FORUMS > Hull FC > Disciplinary again i'm afraid |
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7078_1361913407.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_7078.jpg |
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| Zak Hardaker banned for 5 games and fined £300.
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17123_1311448581.jpg If you only knew the POWER of the dark side.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_17123.jpg |
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| Quote: ComeOnYouUll "Zak Hardaker banned for 5 games and fined £300.'" Yet the ref on the field heard it and did nothing.
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7384_1394882426.png [url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-league/14252202:io879g1y]2005 Challenge Cup[/url:io879g1y]
To reconcile respect with practicality, what is the optimum speed for a hearse?:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_7384.png |
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| Quote: ComeOnYouUll "Zak Hardaker banned for 5 games and fined £300.'"
I think the £300 is a bit of a joke, but 5 games is fair enough
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28490_1361478234.jpg JOHNNY WHITELEY - A TRUE RUGBY LEAGUE LEGEND:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_28490.jpg |
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| Quote: Chris28 "I think the £300 is a bit of a joke, but 5 games is fair enough'"
He could have spent that money on soap to wash his mouth out.
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All men are created equal, some work harder in preseason.
-[i:1c45x4hd]Emmitt Smith[/i:1c45x4hd]: |
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| Quote: ComeOnYouUll "Zak Hardaker banned for 5 games and fined £300.'"
so we can take that as the standard for this sort of thing being 8 weeks and £500?
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25916_1384945916.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_25916.jpg |
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| Quote: SirStan "How does Peacock get found guilty of a grade B offence yet avoids a suspension?
Oh wait, Leeds own the rfl, silly me.'"
I can't believe that. People are walking away from our game in their droves and one of the reasons is because of the bias shown by our governing body.
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67329_1392756525.jpg Well you may throw your rock and hide your hand
Workin' in the dark against your fellow man
But as sure as God made black and white
What's down in the dark will be brought to the light:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_67329.jpg |
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| McDermott defends Hardaker
Last Updated: 16:23 11/06/14
Leeds Rhinos coach Brian McDermott has defended Zak Hardaker after he was handed a five-match ban for "using verbal abuse based on sexual preference".
Hardaker admitted making the remarks during his side's Super League defeat at Warrington 12 days ago but denied they were aimed at referee James Child and claimed he was unaware of their connotations.
The Rugby Football League's independent disciplinary tribunal accepted that Hardaker is not homophobic but were satisfied that the remarks were made to the match official.
McDermott said: "From the outset, our club has always had a stance against any form of discrimination.
"We actually had a week designated to the Lesbian, Gay and Trans-gender organisation and Zak Hardaker and Kallum Watkins were the cover boys on that.
"Zak fully accepts the punishment that's been handed out to him. From the outset, he's shown remorse and realised the error of his ways.
"But he's really upset that he's getting accused of being homophobic. He's been found guilty of using offensive language and causing offence. To inaccurately tar a young man with that is irresponsible.
"It's a tough week for Zak and it will continue to be a tough week. He's getting hammered from everybody for two words that he shouted out.
"It's a shame that the whole game has been brought into question. But one of the positives is whole game's response.
"We haven't tried to sweep it under the carpet, we've been very transparent with how we've dealt with it. What is hasproved is that there is absolutely no homophobia in our sport."
Hardaker will be sidelined until mid-July but is expected to attend the England training camp in Loughborough this weekend.
Frustration
Meanwhile, McDermott has hit out at the RFL's failure to punish Leigh forward Matt Sarsfield for instigating a fight with Leeds' former England captain Jamie Peacock during last Friday's Challenge Cup quarter-final.
While the match-review panel decided the sin-binning was sufficient punishment for Sarsfield, Peacock was ordered to face a disciplinary hearing and only avoided a suspension because of the provocation and his previous exemplaryrecord.
"There is a sense of frustration of why he was even called up," he said. "Our game has never really made a distinction between the thug and a braveheart.
"It almost seems to be making too strong a point on the people who retaliate and not enough about the people who are the actual instigators.
"Leigh had a strategy to win the game. They felt they couldn't deal with JP's open and honest game where he just runs as hard as he can and keeps as fit as he can so that he can last longer than anybody else.
"Leigh concede they can't do that so what they do is wait until he is on the floor and cheap-shot him and head-butt and try to get him to retaliate and get sent off.
"While ever those thugs aren't being made accountable, you will always give those thugs the motivation to do it.
"It's unbelievably frustrating. It was a head-scratching moment when they said the Leigh player wasn't acting against the spirit of the game."
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32641_1503834456.jpg The poor man's bonaire:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_32641.jpg |
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| Is james child gay?
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47557_1332937611.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_47557.jpg |
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| Quote: Jake the Peg "Is james child gay?'"
I don't think it matters does it? What he said was wrong whether it be to a heterosexual or homosexual.
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32641_1503834456.jpg The poor man's bonaire:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_32641.jpg |
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| Quote: LifeLongHKRFan "I don't think it matters does it? What he said was wrong whether it be to a heterosexual or homosexual.'"
I agree it was wrong either way but more severe if he is actually gay.
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fonds noir/Sulley.gif :fonds noir/Sulley.gif |
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| What's funny is Leeds complaining about being stitched up by the RFL.
They should spend a week in our shoes where Mickey gets a 2 match ban for tackling somebody and our players (rightly) pick up bans for punching unlike Teflon Peacock and Teflon Sinfield.
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46343_1394123827.jpg 'Its like the jungle out there, only the strong survive and the weak get killed off and that's whats happened in Hull. They'll run to the end of the season then that's it, they'll be gone, there will be no more Hull Kingston Rovers there's no room for them.'
Tim Wilby, 1997. Screw you Tim.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_46343.jpg |
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| So Brian Mac thinks Sarsfield should be banned for daring to provoke sir JP. If they banned everyone who used that level of provacation then teams wouldn't have 17 to put on the pitch. Ironic that the supposed 'brave heart' rose to it and started swinging. What a drama queen
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17123_1311448581.jpg If you only knew the POWER of the dark side.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_17123.jpg |
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| Quote: shauney "What's funny is Leeds complaining about being stitched up by the RFL.
They should spend a week in our shoes where Mickey gets a 2 match ban for tackling somebody and our players (rightly) pick up bans for punching unlike Teflon Peacock and Teflon Sinfield.'" They haven't a clue mate.
You if you wished you could make a huge list where a lesser club's player had taken a kicking over a disciplinary when a big club's player had walked away with nothing for the same thing.
Mick Weyman is the perfect point. He was banned originally with no proof to back the ref up yet Peacock walked away free as a bird and in fact wasn't even asked to explain himself.
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45758_1583677597.jpg born in airlie str,1939.german landmine that fell on boulevard,also blew up half of our house.thats why i dont like germans.not because they blew our house and boulevard up,but because the gerry pillock was aiming for craven park.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_45758.jpg |
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| Quote: Jake the Peg "Is james child gay?'" no,just happy
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67329_1392756525.jpg Well you may throw your rock and hide your hand
Workin' in the dark against your fellow man
But as sure as God made black and white
What's down in the dark will be brought to the light:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_67329.jpg |
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Neil hudgel statement after his appeal failed
www.hullkr.co.uk/club/news/artic ... ry-process
The chairman’s thoughts on disciplinary process
An interesting week again with the disciplinary machine and a good time to take stock, reflect on the season to date and to look at what changes might be considered to make the whole process increasingly "fit for purpose".
I lost my appeal on Monday, unsurprisingly, against a fine for speaking out against both the match review panel and disciplinary panel. I dislike the "catch all" operational rule D1.8 (c) which is basically an affront to being able to speak your mind.
Because I said the system was bust and not fit for purpose, I was deemed guilty of "conduct prejudicial to the game". This is despite the RFL producing zero evidence of prejudice be it concern from sponsors, commercial partners, other clubs or fans. The only complaints were from within and from sitting members. Is it right for the RFL to use that provision to protect the narrow self-interests of its own rather than in the genuine wider interests of the game? I think not.
I won't repeat what I said that brought me before the panel, but I won't withdraw my comments either. As a stakeholder in the game who has invested significant time and resource, I am entitled to hold a view and express it accordingly.
The current fiasco with the obstruction rule in part has its origins in the above approach. Rules overly protect match officials from scrutiny and accountability. Strictly speaking, the operational rules prevent any public comment (even positive!) on the standard of refereeing. Why is that right? Coaches and players are forced to face the music even after a car crash of a performance. Teams can miss out on a play-off spot, or cup progression, on the back of bad decisions. Why aren't officials (and their boss) more publicly accountable for their performance?
In the absence of that scrutiny, performances won’t consistently improve. Coaches therefore mistrust referees in exercising judgment, hence rules which take out that element of discretion. It ruins the spectacle and forces people away from the game.
On to Tuesday and our surprising success with Mick Weyman and turning over his two-match ban. I say surprising not because I felt the case was lacking In merit, but because of my recent (ish) experiences before the panel. Our experience this time I believe further validated those beliefs. I left the room feeling like we had been allowed to present our case properly, video footage was reviewed thoroughly (which helped vindicate the player) and the right questions were asked.
I have read a fair bit about the Jamie Peacock case and I don't think that's an inconsistent outcome. Jamie has played 500 games with no previous citations, an incredible record. There was it seems considerable provocation before the reaction. The rules allow the panel to step outside the guideline punishment in those circumstances. It can draw no comparison with the likes of say Justin Carney, who has several previous similar offences to his name, or indeed our own Justin Poore.
I think the Zak Hardaker case provides an illustration of inconsistency. Why didn't the match review panel refer him the same week as Mick Weyman with both being cases of dissent? The factual matrix was pretty simple even if the gravity of charge was more significant. The delay enabled him to play in a close cup tie, in which he scored a try. Had he been banned under normal processes he wouldn't have played. Might that have affected the outcome? Who knows.
We have had some glaring inconsistencies this year, as have other clubs. What can be more prejudicial to the interests of the game than a club who has a player or players suspended when another has players free to play despite being guilty of the same sort of action?
The easy part of all this is to complain and moan so here's my recommendations for change. Not all of these are novel, several are lifted from the NRL.
1/ Super League TV to screen all disciplinary hearings (would it help people understand why JP was given no suspension if they saw the panel at work?)
2/ Match review panel to be headed by a recently retired coach (to improve technical competence)
3/ Disciplinary panel to be able to take into account similar incidents (to ensure some consistency and uniformity)
4/ Legally qualified chairman of panel to remain but function limited to guidance on process and penalty with three side members being ex-professionals to determine guilt or otherwise. This would mean the recruitment of an additional side member.
5/ Membership of either panel be for a maximum of 3 years so that talent is regularly refreshed.
Clearly things need to change, and there is an obvious momentum building now for that to happen. Supporters are increasing becoming disillusioned with the game because of a perceived feeling of injustice and voting with their feet. We need to take steps to turn the tide and not put the telescope to our blind eye and think everything in the garden is rosy. Fingers crossed a new rule D1.8(c) charge doesn't hit my doormat next week!
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Neil hudgel statement after his appeal failed
www.hullkr.co.uk/club/news/artic ... ry-process
The chairman’s thoughts on disciplinary process
An interesting week again with the disciplinary machine and a good time to take stock, reflect on the season to date and to look at what changes might be considered to make the whole process increasingly "fit for purpose".
I lost my appeal on Monday, unsurprisingly, against a fine for speaking out against both the match review panel and disciplinary panel. I dislike the "catch all" operational rule D1.8 (c) which is basically an affront to being able to speak your mind.
Because I said the system was bust and not fit for purpose, I was deemed guilty of "conduct prejudicial to the game". This is despite the RFL producing zero evidence of prejudice be it concern from sponsors, commercial partners, other clubs or fans. The only complaints were from within and from sitting members. Is it right for the RFL to use that provision to protect the narrow self-interests of its own rather than in the genuine wider interests of the game? I think not.
I won't repeat what I said that brought me before the panel, but I won't withdraw my comments either. As a stakeholder in the game who has invested significant time and resource, I am entitled to hold a view and express it accordingly.
The current fiasco with the obstruction rule in part has its origins in the above approach. Rules overly protect match officials from scrutiny and accountability. Strictly speaking, the operational rules prevent any public comment (even positive!) on the standard of refereeing. Why is that right? Coaches and players are forced to face the music even after a car crash of a performance. Teams can miss out on a play-off spot, or cup progression, on the back of bad decisions. Why aren't officials (and their boss) more publicly accountable for their performance?
In the absence of that scrutiny, performances won’t consistently improve. Coaches therefore mistrust referees in exercising judgment, hence rules which take out that element of discretion. It ruins the spectacle and forces people away from the game.
On to Tuesday and our surprising success with Mick Weyman and turning over his two-match ban. I say surprising not because I felt the case was lacking In merit, but because of my recent (ish) experiences before the panel. Our experience this time I believe further validated those beliefs. I left the room feeling like we had been allowed to present our case properly, video footage was reviewed thoroughly (which helped vindicate the player) and the right questions were asked.
I have read a fair bit about the Jamie Peacock case and I don't think that's an inconsistent outcome. Jamie has played 500 games with no previous citations, an incredible record. There was it seems considerable provocation before the reaction. The rules allow the panel to step outside the guideline punishment in those circumstances. It can draw no comparison with the likes of say Justin Carney, who has several previous similar offences to his name, or indeed our own Justin Poore.
I think the Zak Hardaker case provides an illustration of inconsistency. Why didn't the match review panel refer him the same week as Mick Weyman with both being cases of dissent? The factual matrix was pretty simple even if the gravity of charge was more significant. The delay enabled him to play in a close cup tie, in which he scored a try. Had he been banned under normal processes he wouldn't have played. Might that have affected the outcome? Who knows.
We have had some glaring inconsistencies this year, as have other clubs. What can be more prejudicial to the interests of the game than a club who has a player or players suspended when another has players free to play despite being guilty of the same sort of action?
The easy part of all this is to complain and moan so here's my recommendations for change. Not all of these are novel, several are lifted from the NRL.
1/ Super League TV to screen all disciplinary hearings (would it help people understand why JP was given no suspension if they saw the panel at work?)
2/ Match review panel to be headed by a recently retired coach (to improve technical competence)
3/ Disciplinary panel to be able to take into account similar incidents (to ensure some consistency and uniformity)
4/ Legally qualified chairman of panel to remain but function limited to guidance on process and penalty with three side members being ex-professionals to determine guilt or otherwise. This would mean the recruitment of an additional side member.
5/ Membership of either panel be for a maximum of 3 years so that talent is regularly refreshed.
Clearly things need to change, and there is an obvious momentum building now for that to happen. Supporters are increasing becoming disillusioned with the game because of a perceived feeling of injustice and voting with their feet. We need to take steps to turn the tide and not put the telescope to our blind eye and think everything in the garden is rosy. Fingers crossed a new rule D1.8(c) charge doesn't hit my doormat next week!
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