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So. Do any of the above excuses make it OK?
No, they don't. The fact quite a few people think it is, speaks volumes about the fall in moral standards.

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To be fair its been going on for years, its not a recent thing. As long ago as 1986 when I started working on the turnstiles at the Boulevard I had parents swearing to me their 5ft son had just turned 4 years old and so on. With the old gates at the Boulevard and the (lack of) security there wasn't a lot you could do but you can with the more modern, manned turnstiles. It was bound to happen with unmanned ticket machines, there has to be some trust. Like cc said, it is a problem for the SMC to sort out, afterall, it was them that got rid of the manned ticket office who could question and request proof of identity.

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Quote: Large Paws "So. Do any of the above excuses make it OK?
No, they don't. The fact quite a few people think it is, speaks volumes about the fall in moral standards.'"

Who's said it's okay?

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Quote: joetwizzy "Who's said it's okay?'"

Not directly no, indirectly yes. If you can't read between the lines...

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Quote: knockersbumpMKII "Not directly no, indirectly yes. If you can't read between the lines...'"

Not really. I think everyone agreed it's not right. We disagreed on the severity.
It seems to range from "Tut, SMC need to sort it" to "Scum, they need hanging".

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Quote: joetwizzy "This is a crime in the same way as downloading music illegally off the internet. Watching an unauthorised clip of Super League on youtube. Watching content online not intended for your country. Etc.

Yes there is a reason it's not allowed, but give it a rest. I bet every single one on here condemning it so strongly have done similar to the above. It shouldn't be done and the club should take action, but it is not as terrible as some people are suggesting.'"


No perhaps its not I agree, but doing the other things you cite although not right and in fact illegal, hardly hurt Hull FC do they? The relationship between a Club and its devoted fans is a little different to that between an owner of a TV and Sky TV. Yeh the stuff you quote hurts musicians starving artists, the RL and TV company's but in this case for a lot of people its not the legal principle of what has been done, so much as the fact that fans are doing it to swindle their Club, the team they support, who need the cash and expect people who support them to play the game, while the rest of their fellow fans stump up to support their team. Its almost I guess a matter of honour really! Just my thoughts and I am an old b*gger!

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Quote: joetwizzy "Who's said it's okay?'"


I refer you to the answer below your question.

Several people have inferred it's OK. (having seen some comments on F.B. some have admitted it).
I happen to think it isn't.

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Wilf has the right of it. On the global scale of crime it hardly registers but given that the victim is the club we all support that cranks it up a few notches.

Enough people start doing it and the club takes a significant financial hit.

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It's stupid how people think lowering the prices is the easiest option when it's clearly not. People don't realise that the club is a business and that businesses need to make a profit at the end of the year to survive long term. If you look at football, clubs charge £50+ for a ticket when they don't even need it, football is all about making the largest profit instead of entertainment these days, whereas Rugby is for entertainment and survival. In my eyes, the club are charging the lowest they can for adult tickets and these 'fans' that think £21-£22 is too much are narrow minded and ridiculous.

Wish some people would open their eyes and look at the wider picture before spurting out stupid comments like they have on social media.

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Hang 'em High!

Totally wrong and robbing the club unnecessarily.

However, it's been going on for years. From when I started going in the 70's, you always used to see some blokes sheppardingly their kids in through the turnstile and slipping the operator something for their trouble. So both the supporter and operator were robbing the club at the same time.

Also used to go to City at Boothferry Park and see 18 year olds trying to kid their way through that they were U14. They'd often get found out that when they couldn't quite make up their Date of Birth.

Worst case I've seen was also at Boothferry Park, was when three lads (one used to go to our school), used to take it in turns to sit in a wheel chair each game, while the other two pushed them round to DIY disabled shelter they'd put up in front of the SE terrace. By the end of the season most of the South Stand had clocked on to it and it became part of the pre-match entertainment. No light shows in those days!

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nothing new im afraid, ive known friends who have purchased child tickets instead of adults when leeds introduced the same ticket entry system, once they twigged, they made sure that most away tickets were/are checked

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Quote: The Dentist Wilf "No perhaps its not I agree, but doing the other things you cite although not right and in fact illegal, hardly hurt Hull FC do they? The relationship between a Club and its devoted fans is a little different to that between an owner of a TV and Sky TV. Yeh the stuff you quote hurts musicians starving artists, the RL and TV company's but in this case for a lot of people its not the legal principle of what has been done, so much as the fact that fans are doing it to swindle their Club, the team they support, who need the cash and expect people who support them to play the game, while the rest of their fellow fans stump up to support their team. Its almost I guess a matter of honour really! Just my thoughts and I am an old b*gger!'"


Sir i applaud your morals regarding your club but even though you try and justify it on a level of who needs money more your argument is still flawed. People download music illegally, taking money from artists, bands, producers, companies etc in the process because they can. It can be done.

My computer has all the best and latest spyware, registry cleaners and driver boosters etc on it. I haven't paid a penny for them, i downloaded them and downloaded illegal serial keys to work them thus taking money out of the pockets of the makers and sponsors.... because i can and it can be done.

People opt to stream sky on their computer taking money away from every sports club they show. I am currently watching Liverpool v Man City in HD on my skybox that cost me £16 subscription for a year on a signal i take from Ireland on a scrambled I.P. Why?..... because i can and it can be done.

I sometimes go to the hot deli counter at the supermarket, buy a couple of sausages or something, eat them on the way round and kick the packaging under the shelving units so i don't need to pay the £2 or £3 it would have cost me extra. Yep you guessed it, because i can and it can be done.

If i need something new that i can get from work and it would only cost 50p in a shop i will still nick it from work.

Conclusion :- If somebody can get away with saving a few quid, even if it is un-moral they will do it. Sports clubs are a lot wealthier than somebody on £15,000 or so a year and can take the hit better. Robin Hood wasn't a million miles off. If people can get away with it they will do. It's up to the firms, companies, sports clubs to find a way of stopping it.

ccs
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Quote: Cherry_Warrior "Sir i applaud your morals regarding your club but even though you try and justify it on a level of who needs money more your argument is still flawed. People download music illegally, taking money from artists, bands, producers, companies etc in the process because they can. It can be done.

My computer has all the best and latest spyware, registry cleaners and driver boosters etc on it. I haven't paid a penny for them, i downloaded them and downloaded illegal serial keys to work them thus taking money out of the pockets of the makers and sponsors.... because i can and it can be done.

People opt to stream sky on their computer taking money away from every sports club they show. I am currently watching Liverpool v Man City in HD on my skybox that cost me £16 subscription for a year on a signal i take from Ireland on a scrambled I.P. Why?..... because i can and it can be done.

I sometimes go to the hot deli counter at the supermarket, buy a couple of sausages or something, eat them on the way round and kick the packaging under the shelving units so i don't need to pay the £2 or £3 it would have cost me extra. Yep you guessed it, because i can and it can be done.

If i need something new that i can get from work and it would only cost 50p in a shop i will still nick it from work.

Conclusion
.... first time I've seen anyone so proud to admit that they are a thief.

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Quote: ccs ".... first time I've seen anyone so proud to admit that they are a thief.'"



That's kind of the point. It's hardly bank robbing is it. Which is what this thread is about.

I bet at least 50% of people on this thread have done or do one of the above. It all depends on your take on it. I would never go into a shop and put something in my pocket etc trying to evade cameras and guards. I work i pay bills, i pay for my shopping, clothes and so on. What i am saying is people will push what they can get away with. Everybody does it or has done, morals or no morals and anybody that says they haven't done anything similar is a liar. I can't afford a sky subscription and the best software for my media devices so i use tools that millions of others do. You might think i am Al Capone but to me i am just taking what i can from rich companies. Little victories.

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RL as a whole has being devaluing itself for years, gieaway tickets for internationals just the tip of the iceberg. Just look at the ridiculous zero money SL main sponsor contract with Stobart's.
We've not had a headline sponsor in years and the money is pathetic.

The season passes are still cheap IMO and I'd pay more than I do currently for a seat though the reduction due to being a member offsets its cost a little.
People defrauding the club by whatever the amount is still fraud and despicable and trying to pass it off as the same as watching youtube footage of a sky game from years back is ridiculous.
I for one have never downloaded illegally uploaded music or films or bought hooky dvds.
That the film and music industry had to change because of the ridiculous prices being charged hence why a lot of people bought knock offs shows it was overpriced.
Tickets into Hull FC or any rugby league event for that matter are not and thus to rob money from your own local club that isn't some multi billion pound organisation that can absorb it so easily makes ticket fraud much worse.

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