| FORUMS > Hull FC > Shaul's Positioning |
 |
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 1843 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Aug 2007 | 17 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2024 | Nov 2024 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: JACK DETH "As good as Shaul is in many facets of full back play, he clearly lacks in the attacking fullback stakes. If he was as good as we all think he is why was he not selected for England?
Yet Ratchford and Lomax were..even though Lomax wasn't first choice at Saints and Ratchford is a mistake machine. Even then they were moved aside for Widdop.
What do these three players have that Shaul does not? He does not create space or tries for the outside backs.
We cannot blame the whole team for this.
try assists 2017 - spot the odd one out
But it is the whole team. When Shaul catches the ball, the opposition either match us man for man or even have an extra man. That’s to do with the structure and what’s happening 1, 2, or 3 passes before. Shaul, I agree, isn’t the most creative of full backs but his job is made a hell of a lot harder by the attack structure.
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Star | 2456 | |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| May 2011 | 14 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2024 | Nov 2024 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: FC Callum "But it is the whole team. When Shaul catches the ball, the opposition either match us man for man or even have an extra man. That’s to do with the structure and what’s happening 1, 2, or 3 passes before. Shaul, I agree, isn’t the most creative of full backs but his job is made a hell of a lot harder by the attack structure.'"
Some unkind things said about Shaul on this thread. He’s been asked to take the ball up from acting half more this season. His one on one tackle in the second half on the Cas rampaging forward was absolute copy book. When he drops the ball, it’s a glaring mistake because he stands out more. People asking for him to be dropped is ludicrous. IMO. |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Star | 7788 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Apr 2014 | 11 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2024 | Nov 2024 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Armavinit "Some unkind things said about Shaul on this thread. He’s been asked to take the ball up from acting half more this season. His one on one tackle in the second half on the Cas rampaging forward was absolute copy book. When he drops the ball, it’s a glaring mistake because he stands out more. People asking for him to be dropped is ludicrous. IMO.'"
you are right. Jamie Shaul is working very hard having to compensate for the loss of Houghton by taking a lot more runs from dummy half than he would normally.He had a great game against St George but the thread is about his positioning which does let him down at times.
I have said many times that if Jamie had a bit of Rankin in him with the natural ability to chime into the attacking line and produce the pass then he would no doubt be in the England squad. |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 30348 | |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Mar 2007 | 18 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2024 | Nov 2024 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Armavinit "Some unkind things said about Shaul on this thread. He’s been asked to take the ball up from acting half more this season. His one on one tackle in the second half on the Cas rampaging forward was absolute copy book. When he drops the ball, it’s a glaring mistake because he stands out more. People asking for him to be dropped is ludicrous. IMO.'"
Imagine how much stick he'd get if he hadn't scored the winning try in our first ever wembley win |
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 30348 | |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Mar 2007 | 18 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2024 | Nov 2024 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: bonaire "you are right. Jamie Shaul is working very hard having to compensate for the loss of Houghton by taking a lot more runs from dummy half than he would normally.He had a great game against St George but the thread is about his positioning which does let him down at times.
I have said many times that if Jamie had a bit of Rankin in him with the natural ability to chime into the attacking line and produce the pass then he would no doubt be in the England squad.'"
"Chime" must be the most overused stevoism ever. It doesn't even mean anything to non stevo devotees |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 865 | |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Jan 2010 | 15 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Dec 2018 | Dec 2018 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: JACK DETH "As good as Shaul is in many facets of full back play, he clearly lacks in the attacking fullback stakes. If he was as good as we all think he is why was he not selected for England?
Yet Ratchford and Lomax were..even though Lomax wasn't first choice at Saints and Ratchford is a mistake machine. Even then they were moved aside for Widdop.
What do these three players have that Shaul does not? He does not create space or tries for the outside backs.
We cannot blame the whole team for this.
try assists 2017 - spot the odd one out
Great, one statistic. How about tries scored, metres gained, average gain per carry, clean breaks, tackle busts? Nobody denies that passing isn't his strong point and looking at the way the England team played his style doesn't fit. That doesn't make Shaul a bad player though.
Would you rather have Ratchford's 12 assists (a subjective stat) and 1 try or Shaul's 17 tries and 4 assists?
Or Tomkins less than productive 5.49 average gain against Shaul's 9.52?
Hardaker is the only one who doesn't have noticeable areas of weakness across his on field game and is the best all round on the field. Off it of course is a different story and would you really want him?
Shaul is not perfect by any means but his error rate is similar to the other leading full backs. Yes I would like him to continue to improve but the scapegoating going on here is ridiculous. Then again 3 years ago the reason for some poor attacking play by Hull was apparently solely down to Danny Houghton - you don't get the experts saying that now, I wouldn't be surprised if some of those experts are currently saying our attack is worse when he's missing.
|
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 8594 | |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Jul 2006 | 18 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2024 | Nov 2024 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
|
This thread has escalated into something other than what I first mentioned. I haven't mentioned his link up play, as he offers us different things in attack. It was to do with his defensive positioning, standing to shallow to not allow him to react to a break (Marshall x 3 times, Webster at the weekend), and his positioning when defending our goal line - staying in the line, rather than defending the in goal. If you look at the McMeeken try from the weekend, Shaul should be shadowing the ball, he should be in line with the guy kicking the ball allowing him to get to the ball, but he is 5-10metres from where he needs to behttps://farm5.staticflickr.com/4628/26681504788_7243b28bfa_z.jpg" >rlrl
This isn't scapegoating, it is trying to see reasons why we are conceding tries so that we can win more rugby matches
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Star | 5318 | |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Aug 2011 | 13 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Aug 2022 | Aug 2022 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
|
Problem is when we score a try from Sneyd's boot it's a great kick, when we concede a try from a kick it's poor defending.
|
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Star | 7788 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Apr 2014 | 11 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2024 | Nov 2024 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Wilde 3 "This thread has escalated into something other than what I first mentioned. I haven't mentioned his link up play, as he offers us different things in attack. It was to do with his defensive positioning, standing to shallow to not allow him to react to a break (Marshall x 3 times, Webster at the weekend), and his positioning when defending our goal line - staying in the line, rather than defending the in goal. If you look at the McMeeken try from the weekend, Shaul should be shadowing the ball, he should be in line with the guy kicking the ball allowing him to get to the ball, but he is 5-10metres from where he needs to behttps://farm5.staticflickr.com/4628/26681504788_7243b28bfa_z.jpg" >rlrl
This isn't scapegoating, it is trying to see reasons why we are conceding tries so that we can win more rugby matches'"
I agree with you about the positioning for Marshalls tries but The Webster try should have been stopped by Griffin who made a hopeless attempt to tackle him.
Shaul was alert to the McMeeken try and had set off to cover the kick but somehow tripped himself up in the in goal area otherwise he would have been able to clear the ball before it was touched down.
Have a look at the replay. |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Club Owner | 3695 | |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Feb 2004 | 21 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2024 | Nov 2024 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
|
Simple - play him at hooker
He has all the attributes and sh*t off a stick darting through the A gap with a tired defence tackling our big forwards
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Chairman | 3462 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2024 | Jul 2024 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Tarquin Fuego "Simple - play him at hooker
He has all the attributes and sh*t off a stick darting through the A gap with a tired defence tackling our big forwards'"
I did enjoy that try against Saints from dummy half ... but no. I just couldn't cope with the loud complaining about his passing. |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Board Member | 3524 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Nov 2002 | 22 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Aug 2023 | Apr 2022 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
|
Shaul is a great player . But I noticed last night when he got the ball in the attacking line he spun around and went backwards.
He needs to be chime in the line and be more direct.
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Board Member | 3460 |  |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Feb 2003 | 22 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Jul 2018 | Jul 2018 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: HFC Boy "Snail is a great player . But I noticed last night when he got the ball in the attacking line he spun around and went backwards.
He needs to be chime in the line and be more direct.'"
This isn't a new thing. |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 30348 | |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Mar 2007 | 18 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2024 | Nov 2024 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
|
You really notice when a team has a good full back how much space they can create for the centre and winger. Shaul is like barry banks when he gets the ball. It's not all his fault as we tend to have no dummy runners and players just ship the ball aimlessly out to him without ever committing the defence. If we could improve this area we'd win the league in the next year or two IMO
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Board Member | 3524 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Nov 2002 | 22 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Aug 2023 | Apr 2022 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
|
Ben Barba is showing the rest of SL what a good fullback can bring.
Jamie is a great fullback but needs to be more direct.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
