Agree, it's the manner of the defeats, had we lost an entertaining game today by say 2 tries or less i'd say 'ok we're in transition, brighter days are ahead' but there wasn't a single positive in any aspect.

I don't think our problems are really Smith's doing. Far from it. I think he's been dealt a tough hand. However, I think the job is too big for him. Yes he's got experience, yes he's used to dealing with pressure, but this is different. We need to overhaul the club from top to bottom, and I just don't believe he's got the stomach for that at this stage in his career. We need someone young and driven with fresh ideas. Who that would be I'm not sure, but there are plenty of good assistants out there waiting for their chance. I don't mind us losing every week if I can see some sort of long term plan and some green shoots of progress. At the minute we are going absolutely nowhere.

I think we are definitely struggling financially post covid and are trying to cut our cloth. How much we are struggling is up for debate, and opinions are varied, but we certainly do seem to be badly in need of some investment. Our problems are compounded when you consider that a big chunk of our cap is tied up in absolute dead wood. Just Tuimavave and Houghton's salaries alone must surely be enough to bring in 4 or 5 useful players, and neither of them are good enough anymore. They aren't the only ones. The whole squad needs ripping up and starting again tbh. Of the current squad of 40 ish there would only be about 10 that I'd be sad to see go, and most of those are kids fresh from the academy.

We have three fundamental issues at the Club, financial, recruitment, and coaching.

No one knows our true financial situation other than Adam. We know Adam isn’t as rich as other owners and we know we have a Covid loan. I suspect it is true we are the loan repayment has made a major dent into our finances. I also think the cushion of no relegation means Adam has taken the opportunity to reduce the cap spend to allow our cash flow to cover the loan repayments. This started last season when Kane Evans and Griff were not replaced during the season. This has contributed to a less than competitive squad. The challenge will come, when if Adam is true to his word and our final situation improves later this year, our cap and hopefully marquee spend increases. I think he needs to update us on our financial situation and be realistic on where we are and when we’ll be back at cap and if and when we’ll be in for any marquee signings.

Our recruitment has been poor for several years. Since 2017, I think the only good value signing were Ratu and Clifford. On limited viewing, I think that both Ese Ese and Pele could become good signings, but that is dependent upon them staying on the pitch. We knew last season that major squad change was needed, however although changes began, i don’t think we can say we are even a club in transition yet. Looking at our squad, if we want to compete for the Top 6 you’d want us to have a core of at least 12 players to go forward into next season, before our next batch of recruitment, to go with a batch of developing youngsters who supplement the squad. Out of our current squad, the only players I’d definitely keep next season are Ese Ese, Pele, Walker and Ligi. Everyone else is replaceable or their salary could be better spent.

The past seasons have led to us accepting mediocrity. For instance, I’ll use Cam Scott and Fash as examples. I’ll just say, I like them both and they have never let Hull down. Fash is and always will be a prop. However, at times we play him as a Loose Forward and some are accepting of that. Fash never takes a step backwards or shrugs a tackle, but he is not a LF. I can not recall Fash putting someone through a gap or show creative handling. Cam has been in or around the first team for 3 seasons. Sound in defence, however as a Centre he rarely makes an attacking break. Today I saw the rumour that he could be going to Wakefield and that some would think that to be a shame. I’d be only worried if a Top 4 side were coming in for our players. Other than a great offload to Swift in last years Derby and following up his own kick to score v Salford, I can’t recall Cam being a real attacking threat. To be at least a Top 6 side, we need our centre’s to be able to make a break, to run in tries from 30-40m out. I think of Schofield, Leuluai, Steve Evans, Richard Horne and Yeamo. That’s what I expect from our centres. Fitness too, including today’s first 5 minutes, Sutty and Carlos have played 11/34 games together in the past 2 seasons.
I work in logistics. All the top companies replace their vehicles every 4 years, 1/4 each year. Sports teams should follow a similar pattern. Some players will stay longer than 4 years, others for a shorter period. However, we seem to have hung on to too many players for too long and also have had them in one batch and this has led to an imbalance.

Finally coaching. The pressure on finances and bad injury situation has not helped us last season or the current campaign. However, whichever Hull team take the field, I think it is fair for the fans to expect structure, discipline, fitness, effort and a game plan and that comes down to the coaching team to instill that into the 17 players each week.
Discipline - We are currently lacking with most of these. In 4 out of 5 games this season, we have conceded a try within the first 6 minutes. We have received 3 red cards, 3 yellow cards, had 6 suspensions for a total of 9 games. Also 5 games in, we have yet to complete a full half with 13 players and we have not once had more players on the pitch than our opponent. Whatever we think of the referees and the RFL Disciplinary, most of this record has been self inflicted.

Fitness and technique. Our line speed is awful. Both Rovers and Leigh’s line speeds were excellent. It’s easy shouting they are all offside, but I noticed Rovers especially were drilled to come up quickly in a line and closed us down immediately throughout the game, as did Leigh today. Why can’t we do that? That’s the Coaches job and you go over it again and again on the training ground until it is second nature.

Game Plan - have we got one? There’s no game management. Our kicking game is awful. We do the same comfortable kick offs to our opponents catcher. Against Rovers in the 1st half we had Ashworth kicking on the last tackle, that’s was both unfair on the player and questions who is calling things on the pitch? Successful teams don’t do that. Without fail on the last tackle, Wigan used to give it to Andy Farrell; Leeds to Kevin Sinfield; and in 2016 & 2017 Hull gave it to Marc Sneyd. After 3 months pre season training we give it to a player who should never expect to be first receiver on the 5th tackle.

Effort - this could be better and more consistent. Tex Hoy’s effort today was great. He left everything on the pitch and he was hurting. Last week at Cats the effort was generally good. However, v London, Matty Russell showed more effort than we’d seen from the whole Hull team in the previous games. That’s a worry. That’s either a club attitude or we have the wrong players.

So our issues are significant across the board. Before we make a decision on Tony, we need to know what our financial situation is; we urgently need a proper Head of Recruitment with better contacts and a better squad replacement policy; once those are in place we can decide on the coach. We either stick with Tony or decide to go with someone else who can instill extra value into the squad. Shaun Wane or Steve McNamara or Paul Rowley may be the British coaching options; or we go to the Southern Hemisphere to find a Coach who can make a difference we need.

Finally, I stayed for the full 80 minutes today, I always have done for the past 49 seasons. I’m a season ticket holder and these days I live in Rugby and it’s a five hour round trip to come to a home game. The club is in my blood and always will be. However, I don’t blame anyone for leaving early today. Leigh were good, but they were not great. They were missing their 3 best players and cut us open with ease.

Our fans deserve better. A club of our size should be in the Top 6 every season and really be in the Top 4 competing for trophies. Currently we are a long way off on both counts.

When Smith was appointed, I was relieved because for too long, we had appointed Assistant Coaches with no man-management skills.
They say a teams performance, is an indicator of the personality of the Manager. Laid back, can't be bothered....
Everyone and his dog knows, we are short in quality.. but fitness, and defence are non negotiable, for professional RL players. This is the responsibility of the Manager to ensure a group of players are physically and mentally prepared to play a game of RL.
Personally I would go out and get Shaun Wane, and allow him to appoint his own coaching, and fitness staff.

Sean McCrae used it as an excuse - cancer culture
However he was lazy and his signings garbage

I’m sure our new overseas signings wonder what the heck they’ve
Signed up for
They must think we’ve gone back in time to the part time , have a smoke , era
When you look at it there are 2 big flashing signals in my mind

1. We’ve never appointed a World Class coach, aside from Brian Smith, who left after 2 seasons.Any coach that leaves us goes on to do literally NOTHING. What does that tell you ?Radford Last Steve Crooks Agar Gentle - the list goes on and on and on and on

Until we address this then we are consigned to mediocrity

2. Hull born players - I feel qualified to talk about this as having coached young working class Council estate lads for years. I was also invited to run the KR academy back in 2000 and helped out at the FC academy for a short while. Ive also watched youth rugby here in Melbourne as well as Youth sports in general in Australia and chatted to parents and kids etc in many sports due to my kids being involved etc

How many British Test team standard players have we produced in the last say 50 years since 1979 ?
How many times have our Youth teams been the GF winners ?

There is something about the mentality of young working class men and boys in Hull. It seems they lack some confidence.Is that because their parents and or teachers can’t give them that positive reinforcement with out pressurising them ?

I have my opinions on this but likely to get told to stop being judgy so I’ll reserve my thoughts.
BUT it is interesting that we can’t produce half backs but can churn out props !
When was the last time we produced a GB 7 , 6 or winger ?

It’s all very interesting to say the least - well I find it worthy of a discussion anyways

Smith will be gone soon - we won’t win again until London

Could Uncle Tony give the Radiator mascot a go at Prop next week ?
Big unit !

Playing Lane at hooker whilst a NZ international hooker plays aimlessly out of position in the halves is enough to get any coach sacked in my book.

Could have moved Okunbor to wing, McIntosh to centre
Sutcliffe to 6, and Brown or Smith to 9.

For all this talk about needing a world class coach, its a pipe dream, your in no position to sign one. You'd be better off looking at a young hungry Aussie, someone with fresh new ideas, I doubt Maguire or Holbrook were on massive money when they first came over here, but what they had was a new vision and modern philosophy regarding culture, even Grix would probably have his own 'new' ideas.
Your all having a good moan, AP's keeping us in the dark, the MRP have got it in for us, but it's probably going to get a lot worse before it gets any better, the good thing in your favour is that you have a very loyal fan base that will stick by the club IAKOW,

His arms are too short. He'll drop too much ball

And this was because the experienced Coach once again for some reason yet again put Houghton in at 9 to flog him for 80mins despite him not being 100% and suffering a hamstring issue. Who’d have thought we have young lad who in the squad that can play hooker, offer something we don’t have currently in any of the 17’s picked so far which is quickness, creativity and guile. 2 years ago you could see a Houghton was no longer an 80 min player and after more than 30mins he was just not effective and by 60 mins he was just a body in the line who got targeted. Yet we as a club give him another year and still a continuing repeating what no longer works. This isn’t a dig and Danny but more the lack of brains within the club to move forward/do things differently the clubs just a rudderless vessel.

For me most of the issues are down to poor Coaching/direction from Smith with absolutely no apparent plan/structures in place. He’s far too much of a laid back Larry and hasn’t got any drive.

The season is over already and we ain’t even at Easter, no matter what is done the season can’t be saved however removal of Smith & Gene at least gives the club a fighting chance of stemming the damage and reducing the chances of losing a number of its core fan base.

Probably time we bled some new talent

Is it chess or rugby?

More like "Frustration ".