Reality check 1: Hull are playing the best the have all season. They were tipped to challenge for silverware this year based on the squad they'd assembled but had a poor first half to the season with plenty of calls on their side for Gentle to go.

Reality check 2: After nearly 3 seasons under Denis Betts we're still not playing as well as we should be and still look out of our depth in SL for long periods in games.

I argued to let him have they run of the franchise, see how we build and then decide his fate based on the 3rd seasons performance in SL. Now two things have come to a head: We cannot recruit because the attendances are low and the coming restructure after next season.

If we're gonna change coach it should be now, not part way through next season, unsettling the team and risking another poor season. Personally I think our problem is caused by the half-d recruitment signing Brown at great expense knowing he'd be the only big name in the side but not making him captain. Signing too many ill-disciplined players and expecting an untested coach to sort em into shape. Deciding that was all we were signing cos the crowds were too low to sustain further squad building. Failing to blood the young players and selecting/retaining some championship standard older players in front of them. Should have been:

Season 1: Play with kids, fill any gaps with whoever we have left from the championship, expect low crowds and pastings but save cash and build towards signing a top Forward, Half and Back to start in...
Season 2: With some quality in the spine of the team see which kids have come on and sign em up while looking for weak areas and signing to fill those gaps ready for...
Season 3: Attempt to reach play-offs and judge coach based on this season's performance ready to change if need be going into a new licensing period.

If Betts had done this we'd not be worried about the restructure because we'd have an established first team and hopefully would have built crowds. We've paid too much for Brown too early and are suffering the consequences.

If we won the Challenge cup, the G.F and world war 3,some of our fans would still want our coach out.

I have always wanted Betts to go even with good results.He has upset a few players like Briscoe,Flynn,and we can see lost the dressing room already.

Rumour is that Bett's has gone. Nothing official

Mick Potter to take over?

Source @johnstankevitch @LeagueWeekly

I'm the source am I?

Well, not really. I responded to a tweet posted by League Weekly, and I was being sarcastic!

I've heard its Kurt Sorenson

Now that your just one of us fans mate

what do you think of Denis? is he doing a good job in your eyes?

I've always been a fan


It's a tough one I think for Denis Betts. I don't think Widnes Vikings are one of those marquee clubs anymore that players would do anything to play for, and so this restricts what he can do when signing players, to a certain extent.

Money talks for players and so Widnes have to throw very good money around to get high quality players, but the problem is that they would have to pay over the odds of the likes of Wigan, St Helen's, Warrington etc...because players WANT to play for the top clubs and would probably take less money to do so.

Widnes pay top money but are then restricted in terms of quality strength in depth because a large proportion of the cash is tied up on a few players. So the middle to bottom end of the squad is average at best.

It's very difficult to make individual improvements of players that are significant enough to have an impact on team performances. Whilst you might get a 1% ability increase, it still leaves the player in the average bracket for ability.

When it comes to gameplans, tactics etc...nobody can really comment, because we don't know his coaching philosophy or strategy, but even with the best philosophy or strategy, hands are tied by the standard of players/team that you have.

In some ways I feel sorry for him.

One of the main discussion points on these forums has been the Vikings defence this year.

Defence boils down to trust.

If players trust the system that the coach puts in place, and they trust each other, and the system is a sound one, then the only way that a team can break that down is when individuals within the defensive structure make mistakes.

This happens all the time, it's just basic human nature to make mistakes, especially when under pressure. Fatigue also comes into play when defending, as the more tired you get, the less alert you become and when things happen quickly, which they do at the top level of the game, it's hard for tired players to react.

So I suppose you could say that maybe they aren't as fit as they possibly could be.

But then again, when you are coming up ball and giving penalties away, and find yourself on the back foot for 60 minutes of the game, it's inevitable that you'll get tired.

Are their trust issues in the squad, amongst players? Do the players trust the coach? Do the players trust the defensive system in place?

Unfortunately, working hard and having desire isn't quite enough, especially when you are playing against some fantastic attacking threats and in all honesty, when some of the players in the defensive system are very average.

Good teams are able to highlited weaknesses in the defensive line and exploit that.

Can Denis replace the weaknesses with better players? See my previous post

Stanky I feel Betts could have got better players from the Championship than Leuluai,Pickgersgill,and Ben Davies. I sometimes wonder if just picks his favourites and with Briscoe and Flynn not in contention makes me wonder.I like Clarke but why play him 65 mins before replacing him with Gore?Clarke and others need a rest to freshen them up. I feel Betts does not utilise his squad and his tactics at times looks predictable one man rugby.

I tend to fall similar to what John is saying. I think at times Betts has got the best out of this group and we've looked great but sometimes a few players aren't 100% and we can look ordinary as a unit.

I think a few players huge drops in form has been overlooked at time as the coach seems to be taking 100% of the blame! Look at games we have lost / drawn by 1-6 points and we've seen 2/3 shocking individual concentration lapses in those?

This Betts favourites stuff really needs to pass by the way as it was always plauers like Pickersgill, Allen and Isa yet Allen doesn't seem to be in the current 17 and they other 2 can't get a look in! Some young lads are getting game time and that was always slated in the same argument.

Some of his selections have been odd given our lack of go forward but the squad certainly needs investment and with that we could easily be knocking hard on the top 8 door.