by your responses you think not. I dont have an opinion personally. Just an interesting debate to have.'"


When you put it like that, it is a tough question - I want to see more Cooke, but not less from Dobson. Rovers should therefore be allowed sets of 10, IMO. icon_wink.gif

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Quote: Mild Rover "When you put it like that, it is a tough question - I want to see more Cooke, but not less from Dobson. Rovers should therefore be allowed sets of 10, IMO.
icon_biggrin.gif Would give you more options than the sets of 4 we seemed to adopt last year.

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