Well I've just seen the most blatant example of a referee evening up a mistake your ever likely to get in the Saints vs Wire game. Neither of the passes were forward and he obviously gave the second one to even it up.

Yep! The second call was laughable.

2 refs is a really bad idea, imagine Robert Hicks AND Tim Roby turning up haha

GREAT NEWS. Tim Roby refereeing us v Catalans this weekend.

Shame there isn't a smiley face to signify me tearing me train tickets up really. Or hanging myself from the bedroom light.

That response typifies what is wrong with referees through all levels of RL, you all believe your beyond question and then start bleating about how hard it is, the public just dont understand etc etc.
right from the bottom refs are biased on ocassions as they are human and because they are beyond question they abuse that power....
recently in our so called premier division the standard has been awful to say the least and some seriously glaring mistakes and inconsistency ... in any other job mistakes that bad that decide the outcome of a days work would cost people their jobs...
what always surprised me was when our refs in SL pull the game up for the silliest of things then that same ref goes over to Oz to ref ANZAC tests and such like and the game is a thugathon and do not pull, different remit ......

Look, without wanting to engage in gob[is[/ihite tennis with a fully paid-up imbecile.

Please point out where I have ever said referees are or should be beyond question.

Then you can point where I've "bleated" about how hard the job is.

The job isn't an easy one for all the various reasons I've highlighted in the past. The fact that you choose to completely ignore my suggestions for mitigating any shortcomings speaks more of your intellect than my reasoning.

Someone touched a nerve there. What an arrogant reply.

Definately an ex-ref. Good job you're too old to take it up again.

I put you in the "barmpot box" around your 3rd post on here

TBH I think Cod'eads contribution and opinions on the refs situation are valuable and often grounding, he has ref'ed and often offers a sensible opinion when we are all ranting and our opinions are clouded in frustration/anger, he is experienced in the role he performed and just because we may not want to hear what he says does not give us the right to just dismiss it.

Look we all know rugby league is the worst refereed sport in the country, with the possible exception of the Olympic boxing. We also know, because we can see it with our own eyes, that the standards are falling alarmingly.

As Voodoo says there are clues as to why that is within Cod Ead's posts – if you criticise or slag off the referees you're doing so either because you've lost the match or because you don't understand the rules or how hard it is or a combination of all three. That's the attitude of match officials and the people in charge of them. There's not a lot of looking in the mirror here. No doubt this opinion makes me an imbecile as well.

The problem here, as I see it, is a petty fundamental matter of numbers. If we had thousands of people wanting to be Rugby League referees then the cream would rise to the top and there would be a better quality of referee at the top level. It would also enable us to drop referees who are in poor form – officials have form just the same as the players do as we've seen with Thaler who started this season well but has been dreadful in the past few weeks.

The lack of numbers means we are promoting referees like Child, Hicks and Roby who are simply not good enough.

It also means that the referees believe themselves to be beyond reproach. Where's the incentive for improving standards when you know that however well or badly you do you'll be back in the saddle next week?

You can see the effects of this week by week. Take Mr Ganson for example. What a pleasure it is to be at his games sometimes, and what a sodding nightmare at others. Depends what mood he's in. Sometimes he decides he's going to randomly punish players for not playing the ball properly for a half, then not in the second half and not again for several weeks. Some days he decides we're going to have a quick ruck and awards 20 penalties in the first 20 minutes of a game to make that happen. So what hope does anybody have if the performance of the referee is based on his mood from week to week? Where's the consistency here? Ganson knows that he's not going to be dropped, so what does he care?

The other problem is Cummins being in charge – because he wasn't a good referee himself. He showed last week that even if the chance to replace out of form referees was there he wouldn't take it. On the Friday night we saw a video referee decision from Ian Smith at Saints Catalans that was simply wrong on every level. What was his reponse to this? Fly Ian Smith back to the UK and make him the video referee for Hull KR v Hull on Monday of course. Like I say, where's the incentive to improve performance there?

The solution is long term. Pay our referees well, make it an attractive career option with a solid salary and pension, advertise, go into colleges and unis, go to career days, make it an option for people. Flood the system with numbers, train them well. Numbers are the only way we're going to solve this, but sadly we can't even attract enough players to the sport never mind officials.

Sadly you read Cod Ead on here, you listen to the rare bits that Cummins says, you look at the declining standards, you watch the arrogant and wildly inconsistent way Ganson, Silverwood and Childs approach matches and you quickly realise that not only is there not the money for this, there isn't the desire either. They don't care.

As far as the refereeing fraternity is concerned it's not them it's you and me. They're all we've got and we can like it or lump it. We're imbeciles. We don't understand. We're biased. And we can be ignored. Hand your £20 in at the turnstile please, then sit down and shut up.

Bill Harrigan might be out of work shortly. I'd offer him Stuart Cummins job.

You (and quite a few others) obviously don't "read Cod Ead(sic) on here" then, otherwise you'd have read this post on the 5th page of the rlHicks Injury thread

Quote: BarnetFC "There is a continuing problem with attracting new referees into the game, there's an even bigger problem in retaining them. It's all well & good to say that full-time Superleague refs are well remunerated and there's not much argument from me there. The problem is the quantity of referees rising to the top, get the numbers right and invariably the quality will improve too.

Stand on the touchline of some youth matches and listen to the abuse aimed at, quite often young, referees. There aren't enough amateur officials to ensure impartial touch judges at all but the highest level, most of the "pro" officials also take their share of amateur games too, at all age levels. When I lived in Hull I often refereed schools matches on a Wednesday afternoon, simply because I could usually blag a couple of hours away from my job to do it. It was pointed out to me on many occasions that the kids appreciated being refereed by a qualified official, as opposed to a teacher from one team in th first half and the other team's teacher taking over the 2nd half.

I am of the opinion that Stuart Cummings has passed his shelf-life. I'm disappointed that referees are not more accountable for their decisions and even more disappointed when they close ranks and a wall of silence goes up. I know that referees are assessed at each game, by each club and also by an RFL referee's assessor. Copies of the assessments used to be sent to referees and tables were produced of where the referee stood in comparison to his contemporaries. I see no reason for these tables to remain a secret. We have OPTA stats on how often a player farts during a game, why should a referee's performance be any different?

The full-time refs should personally review each match DVD and appraise not only their own performances but also those of their colleagues. If flaws in their performances are evident, they should be given extra coaching to eliminate them and if it becomes obvious that they are finding it difficult, then drop them down a league. But you can only do that if you have someone ready to replace him and that only comes with improving recruitment and retention'"

Or any of the various others both on this board and the VT.

You should actually start reading the words that are in front of you and not what you think they might be. I will defend referees from abuse and certainly from abuse by clueless idiots in the 50+ years I've watched, played and officiated in the game, I have never found a referee to be bent. I have seen levels of aptitude that range from superb to totally inept but never bent. Most refereeing mistakes come from poor positioning and concentration and it's a battle to keep your concentration at times. Certain players make it a mission to break a ref's concentration and they usually do it by constantly chattering - not criticising or being abusive, they'll ask about your last or next holiday etc. It's a game and one they play well, there's never enough to penalise them, it is simply a ruse to break the ref's concentration.

I have been critical of referees in the past and certainly will be again in the future. What I will defend though is the job that they do overall, simply because I have done it and recognise the pressure.

The job they're doing overall this season is indefensible. You undermine your points by trying to defend them for it. I'll watch three matches a weekend at the moment - the two TV games and the Hull match. I cannot recall a weekend where all three were even competently refereed. In fact I can probably count on the fingers of one hand the weekends where two out of three were done competently - not well, just competently.

You were on here after the Magic weekend talking about what the definition of blatant was after the infamous Rovers try. A blind chimp could have spotted that forward pass and yet both referee and touch judge missed it. That's inexcusable, inexplicable, indefensible incompetence of the highest order but rather than say it you and the rest of the refereeing fraternity talk about the pressure of the job, only getting one look at it, you do a better job etc. Totally undermines what few salient points you do make.

summer holidays end soon, thankfully.

Without trying to stick up for the refs they are not on whole to blame. What use really are the touch judges? At times i think they are either told by the ref what decisions they are there to make or they just dont totally want to undermind the refs call.

Im sure its not easy being a ref and if they had a lot mor help from the TJ's then maybe they would start getting more things right. At times you can see when a ref is guessing on a decision. Also rules dont help them or definitions of. Im sure alot of the players are unaware of what is a penalty when pushing/tackiling/dragging a player into touch.

Something needs to change though as way too many game are being influenced or even just spoilt and decisions from 1 game to the next vary.