I agree with knowles playing well in a good team but sutton will get a call above westerman hes playing out of his skin at minute for raiders despite team being in disarray and wane knows him well from pie days so as much as i like how westerman being playing cant see wane picking him above other contenders

Elliot being top draw for his whole raiders run
6 years in the back row I might add is the nrl

His attack and fence are both excellent
He’s the exact sort of back row that due to his handling skills can unlock the opposition defence

He’s an automatic decision for me

The question about Sutton at 13 depends on other players.
If you have enough pivots in the team you can go with a prop type 13.
If you have runners then you need someone like Farrell, O'Loughlin and Westerman.

As much as I like Westerman and has been terrific in getting our team on the front foot I’m afraid his international boat sailed some time ago . Watching the NRL on a weekly basis we will firstly need a miracle to bring the cup home ,and to have any chance at all ,we will need a team that can match the oppositions intensity for the full 80 and for me as good a ball handler that Westerman is I think his fitness/age will negate him from a starting spot . No doubt he would give his all if given the chance and wouldn’t let anyone down I’m sure ,but it’s going to get brutal trying to get a win in the later stages of the cup and I just think Wayne will go for youth over old heads .

That's so wrong and should have nothing to do with it. His age is irrelevant (youth at that level is an utter myth) and his current fitness by his own admission is the best it's ever been. You can discount him on ability, your choice but to use that as an excuse, no way.

International players should be picked on form not reputation so for that reason alone Westerman should be in the squad.
In any event, most of the player’s mentioned previously have failed to overcome the Aussies in previous encounters, so perhaps something or someone different would be worth a shot?

No, you give over, what's his knee got to do with it, what the Aussies target the knee now do they?

Shaun will agree with you, yeah right you know that

So no second chances in your book.

Form is form, you seem to operate under the pre-conceived mode.

SOO not yet, but SOO is not the same as Internationals. Personally on home soil, we will give them a real run for their money. I've heard the 'light years ahead' stuff for years but when playing in blighty it's not actually been the case since the 1990s. We've fallen at the final hurdle on a few occasions.

It's a confidence thing as much as anything else. We need to stop trying to be like them and be like ourselves. Westy is his own man.

Kettkat, I see what you are saying but I agree with Vasty here.

If you were a club looking at signing a player then you would definitely look at there age and injury record as it would matter, but for a one off competition that is the pinnacle of international rugby league nothing else matters other than making sure you have the best player on the pitch you possibly can, age doesn`t even come into it for me or anything else other than maybe looking at players that suit each others styles of play.

He’s a stand out player in a club that until recently couldn’t but a try but now he’s England material, I have absolutely nothing against Westerman he’s going great guns for us ,but when I put my england cap on I’m sorry I look elsewhere.
Never looked through rose tinted glasses and never will and call a spade a spade ,cracking club player not a England player now i’m afraid , but thats just my opinion and you have yours ,and that my learned friends is what this forum is all about, opinions .

I will make a couple of claims on this, I will revisit this thread if I am correct and claim my victory, If I am not I will hope that nobody drags it up, if they do I might even come on and delete the post

1. Westerman will be in the world cup squad, he might not play but he will be in the squad.
2. England will win the World Cup

I "claimed" on 6th April that as things stood it was 100% not true, look back at the first page of the thread, which at the time Joe had not even spoke with anyone with regards to a move away from the club. If you want specifics, things changed as of last Wednesday.

Hope that clears things up