It doesn't read to me like he's underestimating the teams we play, more like he's pointing out that the teams at the top will be taking points off eachother, giving us the opportunity to make some ground if we have a good month.

we hope!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

On paper they are all win-able. Depends which FC side turn up. (and on Saturday which Quins side turns up too)

Richard Agar will still be our coach in 2012, there is no doubt about that. If anyone has any doubts just ring James Rule and he will put your mind (in turmoil) at rest.

Thats 2 years worth of season passes i wont need to buy then.

Coaching aside, we don't have the 4th best squad in the competition. Why would we be in the top 4?

what do you reckon then? 5th? 6th?

agar's bullet proof. The last 2 years are the worst 2 years we've ever had in SL, we've lost this season already to the only 2 teams who finished below us last year and have copped 2 hammerings from leeds and 1 from wigan.

I honestly don't think the board care that much about results. They see commercial success as something apart from what is happening on the field and are focusing on that. It's obvious to me that the fans will only put up with rubbish for so long but the club owners obviously feel different.

It's the down side to scrapping P&R

I reckon 7th/8th myself, although I'm a confirmed pessimist. And that assumes that our current injury crisis doesn't drag on like the last couple of years. And TBH that wouldn't be that bad a result from 12th spot last year.

Is that pessimism or just realism? I reckon you're about right with 7th/8th. We aren't quite strong enough (but we're half decent) right across the park.

We have spent the max cap so we should be as strong as anyone and if McGuire had joined us then we would be top 3 NOW ! Agar is the weak link NOT the players. However if we win the next 3 then I will run with him as a fan.
IF we lose 2 of the next 3 then he has to go BUT he won't

Nonsense. We've had years of crap recruitment and retention which has led to us paying over the odds for average players. We went some way towards addressing it in the off season but still have work to do.

Agar is not the only problem.

We are miles away from being able to seriously challenge for silverware and not just because of the third rate coaching set-up currently in place.

Out of our current squad (and based chiefly on form this season), only three players would unquestionably be capable of holding down a place in a Grand Final winning team, those players being Fitzgibbon, O'Meley & Manu. I would think that every Coach and supporters of the other thirteen SL clubs would welcome any of those three as worthy additions to a side aiming to be the best.
I would also possibly add Whiting to that list as well, particularly if a coach was able to fully utilise his undoubted Rugby brain, although there is a question mark over whether he could claim a starting spot in a side sitting atop the table.

Added to that are three other players (Long, Berrigan, Horne) who obviously have played, successfully, at the very pinnacle of the game. However, all three have experienced major problems with fitness/injury in the last twelve months and there has to be a question mark against all three being able to consistently reach the heights previously graced. Fully fit and injury free, yes they can, but therein lies the crux of the problem with those three players.

We also have a batch of promising young players (Briscoe, Briscoe, Lynne, Houghton, Hall?) who with the correct coaching and development may reach the top of the game, but who at the moment are clearly still some way short of Grade A status.

That leaves us with the bulk of our first team squad, (Tansey, Calderwood, Yeaman, Dowes, Radford, Tickle, Washbrook, Cusack, Lauaki, Moa, etc, etc) and I'm afraid to say they are nothing more than mid-table trundlers. Not necessarily bad players, but not exactly outstanding either, and no team made up with the bulk of those players is ever going to be doing a lap of honour around Old Trafford in October (this year or any year).

If we were able to build a team from scratch (hypothetically speaking) to win a Grand Final then I reckon only those three players listed above (Fitzgibbon, O'Meley, Manu) would definately be assured of their place in that squad. For the rest, there has to be serious question marks against their continued presence (too old, too injury prone, unproven, or just simply not good enough) within a side challenging for honours.

And, of course, all of this is before we address the major problem of our coach, the single biggest handicap within the club. But win lose or draw in the next three games, we're stuck with him, at least until the end of next season at the very earliest in my opinion, so I think some of us are going to have to lower our sights a little, because I'm afraid under the current coaching & playing set-up, the only way any of us will be attending Wembley & Old Trafford is as neutrals.