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Player Coach | 1253 | Hull FC |
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| thanks for all the sensible replies to my post,some very interesting points brought up.don`t get me wrong,i`m a died in the wool lifelong supporter of F.C.just look where i was born.Mrs.B,if you like haggis ,i`ll bring it down on friday.
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International Board Member | 17898 | Hull FC |
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Oct 2003 | 22 years | |
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| Quote Saf="Saf"I heard from a current SL player that the clubs are close to agreeing a 2 tier SL with 10 clubs in each, promotion and relagation between the 2 divisions, £800k salary cap in SL2 and £2m in SL1. This sounds like the radical thinking we are looking for.'"
First thoughts are that this isn't a great idea. Will the promoted team get any relegation protection? Look at Super League when there was relegation. The promoted team often went straight back down. Look at Widnes. Given a franchise, but finished bottom. The teams promoted would be like the proverbial whore's drawers.
Needs a lot more thinking through, including whether its a good idea at all
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Moderator | 36786 | Hull FC |
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| Quote Chris28="Chris28"Even with the talk of tapas for us out of towners , I'm not for a merger (and the temptation to lock this has been almost overwhelming). I just feel that both clubs have so much tradition (my in-laws have been going for 50+ years plus their parents before them, for example) that would be lost, sacrificed in the altar of the quick buck (and for who?). The posts about derby day are spot on and I'm not convinced that regular 20000 crowds are a probability even within 5 years. Success for one team would increase crowds at that club, but not necessarily at the expense of the other.
I think it is time for a serious discussion about RL finances and marketing the game better as the "dying in its arris" comments are, in my view, right too. Merging clubs wasn't the answer in 1995/6 and it isn't now for mine. I can't come up with a suitable football merger suggestion that reflects FC/KR (finances, rivalry, current positions/performance), but for sake of argument, imagine the outcry (because I can) if the suggestion was for Sheffield United and Sheffield Wednesday to merge, just because one was having a little difficulty?'"
This, in all respects.
I don't follow Hull FC because I want them to be successful or feel they will be - it's the other way around. For that reason the prospect of a merged side being a success would not be enough for me to start supporting it. If I had that mentality I'd have switched to supporting Wigan/Saints/Leeds etc. years ago.
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International Board Member | 17898 | Hull FC |
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| Plus - contractual issues. A £2m cap team gets relegated and has to trim their cap by £1.2m. Unless there's a premier league style parachute payment, or some kind of exemption (which defeats the object of the cap) that has legal problems written all over it, as well as the big clubs potentially cherry picking the smaller ones, so not shifting the balance of power at all.
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Moderator | 12672 | Hull KR |
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Jun 2007 | 18 years | |
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| Quote UllFC="UllFC"Sounds like a good plan to me, providing that the 'SL2' gets a TV deal of some sort, and isn't just left in the wilderness.
also will the RFL be bold enough to drop the team with the lowest fanbase (London) to the 2nd division?'"
I'd assume it'd mean bottom 4 go down the year before. I've heard worse plans. P&R gives more games more meaning and keeps the dream alive. A second full-time division gives young players somewhere to develop. Is there enough cash to make it feasible though?
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Moderator | 36786 | Hull FC |
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| Quote Saf="Saf"I heard from a current SL player that the clubs are close to agreeing a 2 tier SL with 10 clubs in each, promotion and relagation between the 2 divisions, £800k salary cap in SL2 and £2m in SL1. This sounds like the radical thinking we are looking for.'"
Going back to a structure remarkably similar to what we had prior to SL is radical?
I'm not sure how two tier SL addresses any of the major problems the game faces. There aren't enough quality players, fans, sponsors, or cashed-up owners to support one league of 14 teams so quite how 20 teams are supposed to manage is beyond me. And where are the 10 sides strong/rich enough to make SL1 a top quality league? How many sides would be able to afford to spend the full £2m cap?
Seems like ill-thought-out knee-jerkiness to me.
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Moderator | 36786 | Hull FC |
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| Quote UllFC="UllFC"Sounds like a good plan to me, providing that the 'SL2' gets a TV deal of some sort, and isn't just left in the wilderness.
also will the RFL be bold enough to drop the team with the lowest fanbase (London) to the 2nd division?'"
In what way is it a good plan? What are the benefits? Why would Sky suddenly decide it wants rights to a second-tier RL competition when it's shown zero interest before?
And on the one hand you think the return of P&R is a good thing but immediately call for a side to be relegated based on crowds rather than performance? How does that work? Not that London are likely to be around much longer as a pro side anyway.
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Moderator | 12672 | Hull KR |
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Jun 2007 | 18 years | |
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| Quote Chris28="Chris28"Plus - contractual issues. A £2m cap team gets relegated and has to trim their cap by £1.2m. Unless there's a premier league style parachute payment, or some kind of exemption (which defeats the object of the cap) that has legal problems written all over it, as well as the big clubs potentially cherry picking the smaller ones, so not shifting the balance of power at all.'"
You'd have to put wage reduction or release clauses in players contracts.
Yo-yoing would happen sometimes, but if tier 2 had more (sky) money they could build the foundation of a tier 1 squad, and add to it on promotion, rather than having to start almost from scratch like until the drawbridge was raised. To make p and r workable, you need to narrow the gap between divisions, reversing a long trend. To me that is desirable, it is just where the money comes from.
Cherry picking is to be expected, but this would open more clubs to 'investment' and the chance to be picker s rather than pickees.
Break-even sustainability won't happen at clubs chasing success, one or two exceptions apart, unless we shut out benefactors across the board.
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International Board Member | 53839 | No Team Selected |
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| A merger is a big no for me and I don't see it as an answer to the fact one club has financial difficulties.
A bigger question is how RL moves forward and clubs can remain solvent. Also how we can keep our best young players from leaving to the NRL, raising the cap is an option but it only makes my first point even more important.
RL has an uncertain future I think unless we get more money men coming into the game.
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Club Owner | 3807 | Hull FC |
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| MERGE ! teams with just as much history in Australia have merged successfully , despite being from very obvious parts of Sydney with their own identity. We come from the same CITY so what have we to be precious about. Time and finances may well draw us to a merger anyway as Rovers are sunk
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International Star | 339 | No Team Selected |
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| My heart says I would never support a merged team. My head says that I would after a certain amount of time as I love my rugby. That would be where the risk is in a potentially merged club here in Hull IMO. It will lose supporters in the short term but I think in the long term people would start to return. Whoever was in charge of the merged club would need to be patient and accept that attendances would be low to begin with whilst the initial anger and outrage died away that I think many fans of both FC and KR would be feeling.
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| Quote Tarquin Fuego="Tarquin Fuego"Time and finances may well draw us to a merger anyway as Rovers are sunk'"
This is all just a hypothetical scenario as far as I'm concerned but as things stand what is in it for Hull FC to merge with Hull KR? FC's finances seem to be in order so why would we risk losing our identity and merging with our nearest and dearest rivals?
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