FORUMS > Doncaster RLFC > Doncaster Squad 2015 - discussion |
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| Is DR still happening with Hull and Donny?
If so I reckon you could get some top young players who now can't play in the 19's
Props Bowden and Bobby Tyson-Wilson
Backrow Hadley
FB or wing Chris Naughton
Not sure if Radford will send out a couple of players who can play 19's in order to toughen them up.
Hopefully we won't play you in the middle 8, so it won't be a concern, on paper we have a good side and finally some decent halfs, lets just hope we can do it on the pitch.
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| I don't think you will get many of our young under 19 stars as the club has made it known they want to win the u19 competition next season.
I think you will get Rich Whiting,Dean Hadley regularly subject to HFC Player Injuries/loss of form and if we can keep our props injury free you will probably see Josh Bowden or Chris Green both strong young props.
HFC have signed Curtis Naughton a young 19 year old who played last season in Australia who is a fast wing/fullback and Radford may want to keep him fit so he could be another on D/R
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| Jack Downs (Hull squad number 26), and Jansin Turgut (number 25) are second-row forwards whilst Brad Fash (number 2icon_cool.gif is a loose forward.
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| We seem well-catered for in the positions these guys play in with Steve Snitch, Pas, Lee Waterman, Craig Robinson, and Mike Kelly to name a few.
I'm still concerned that whilst we've replaced Mark Castle we've not improved the depth in our prop department. The injury to Brett Waller was telling last season. If we were to lose any of our front line men, we could be caught short again.
Maybe PC is quite happy that Hull will be able to help cover us with the likes of Chris Green if need be, although Chris did go on loan to Fev last season when we could have perhaps done with him here.
Jansin Turgut does seem like a class act. I think he would definitely add something to our pack. From an experience point of view, Richard Whiting is the guy that could really make a difference if he's not going to get a regular place in the Hull team.
Are any of our new lads likely to become the next Tom Hodson? With Dave Scott having to stay at full-back, have we got the lads to give us enough pace out wide?
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| Seems like a total waste to me - there are clear areas in our squad where we lack depth being hooker, prop and possibly wing/ fullback. However with 8 backrowers in our squad (Emmet, Kelly, Dunn, Snitch, Foster, Robinson, Waterman and Palmer) it seems this is a position we are well covered for. No disrespect to these lads mentioned but I seriously hope we can get others instead in positions we are more sorely lacking in. Again no disrespect to these lads who I'm sure are quality players but looking at the make up of our squad more backrowers seem surplus to requirements and if they do come in to replace some of ours it seems a bit unfair to whoever ends up bottom of the pecking order.
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| Well if you make the top 4 and Hull FC make bottom 4 in SL I think we will see DR at its worst. Teams in the same comp sharing players? DR is no longer fit for purpose
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| Quote: DemonUK "Well if you make the top 4 and Hull FC make bottom 4 in SL I think we will see DR at its worst. Teams in the same comp sharing players? DR is no longer fit for purpose'"
While I agree in sentiment in our case I don't anticipate this being an issue as with the number of full time teams next year I don't see us making the top 4.
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| In theory, the idea of closer ties between Super League clubs and lower division clubs was a good one when DR was first introduced. Now that it's possible for the two clubs to be playing in the same league, it begs the question as to whether it continues to be viable in its current form.
I don't think we can get too pedantic about the idea of clubs not being allowed to "share players" if they're in the same league because this already happens with the loan system. Numerous players went on loan from one Super League club to another Super League club in 2014. The loan system isn't going to stop even if DR does.
Getting the correct balances between the rights of the loaning club and fair play for the club lending the player is difficult because the loaning club will always feel they have the right to recall "their" player at any time, whilst the club lending the player want to have some stability to the loan period.
Whether the system remains under the name of DR or whether it is replaced by a loan system only, the RFL needs to address this issue.
I would abolish the DR system as we know it. I would limit loan players to two at any one club at any given time. The period of the loan must be for a minimum of 28 days. A player could only be recalled to the parent club if medical evidence was accepted by the RFL to show the parent club had injuries that warranted the player being recalled.
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| Quote: Double Movement "In theory, the idea of closer ties between Super League clubs and lower division clubs was a good one when DR was first introduced. Now that it's possible for the two clubs to be playing in the same league, it begs the question as to whether it continues to be viable in its current form.
I don't think we can get too pedantic about the idea of clubs not being allowed to "share players" if they're in the same league because this already happens with the loan system. Numerous players went on loan from one Super League club to another Super League club in 2014. The loan system isn't going to stop even if DR does.
Getting the correct balances between the rights of the loaning club and fair play for the club lending the player is difficult because the loaning club will always feel they have the right to recall "their" player at any time, whilst the club lending the player want to have some stability to the loan period.
Whether the system remains under the name of DR or whether it is replaced by a loan system only, the RFL needs to address this issue.
I would abolish the DR system as we know it. I would limit loan players to two at any one club at any given time. The period of the loan must be for a minimum of 28 days. A player could only be recalled to the parent club if medical evidence was accepted by the RFL to show the parent club had injuries that warranted the player being recalled.'"
I like this approach in particular the necessity for medical evidence needed - just out of interest where would you stand on the loan rules that occasionally ban players for appearing against their parent club? Personally in line with the medical necessity bit to prevent you from deliebrately hamstringing your rivals I wouldn't mind seeing the ability to put that into loan agreements revoked so its an all or nothing affair ie. a season long loan would be for the season. Also should the player on a season long loan be injured, should the injury not keep him out all season I'd like to see him return to the loaned club rather than as sometimes seems to happen the loan be cancelled as he goes back to the parent club for treatment and then does not end up back with the loan club again.
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| Most clubs don't want their players to be cup tied or play against them in a league game when on loan. One exception that I can think of was Gareth Hock last season. When he was on loan from Salford to Widnes he was still eligible to play for Widnes against Salford.
I can understand why the team lending the player would prefer they didn't play against them. They may be concerned that their own players could be injuring their own players - which they certainly would want to avoid. Say a Dons player went on loan to Hunslet and we were due to play them next week. We wouldn't want our players knocking seven bells out of one of our own, would we? I think this provision needs to stay.
I like the idea of season long loans. Four Leeds players have gone on season long loans to Featherstone: Jordon Baldwinson, Thomas Mimms, Mason Tonks, and Alex Foster.
I presume the usual rules will apply and they can be recalled at any time if they're needed for duty at Leeds.
I would prefer a limit of two loan signings at any one time per club as this would encourage sides to invest in their own development, rather than rely too heavily on other clubs.
Season long loans might not be the right arrangement if a player is on the verge of first team rugby at his home club which is why I think the provision to loan for a month at a time needs to stay, but safeguards should be put in place to make sure they don't return early unless there are exceptional circumstances verified by the RFL.
Getting these balances right is important. I hope the RFL get their act together on this rather than let things drift along as they seem to be doing at the moment. I can imagine two DR clubs coming together in the middle eight at the end of the season and the RFL will then think, "Errmmm, what do we do now?"
Saying that, I seem to recall at the Dons fans forum something was said to the effect that once a player has played for one side in the middle eight, they are no longer eligible to play for the other team from then onwards. although on checking the RFL rules I can't actually find anything to confirm this.
The 2015 rules at the RFL rules state that a player must have played in at least six league games whilst on DR to qualify to play in the end of season leagues of eight. although DR players with a salary cap of £20k or more only have to have played three times. Rule B3.17 then goes on to say that any player swapping from DR to a loan deal after the end of the registration deadline must have played in at least three league games to be eligible. Is there any wonder that things go wrong with overly complicated rules like this?!
Let's make things simple: Do away with DR and bring in better rules for the loan system.
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| Check some hidden section of the RFL rules.. Thats where the most important bits and pieces normally hide
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| Quote: Double Movement "Most clubs don't want their players to be cup tied or play against them in a league game when on loan. One exception that I can think of was Gareth Hock last season. When he was on loan from Salford to Widnes he was still eligible to play for Widnes against Salford.
I can understand why the team lending the player would prefer they didn't play against them. They may be concerned that their own players could be injuring their own players - which they certainly would want to avoid. Say a Dons player went on loan to Hunslet and we were due to play them next week. We wouldn't want our players knocking seven bells out of one of our own, would we? I think this provision needs to stay.
I like the idea of season long loans. Four Leeds players have gone on season long loans to Featherstone
I presume the usual rules will apply and they can be recalled at any time if they're needed for duty at Leeds.
I would prefer a limit of two loan signings at any one time per club as this would encourage sides to invest in their own development, rather than rely too heavily on other clubs.
Season long loans might not be the right arrangement if a player is on the verge of first team rugby at his home club which is why I think the provision to loan for a month at a time needs to stay, but safeguards should be put in place to make sure they don't return early unless there are exceptional circumstances verified by the RFL.
Getting these balances right is important. I hope the RFL get their act together on this rather than let things drift along as they seem to be doing at the moment. I can imagine two DR clubs coming together in the middle eight at the end of the season and the RFL will then think, "Errmmm, what do we do now?"
Saying that, I seem to recall at the Dons fans forum something was said to the effect that once a player has played for one side in the middle eight, they are no longer eligible to play for the other team from then onwards. although on checking the RFL rules I can't actually find anything to confirm this.
The 2015 rules at the RFL rules state that a player must have played in at least six league games whilst on DR to qualify to play in the end of season leagues of eight. although DR players with a salary cap of £20k or more only have to have played three times. Rule B3.17 then goes on to say that any player swapping from DR to a loan deal after the end of the registration deadline must have played in at least three league games to be eligible. Is there any wonder that things go wrong with overly complicated rules like this?!
Let's make things simple
Your Featherstone assumption is wrong. They have deals with Leeds for 2016, but for 2015 they have 1 yr contracts with Fev, they are not on loan (do me a favour ) Off course this still allows Fev to have another 5 Loan/DR players a game if they so wish. So in theory up to 9 players that are not really Fev players.
Also I could only find the 2014 rules on the RFL website. Please provide a link to the 2015 rules for me seeing as the RFL are not replying either via Email or Twitter
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| Quote: DemonUK "Your Featherstone assumption is wrong. They have deals with Leeds for 2016, but for 2015 they have 1 yr contracts with Fev, they are not on loan (do me a favour
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| Fair enough. I remember reading something different, however I cannot find it now. As for the DR rules, I maintain it is no longer fit for purpose when clubs can be in the same comp. A comp that has such an important and financially rewarding outcome
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