| FORUMS > Hull FC > Horne |
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Carrying Horne all season is one of the reasons FC are so bl00dy appauling at present. When he was injured a few weeks back and Whiting took a more active role we improved now Whitings out and its back to the same old tosh.
IMO this team needs to change dramatically and with Long coming in id have Tansey at S/O and put Horne at full back as he clearly isnt good enough to be a half back anymore.
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| Aug 2005 | 19 years | |
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| Quote: Sebasteeno "Carrying Horne all season is one of the reasons FC are so bl00dy appauling at present. When he was injured a few weeks back and Whiting took a more active role we improved now Whitings out and its back to the same old tosh.
IMO this team needs to change dramatically and with Long coming in id have Tansey at S/O and put Horne at full back as he clearly isnt good enough to be a half back anymore.'"
Completely agree. Have said the same. |
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| Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
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| Quote: Nobeerineasthull "Any employee can be dismissed for capability or performance but apart from the PR issues highlighted by Big Dave the main problem with a professional RL player would be proving it and the reason for it. There would be plenty of scope for the player to muddy the waters by alleging bad coaching, tactics, being played out of position, other players not performing etc. In addition the reasons for the non-performance would have to be addressed with the player and the appropriate warnings given before he could be dismissed. In all but the most extreme cases it is a legal minefield and I can't see any club going down that route.
'"
Its actually fairly straight forward to do as long as the club and the player sit down and agree jointly the objevtives/criteria for what would be classed as performing. The major issue which i think you were hinting at was the accurate measurement of the objectives/criteria. In the professional world a measure could be hitting 90% of milestones on a project or delivering ontime/on budget. In a professional sport the measures would be less black and white. Achieve a performance rating averaging 7 or above per 8 match period would be a measure but the subjectivity of where it would come from would be the issue. |
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| Apr 2004 | 21 years | |
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| Quote: Big Dave T "Its actually fairly straight forward to do as long as the club and the player sit down and agree jointly the objevtives/criteria for what would be classed as performing. The major issue which i think you were hinting at was the accurate measurement of the objectives/criteria. In the professional world a measure could be hitting 90% of milestones on a project or delivering ontime/on budget. In a professional sport the measures would be less black and white. Achieve a performance rating averaging 7 or above per 8 match period would be a measure but the subjectivity of where it would come from would be the issue.'"
Cant they just use a players stats mate?  |
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| Quote: Big Dave T "I deliberately avoided putting that mate due to the riots on here if i did. Obviously they could use them but they would need to be from a trusted objective source agreed by both parties!! ![]()
Fair enough, but i think that there would be more bother if Hull tried to reduce Hornes wages and when he took them to court they produce half a dozen of James Smailes match reports as exhibit A. 
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| Club Owner | 29160 | No
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| Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
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| Quote: R.B.A "Fair enough, but i think that there would be more bother if Hull tried to reduce Hornes wages and when he took them to court they produce half a dozen of James Smailes match reports as exhibit A. ![]()
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| Quote: Big Dave T "Actually performance in the role would and could be used to dismiss him. As an alternative i'd offer him a renegotiated contract. (obviously only if his form doesnt pick up)
Ive said for years that rugby league players can be dismissed on the grounds of capability (ie not performing) but no clubs take this up, mainly due to the bad press and as you say possible impacts on recruitment.
I'd be disappointed though if his performances remain 50% of what they have always been but he stays on 100% of his salary. (Richard himself wouldnt want this either)'"
As nobeerineasthull as pointed out, it might be theoretically possible, but it'd be impractical. He's the top Hull points scorer in the Albert Goldthorpe Medal, for example. You might think it is a joke award, but would you rely on a judge to agree?
I don't know the lad, but he'd be foolish, IMO, to accept a pay-cut - unless it is in exchange for a longer deal. He's done nothing wrong, and his form and fitness have been good enough to be selected for 22 games in SL this year. He's got a young family I believe and has to look after them.
How would you react if a player felt his performances deserved a pay [iincrease[/i and he tried to squirm out of an existing deal to go elsewhere? |
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| Jul 2003 | 21 years | |
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| Quote: Nobeerineasthull "Any employee can be dismissed for capability or performance but apart from the PR issues highlighted by Big Dave the main problem with a professional RL player would be proving it and the reason for it. There would be plenty of scope for the player to muddy the waters by alleging bad coaching, tactics, being played out of position, other players not performing etc. In addition the reasons for the non-performance would have to be addressed with the player and the appropriate warnings given before he could be dismissed. In all but the most extreme cases it is a legal minefield and I can't see any club going down that route.
Horne has had a poor season by his standards which may be down to his injury last year, his diabetes or taking his eye off the ball because of his testemonial.
i don't believe that any player should be regarded as untouchable. However the fact remains he is one of our few quality players and I think its too soon to be talking about a pay cut or re-negotiating his contract. I would be very disappointed if he were to have as bad a season next year and would be surprised if we were talking about him in these terms at this time next year.'"
Excellent post, and sums up my feelings on the matter. |
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| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Moderator | 36786 | |
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| Jul 2003 | 21 years | |
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| Quote: Sebasteeno "Carrying Horne all season is one of the reasons FC are so bl00dy appauling at present. When he was injured a few weeks back and Whiting took a more active role we improved now Whitings out and its back to the same old tosh.
IMO this team needs to change dramatically and with Long coming in id have Tansey at S/O and put Horne at full back as he clearly isnt good enough to be a half back anymore.'"
This, on the other hand, is utter rubbish. As usual. |
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| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Club Owner | 29160 | No
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| Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
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| Quote: Kosh "Excellent post, and sums up my feelings on the matter.'"
Sums up mine too. |
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| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Club Owner | 29160 | No
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| Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
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| Quote: Mild Rover "As nobeerineasthull as pointed out, it might be theoretically possible, but it'd be impractical. He's the top Hull points scorer in the Albert Goldthorpe Medal, for example. You might think it is a joke award, but would you rely on a judge to agree?
I don't know the lad, but he'd be foolish, IMO, to accept a pay-cut - unless it is in exchange for a longer deal. He's done nothing wrong, and his form and fitness have been good enough to be selected for 22 games in SL this year. He's got a young family I believe and has to look after them.
How would you react if a player felt his performances deserved a pay [iincrease[/i and he tried to squirm out of an existing deal to go elsewhere? ![]()
Read my follow up post!!
To address your 2nd paragraph, if his choice is to renegotiate on a lower deal or be dismissed the balls in his court. The only thing he has done wrong is to be a shadow of his former self. If he is like that next season too FC need to take a serious look at it. No room for sentiment in sport.
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| Quote: Big Dave T "Read my follow up post!!
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