Sums it up for me. All that has happened this season is that our game plan has been to use this so called massive pack to steam roller over teams and it's turned some likely close defeats into close wins. Fair enough, however it doesn't smack of a great change in our game plan to me.

I'm also at a loss to remember many occassions where we have actually been far and away better in the forwards than the opposition. To me our pack lacks pace and guille. It's all about trying to smash it up down the middle and force teh opposition into submission. It's why when we do win it's by narrow margins. This myth about our so called massive, aggressive pack is purely a myth

"So called injury to Hall"??????

Absolutely right. We've been pushed around by supposedly inferior/smaller/younger packs on many occasions and on Saturday there was only Moa winning collisions. Our forwards often just look tired to me apart from the ones we take off - Moa , Lauacki - of course who tend to be fresh!!!??

Who are the players that are going to do the off the ball running to make space by holding up the oppositions defensive line for our 3/4s though ?

Well that's for the coaches to sort out, it's not rocket science, well at least it shouldn't be.

Surely that is the first step, turn the close defeats into wins and start climbing the ladder in terms of places. Having done that this season we now have to take the next step of being able to expand on that style of play and start dominating teams and winning games more compfortably. That's the challenge to RA and the team.

If it's not rocket science then why are we 2 1/2 into agar's reign and it still isn't happening?

Agreed. How are we likely to do that with basically the same forwards we have now?

do you see him as a permanant fixture in the centre next year?i would go with that personally,we have looked better out wide with him there,just dont think agar will do this tbh......

Why do we need a 5 year plan, when it can be done much quicker by getting a real head coach?

Wigan and Warrington did it in one season!

Until, this basic facet of our attacking play is drilled into the players,
successfully, - it doesnt matter if we signed Thurston and Lockyer!!

Sorry, but Agar has had time to implement this, and is clearly unable
to deliver.

We will only improve, when we sign a better coach - not changing and chopping players season after season.

I agree its why I really like Wigan's youngsters as it is clear it has been drilled into them that they have to push up on everything. I don't think we have the mobility or work ethic for players to be willing to push up on every play which is what you see the best teams doing.

There were quite a few instances in Saturdays game when it simply went from Houghton to Long to Washbrook to Tickle to Berrigan to Lyne with no runners at all and the speed which this was done at was embarrassing to say the least.

Absolutely agree, but it sums up our whole attitude IMO. We seem to want to do just enough to scrape a win. So many examples of this, not only the high proportion of wins by slender margins, but targeting certain games (or otherwise, eg Wigan at home), switching off against Harlequins away at half time. We never go all out for 80 minutes to really thrash the opposition. Look at Saints v Rovers -if they'd got all their kicks Saints would have had 78 points that day against a top 8 side. I just can't see us with the current squad and coach having either the ability or appetite to deliver that.

Cons:
1, We are still a poor attacking side. When adding in that prior to being head coach he was supposedly our attacking coach, this looks very much like it can be laid at his door. We are at turns disorganised, disinterested, and/or stupid. We have far too few players with genuine rugby brains, a poor kicking game, and as soon as we come under any pressure revert straight back to one out rugby.
2, We have no flexibility in our approach to games. If things are not going our way we still don't/can't change anything and the game continues to drift away from us. This is a key area for winning a trophy, as all available have a knockout stage where we can't pin our hopes on fixing it for next time.

I think Agar has done very well this year he has taken the team to a play off place 6th but for the majority of the season a very respectful 4th . That is without the advantage of having a settled half back partnership . Recruitment policy needs to be questioned in my opinion as giving Long a two year contract at his age has not been a sensible option. Also signing players like Cusack are not of the same standard as really good imports like Kearney, Swain and Jasom Smith .

Berrigan , Long, Fitzgibbon, O' Mealey all have the big game experience and it should of been down to them to change the game . Long went missing big time and his kicking game was very dissapointing.

Weren't both long and horne injured for most of last season as well? May be some kind of pattern emerging here