FORUMS > Hull KR > Hull KR fans demand council investment in Craven Park |
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| Quote: Mrs Barista "Have you even read Jake The Peg's post? Rovers have had plenty of public funding in the same way that Hull Stingrays did. If the council paid for stadium extensions and crowds did not materially increase, the investment would represent very poor value for money. Remember how much passes are going to cost for 2012 and the current gloomy environment and it's fair to say that materially and consistently increasing crowds by more than 20% is very challenging.'"
Hull Stingrays? How can you compare a team from a sport nobody in this country let alone Hull is interested in with a team in the City which has the potential to attract an average of 10k crowds. An investment in HKR would be a far more solid investment then any money thrown at the town’s ice hockey club.
As for increasing crowds I’ve no doubt it would be harder in the current financial climate but we can't afford to wait, moving to the KC did FC and the Tigers crowds no end of good and I’d expect it to boost rovers average attendance too.
Quote: Mrs Barista "Or, the point is that Rovers can't fulfil the commitments they made 2 years ago and are now trying to leverage the fact that the council used a windfall to build a stadium in the city to get them to fund another one. Despite the fact that Rovers wanted to go it alone when offered a place at said stadium. And that the council have funded the Stingrays, a company that was loss-making with an non self-sufficient business model and that now looks a poor commercial decision.
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Rovers like a lot of teams in Superleague are struggling to fulfil commitments, would it be that bad for the council to help Rovers with a boost from King Comms money, improving facilities for everyone who visits CP. Nobody is asking for a mini KC and 40 odd million.
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| Quote: retro_muz "Hull Stingrays? How can you compare a team from a sport nobody in this country let alone Hull is interested in with a team in the City which has the potential to attract an average of 10k crowds. An investment in HKR would be a far more solid investment then any money thrown at the town’s ice hockey club.'"
I'm sure Rovers made that point the previous half a dozen times they've taken cash off the council.
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| Quote: The Goroka Gene-ius "
If the KC had been built on Holderness Road, would FC have taken up an offer to play there?'"
Probably we started out on Holderness Road.
The fact is Holderness road was never going to happen. West park was the more logical choice. If they wanted to pick East Park and spend hundreds of millions on road links then I'm sure Hull would have been happy to move there. Afterall FC are a club from all of hull, More than half our season pass holders live east, don't you know.
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| Quote: Gordon Gekko "
On top of this the work must be carried out by local contractors and materials must be supplied by local companies in order to assist the local economy.'"
I can see the political attractions in that from everybody's POV, but it could be dangerous. Firstly it'd have to be done on a nod and a wink, because it'd be illegally protectionist. If Hull-based firms don't represent best value to the taxpayer that could kick up a different type of stink, especially if any have links to councillors. And if Hull gets a reputation for this sort of thing, it could disadvantage its firms when they bid for contratcs in other cities.
I'm not saying don't do it, just to be careful, sensible and not use it openly/officially as a selling point.
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| Quote: Gordon Gekko "I'm sure Rovers made that point the previous half a dozen times they've taken cash off the council.'"
I’ve no idea how many times HKR have had money from the council, but whether it be once, twice or a hundred times how much will it really equate too when compared with the 40 Million spent in West Park...
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| A local stadium for local people.
Still can't do pictures.
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| Quote: Gordon Gekko "I wouldn't have any problem with the council upgrading CP providing it represents value to the taxpayer. The KC was built from one off funds and wasn't built purely for Hull City and Hull FC but the wider community. If HCC are to fund any stadia improvements then imho the land and buildings must be wholly owned by HCC and the whole facility must be run by an independant management committee along the same lines as the SMC with the remit of getting VFM for the ratepayers of Hull.
On top of this the work must be carried out by local contractors and materials must be supplied by local companies in order to assist the local economy.'"
That would break pretty well every procuremnt rule in the book.
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| Quote: retro_muz "I’ve no idea how many times HKR have had money from the council, but whether it be once, twice or a hundred times how much will it really equate too when compared with the 40 Million spent in West Park...'"
So, Hull have sole use of the stadium, all the offices, all the surrounding sports pitches and every other facility at the stadium, for free? If thats not the case then its a bit of blairesque spin to say Hull have had 40 million spent on them.
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| Quote: Mild Rover "I can see the political attractions in that from everybody's POV, but it could be dangerous. Firstly it'd have to be done on a nod and a wink, because it'd be illegally protectionist. If Hull-based firms don't represent best value to the taxpayer that could kick up a different type of stink, especially if any have links to councillors. And if Hull gets a reputation for this sort of thing, it could disadvantage its firms when they bid for contratcs in other cities.
I'm not saying don't do it, just to be careful, sensible and not use it openly/officially as a selling point.'"
Local councils can and do require that contractors meet certain conditions. There is nothing wrong with Hull City council requiring that some or all of the work be carried out by local contractors. The value requirement would still exist but it would be which company, after deciding all those which meet other criteria (location, size, competence, timescales etc.) will charge the lowest price.
There is certainly no need for a "nod and a wink" basis for selecting the most suitable contractor.
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| Quote: Barnacle Bill "
There is certainly no need for a "nod and a wink" basis for selecting the most suitable contractor.'"
No, but there is if you have predetermined that you are using local contractors, irrespective of whether they are most suitable. You can define suitability in such a way as to make your desired outcome more likely, but this requires at least a little subtlety. What you can't do is come out and openly guarantee the work to local firms - as I understand it, anyway.
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| Quote: retro_muz "I’ve no idea how many times HKR have had money from the council, but whether it be once, twice or a hundred times how much will it really equate too when compared with the 40 Million spent in West Park...'"
That £40m was spent on a facility that would benefit the city as a whole. Its location is irrelevant.
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| Quote: Gordon Gekko "That £40m was spent on a facility that would benefit the city as a whole. Its location is irrelevant.'"
Do you ever get the impression you are opening your mouth (or in this case wiggling your fingers) but there is just a load of blank faced, open mouthed, simpletons totally missing the whole point about the KC and why it had to be placed where it is for the good of the Whole City as well as visitors from other City's?
I despair when I think there are actually 10,000 people in this City who signed that thing and believe the rubbish it stands for!! No wonder Hull is bottom of so many league tables, including the begging bowl league table now as we just created 10,000 more people wanting handouts. That must eclipse even the London begging squad!!
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| Can you say that again, I drooled into my keyboard and it blew up.
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| Quote: "So, Hull have sole use of the stadium, all the offices, all the surrounding sports pitches and every other facility at the stadium, for free? If that’s not the case then its a bit of blairesque spin to say Hull have had 40 million spent on them.'"
Look, Hull FC, Hull City, the West Hull community….. whatever, have facilities that at the time cost 40+ million to build and the funds came from lots of clean cut profit the council made from the King Comms share boom.
Why can’t HKR and its surrounding East Hull community have what would essentially be a tiny amount in comparison of that profit thrown at them to build a new North Stand with facilities similar to the KC only on a much smaller scale?
I'm sure they could come to some kind of arrangement where by the council sees a return on its investment.
Quote: "That £40m was spent on a facility that would benefit the city as a whole. Its location is irrelevant.
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Its not irrelevant to people who don’t live in its location.
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| Quote: Digger_the_Dog "Do you ever get the impression you are opening your mouth (or in this case wiggling your fingers) but there is just a load of blank faced, open mouthed, simpletons totally missing the whole point about the KC and why it had to be placed where it is for the good of the Whole City as well as visitors from other City's?
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