FORUMS FORUMS






RLFANS.COM
Celebrating
25 years service to
the Rugby League
Community!
  
FORUMS > Doncaster RLFC > Dons V Rams Sunday 13/9/2015 2pm
54 posts in 5 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin
RankPostsTeam
Club Captain12No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Aug 20159 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2015Oct 2015LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature

:



People with a knowledge and understanding of history can look at present developing situations and compare what is happening now to the past. This often gives a good insight to a likely future. So SteveRoebuck’s recent post is very informative and is well grounded.

The young lads who have been signed are fresh out of Superleague academies. Some of them may be stars of the future. The only problem is that we do not know which ones. The videos that we see are of one team of U19s players playing other team of U19s players. Now, most of them will be turning U20. No one knows what they will be like under pressure from experienced players in either League 1 or in Championship. They will be playing against men who are battle hardened. Some promising young players’ ability seems to evaporate under pressure whilst others rise to the challenge. Some young players may not be ready for this challenge for another few years. Also, what of their attitude? Will they be good team players? Who knows?

So Stand-Offish is right when he talks about signing potential. Chewspaker, Moomlight, SteveRoebuck, Wanderer, etc also make this point and they talk of balances between youth and experience. These guys have experiences from their own personal history and they have good words wisdom to offer. The management of Donny would do well to listen.

Most Championship clubs will take on youngsters to develop them during training and try them out against weaker clubs. Surely no Championship club in its right mind will allow its future to be determined by the exploits of inexperienced youth. After all, no Championship club wants to be relegated to League 1.

League 1 is a bit different. This gives talented younger inexperienced players a good chance to develop and provide them with a route into Championship and beyond. Good experienced players also play here by personal choice.

Now that we are relegated to League 1, C Hall talks about bouncing back into Championship. In reality there are constraining financial budget issues. So G Thornton is a bit more cautious. He says, “[iit will not be a given that we will be straight back up but we will be challenging[/i”. He knows the realities of League 1. After all, he was the Championship coach at York City Knights when they were relegated to League 1.

From the existing squad so far, we have signed only three fully experienced players – K Kesik, L Welham and T Carr. Of these three, an earlier post seemed to question if L Welham has signed. If he has, then this is odd as it is not yet posted on Donny’s site. A new experienced player who has signed is M Castle. However, it is suggested by G Thornton that P Cooke gave M Castle the push. No reason is given for this.

Two of the signings from last year’s intake have re-signed. So I guess that P Cooke was right about these two.

So far, five new youngsters have been signed. How will they do? We do not know. Time will tell.

It seems that few of our existing squad will be with us next season. Some of the earlier posts here suggest that they are off to pastures new. This is a pity. I believe that they are a very good squad of players who were somehow or other let down by management. After all, when G Thornton took over earlier this year he said, “[iGood players cannot become bad players overnight[/i”.

RankPostsTeam
International Star3493
JoinedServiceReputation
Aug 201113 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2024Aug 2024LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
disney/00035.gif
:disney/00035.gif



We've all been looking for a few more answers as to why the 2015 season has been so bad. The club haven't really wanted to tell us the details - preferring to look forward rather than look back.

In the Free Press article on Thursday 17th September, Carl revealed something that hadn't previously been disclosed:

“As was the case with Paul Cooke and Tony Miller before him, recruitment is all in the hands of head coach Gary Thornton."

This suggests PC had total control over the squad for 2015 and was happy with the side he'd put together. Was it PC's judgement that was wrong, as opposed to the club not making funds available?

RankPostsTeam
International Star1443
JoinedServiceReputation
Jan 201312 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2020May 2020LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature

:



Why don't they just explain that then if that's the case.
Not a difficult statement to make?

RankPostsTeam
Club Captain12No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Aug 20159 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2015Oct 2015LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature

:



Double Movement raised an interesting issue on signing authority.

Although C Hall stated, [i“As was the case with Paul Cooke and Tony Miller before him, recruitment is all in the hands of head coach Gary Thornton”[/i. He also went on to say, [i“Gary, …, has full say on who he wants to bring to the club and my only role is to make it happen if I can and to decide whether the players fit into my budget”[/i. So it is being made clear that whilst Gary has a big say in what he wants, he has to work within the financial budget constraints. So, because of the money, C Hall has the final say. It is a bit like wanting a sirloin steak, but you can afford only a couple of sausages.

Looking at this article, the RFL have cut the money to Donny by £125,000. The owners are putting some money in, and C Hall is fundraising.

However, the point that Double Movement raises is an interesting one, for mid-season on the 17th July 2014, we were introduced to a new 20 year old ex rugby union Leicester Tigers player. The club write up sounded very good. The reality was different. P Dunn’s tackling was good, but his positional sense and lack of game awareness was there for all to see. Who selected P Dunn? Given his clear lack of knowledge of Rugby League, why was not given more training before being allowed to play at Championship level?

Just because he played Union, it is no guarantee that he could play League. It is a bit like expecting someone to play badminton just because they can play tennis - or expecting someone to play chess because they can play draughts.

Coming back now to P Cooke, like G Thornton, I cannot see him having total control. At the 2015 squad selection time, many fans seemed to be puzzled over the total lack of experienced new players. We do not know the budget constraints that were placed on P Cooke. Also, we may have expected an availability of good Hull FC players to fill any breach. These may be two of the management errors – too many inexperienced youth and a miscalculation on the availability of good dual reg players.

Looking back to the start of 2015, Stand-Offish said, [i“With all these youngsters we must have the most unpredictable team in the division. Forrest Gump mode ... The Dons are like a box of chocolates ... you never know what you're gonna get.”[/i

Also, Onedon wrote, [i“Hope we have enough experience to avoid the struggle of relegation.”[/i He also stated, [i“Looks like we will be relying heavily on D/R.”
[/i

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach4077
JoinedServiceReputation
Nov 200519 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2024Sep 2024LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
18825_1562008297.jpg
:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_18825.jpg



Love it to bits that post. You would have to be completly wet behind the ears not to grasp the thought process behind it. The question once again is about trust, and for me it just enforces my lack of faith in the financial side of running the Dons hence the reluctance to go for a couple of season tickets or anything to do with the alleged squad builder fund.

RankPostsTeam
International Star3493
JoinedServiceReputation
Aug 201113 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2024Aug 2024LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
disney/00035.gif
:disney/00035.gif



Quote: Tee Man "Double Movement raised an interesting issue on signing authority.

Although C Hall stated, [i“As was the case with Paul Cooke and Tony Miller before him, recruitment is all in the hands of head coach Gary Thornton”[/i. He also went on to say, [i“Gary, …, has full say on who he wants to bring to the club and my only role is to make it happen if I can and to decide whether the players fit into my budget”[/i. So it is being made clear that whilst Gary has a big say in what he wants, he has to work within the financial budget constraints. So, because of the money, C Hall has the final say. It is a bit like wanting a sirloin steak, but you can afford only a couple of sausages.
[/i]'"


The financial side of things will probably always mean that the club have the final say on who we can sign but I think the statement made by Carl lowers the possibility that there was some cunning master plan to tread water in 2015 with the club insisting that we went for youth.

We're never going to know how much the club's budget was, or which players they refused to sign (that PC wanted) because they were deemed to be too expensive, or be able to compare our budget to those of our rivals. All we have been told is that the 2015 budget was the biggest ever in the club's history ... which would make them very expensive sausages!

I felt the implications of what Carl said could (and should) have been made public before now. Even though it's not the definitive answer as to why this season went wrong, it does help us to understand the situation a little better. More clarity would also be helpful but I doubt it will be forthcoming.

My guess is that we were also relying heavily on Hull to plug any gaps we had, and that didn't happen. All the top clubs in the Championship kept away from DR. It creates a huge instability in knowing who is going to be available from week to week. I hope one of the lessons we have learned from this season is that we now recognise that we must take responsibility for ourselves. We cannot rely on Hull, or anyone else, to bail us out if times get tough.

We probably all feel a sense of relief that this season is drawing to a close. Let's hope we hear some more positive news of signings soon. I would expect more names to be revealed next week as many players will have played their last game for their current clubs this weekend.

54 posts in 5 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin
54 posts in 5 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin



All views expressed are those of the author and not necessarily those of the RLFANS.COM or its subsites.

Whilst every effort is made to ensure that news stories, articles and images are correct, we cannot be held responsible for errors. However, if you feel any material on this website is copyrighted or incorrect in any way please contact us using the link at the top of the page so we can remove it or negotiate copyright permission.

RLFANS.COM, the owners of this website, is not responsible for the content of its sub-sites or posts, please email the author of this sub-site or post if you feel you find an article offensive or of a choice nature that you disagree with.

Copyright 1999 - 2024 RLFANS.COM

You must be 18+ to gamble, for more information and for help with gambling issues see https://www.begambleaware.org/.



Please Support RLFANS.COM


5.02978515625:5
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
7m
Isa 1 year extension
Trainman
11
9m
Decision on the field
Trainman
13
17m
2024 IMG gradings
Victor
3
21m
Leigh it is
apollosghost
81
22m
Transfer Talk / Rumour thread V4
mattsrhinos1
10096
22m
TV Games - Not Hull
Mild Rover
2908
33m
Film game
Boss Hog
4066
45m
Rumours thread
Trojan Horse
2449
Recent
Who do you want to win the Grand Final
just_browny
17
Recent
Tonights match v HKR
just_browny
85
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
37s
Transfer Talk / Rumour thread V4
mattsrhinos1
10096
56s
SL CHAT THREAD OTHER TEAMS GAMES
chapylad
156
1m
Rumours and signings v9
apollosghost
28801
1m
Rumours thread
Trojan Horse
2449
1m
Film game
Boss Hog
4066
2m
Season tickets
Hudd-Shay
8
2m
Best Semi
sir adrian m
13
2m
2025 membership/renewals
The Dentist
42
3m
2025 TRANSFER AND RETENTION RUMOURS
Listenup94
1
3m
Who do you want to win the Grand Final
just_browny
17
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
Questions for Ste Mills
JamieRobinso
1
TODAY
Decision on the field
Trainman
13
TODAY
Who do you want to win the Grand Final
just_browny
17
TODAY
Worst semi
Barstool Pre
5
TODAY
2025 TRANSFER AND RETENTION RUMOURS
Listenup94
1
TODAY
Sam Burgess
Boss Hog
7
TODAY
Hull KR Survive Warrington Fightback To Secure Grand Final Spot
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
Squad 2025
Nat (Rugby_A
1
TODAY
Tonights match v HKR
just_browny
85
TODAY
Isa 1 year extension
Trainman
11
TODAY
2024 IMG gradings
Victor
3
TODAY
Championship Awards
Trojan Horse
9
TODAY
Season tickets
Hudd-Shay
8
TODAY
Best Semi
sir adrian m
13
TODAY
Ben Condon is a Leopard
Jack Gaskell
1
TODAY
Squads - Leopards v Warriors
Vancouver Le
8
TODAY
Any decent RL reads for me hols
norbellini
1
TODAY
Championship Play Off Final
PopTart
3
TODAY
Man of Steel
matt_wire
8
TODAY
Guest appearance
AgbriggAmble
2
TODAY
Squad for HKR
MorePlaymake
28
TODAY
Proposed rule changes 2025
MjM
14
TODAY
Fev H Play Off
Bully_Boxer
21
TODAY
Whose going for a beer in Wigan Saturday
Deeeekos
2
TODAY
Play-off semi-final
BarnsleyGull
19
TODAY
Coach of the Year
Howfenwire
11
TODAY
Greatest game ever at HJ
Fantastic Mr
10
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
Hull KR Survive Warrington Fig..
212
Warrington Wolves Break Saints..
791
Leigh Leopards Make Play Off P..
819
Catalans Dragons Finish Sevent..
1228
Hull KR Secure Second With Vic..
1449
Wigan Seal League Leaders Trop..
1198
Wakefield Trinity Sweep Aside ..
1607
Catalans Keep Season Alive Wit..
1310
Salford Ensure Play-Offs And S..
1538
Ruthless Wigan Thrash the Rhin..
1711
Huddersfield Giants Hold Off L..
2058
Salford Close In On The Play O..
1664
Leigh Leopards Up To Fourth Af..
1701
Leeds Rhinos Into the Six Afte..
2028
Wigan Warriors Defeat Hull KR ..
1725