Four points from the first eight games is our worst start since 2015. If we lose next Friday it'll be the worst start since 1999.

It'd alright, we always win at Headingley now

Why do fans think tinkering Tony should not shoulder any responsibility for this teams failings?
If he had come into the club and started with the first game i would understand he needed some time but he has had more than 3 months of pre season training with this squad to put a stamp on fitness,a structure for both attack and defence non of which we have seen during his time here.
His team selection today was borne out of desperation
An unfit Shaul was preferred to Litten.He must have known this was a gamble by naming Mitch on the bench
which i said yesterday when Ellam named the team would be to cover Shaul going off,Mitch to the wing and McIntosh to full back.
Mitch in any case should have started on the wing and would have bolsted the right edge defence which all season has leaked tries.
McIntosh was brought back on the wing when his confidence is shattered and i think he will be moved on
Then we have the debacle of Savelio dropped for performance related/ precautionary factors WTF is that all about.Its one or the other Tony
Then to play Evans instead of Brown thats tinkering Tonys final straw for me
Had high hopes for Smith here at Hull FC but he wont last the season.
Even if we have so many players off contract as a seasoned experienced coach he still should be able to get commitment and passion out of them because thats his job and he has failed big time.
Tuimavave as captain another error, and we are seeing now why leeds released Dwyer whos nickname has always been the headless chicken and Sutcliife who is bang average.
The main thing now is to get these players on the training pitch and improve their overall fitness and speed then move onto defence as a unit so we keep in matches and dont keep getting blown away.

Your silly nickname for Smith is already very tiring.

to be fair to smith,carlos being named captain just illustrates that we havent anyone in the entire team with any leadership qualities.we need someone on the pitch to crack the whip.having said that at least half of the current squad are just not good enough.good players have either left or retired and not been replaced with anything like the same quality.pearson has to take some of the blame.

I would never confuse you for others.
Surely though the coach should have told the players to go for goal with literally three or four seconds to go.Thats his job
We played the ball and the hooter went.Two points would have made it a two score game at that stage.

Who would you replace him with?

Lets be out of form is not a reasonable excuse, we wouldnt have a 17 each week. Im lead to believe Saviellos was due to his fitness and deciding not to risk him. Carlos I agree as captain but I dont see any other candidates.

Its obvious to me Smith is experimenting alot trying to cut the good from the bad. Giving kicks up the backside in hope it gives them more fire in the belly however he hasnt watched them as much as we have knowing West Hull under 11s would give this lot a game.

Hes damned if he does on the hooker front, he plays Houghton and people complain and he has rightly dropped Lovodua.

It may look strange to some people but he is merely for me trying to find 17 players who actually give a . Unforthnatley we cant muster half of that.

Smith isnt the problem and im not convinced Hodgson or Last was. Theres only one thing that hasnt changed in 5 years and its the same people who turf up that dross.

Going for the coach is brain dead. Any of the changes suggested wouldnt have changed the outcome today.

Could it be the owner at Fault ?

Just Asking by the way

Whilst (which seems to be a broken record now) Smith might not take us from where we are to the top. I find it hard to believe you actually think any coach could turn this lot around. The players dont care, they were laughing and joking at full time, only seemed Cator and Carlos who was bothered by the loss.

With that attitude it will be very hard for anybody to make players care when they just take wages for there coffees on marina.

I dont think Smith will win silverware here but I cant think of any other coach who will be better at a rebuild. What I am concerned with is the club think they can wait till the end of the season for change.

100% it is in my opinion.

Hes created a culture of player power IMO and mismanaged the salary cap.

When you think Smith had to give away our best player to sign a scrum half tells you the situation he inherited. 4 Hookers, 3 Full backs, 5 Centres but only 2 second rowers.

We can't keep changing the coach and we won't this time. I think Smith knows he's got a hell of a job on his hands. I do believe we are in a dog fight with wakey who goes done. Hopefully we can wheel and deal in the next few weeks. Maybe time to give a few of the youngsters a chance. Pearson has to take a fair share of responsibility but let's be honest without him we properly wouldn't have a club. Buckle up your belts it's gonna be a roller coaster

The old adage that you can not coach effort & determination has never been more true you either have pride in those things as an individual or you don’t. The majority of these players do not have any determination nor are they seemingly that bothered in regards to effort. Maybe part of the problem has been since winning the CC at Wembley they have believed their own hype and had their egos massaged by Radford, AP and Clarke enabling a poor culture evolve and grow.
As much as it will be difficult to shift any of these under performing lazy players it’s something that’s needs doing as a matter of urgency to remove the stench that is stinking out this club.
Smith as has been mentioned is likely experimenting to try and get improvement out the turds but much like rolling one in glitter it is still ultimately a turd. Think Smiths laid back style is being tested to its limits and the cancellation of time off shows his patience has worn thin with them. What is a surprise is this is the first time I can remember the players actually have a consequence for their so called efforts.
All we as fans ask for and want to see is a team play with effort & pride something that this bunch lack in barrow loads.

AP & Smith need to act quickly and cut a couple of players to try and give kick up the s to the rest, though even that probably wouldn’t bother some who have downed tools until their contracts run out.

I think hes tried dropping a few and it hasnt worked.

Big meeting needed with Shenton to identify which youngsters can come in and perform to a higher standard than whats on show.

Surely some of Balmforth, Staveley, Gardiner, Laidlaw, Wakakoke, Jebforth can do a better job than some of the current players.

For me Rovers line speed in defense was another level to ours.
I thought our forwards actually worked well at the start , but the gains were undone by bad organisation the last. Has to hit Clifford everytime thought dywer had a mare in that respect.
As Smith has said we just dont have the players or unity to cope under adversity.

Crying out for some leaders as theres none willing to galvanise the current lot. Also lacking major game smarts amongst the players, we need to be identifying some players with good rugby IQ.

Id like to see Brown in for Evans.
Balmforth on the bench
Staveley given a chance at loose forward.

What I can't fathom is that these players are playing for their futures. Most of the underperforming players contracts run out at the end of the season. The way things are at the moment is they have no chance of getting an extension with us but they are hardly putting themselves in the shop window to get one anywhere else. Or maybe they are simply not good enough anymore.