FORUMS > Wakefield Trinity > O/T Thatcher |
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| Quote: vastman "I'd pretty much agree. Logic also dictates that popular and efficient governments don't lose power so it's fair to say they both botch it up eventually. However Labour tend to take the moral high ground thus so much more is expected but apart from Attlee none have come close to delivering.
This cult of Thatcher haters sickens me. However harsh and occasionally quack her remedies she didn't create the sickness Britain suffered in the 1960's and 70's - but folk casually forget that.'"
Spot on.
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| Ask anyone from a mining comunity what they think of HER and I should think you will get a stock answer. She caused more misery in those comunities than any other PM in history. She would have got more support had she sugested that we put children down the mines again. I am not stupin enough to think that the last labour government were anything but useless but the only good thing that tory boy and his a---- licking side kick Clegg have done is sort out the benifit system to make it profitable to go out to work and not sit at home poncing of the rest of us.
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| Scargill didn't do them many favours either sadly, if he was less intent on irking Thatcher and making himself a name, a lot of people (him not being one of them of course!!) and communities would have suffered less.
But lets stay off the politics and stick to the rugby, history teaches us that the working man will always suffer at the hands of ANY politician.
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| Quote: wildcatowl "And anyone who has a quote from "HER" at the bottom of their box does not deserve a reply.'"
Great shout! Along with the great username
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Feb 2011 | 14 years | |
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| Anybody can say what they want about Thatcher but I think anybody who lived through the 80's and experienced the collapse of community self belief and respect at the hands of the her government, especially in this area might have a very dim view of her time in power
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| I am from a mining family, I would rather have her than the shower we have had since, I think the country would be in a stronger position if she where still top dog.
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| Quote: kinleycat "Scargill didn't do them many favours either sadly, if he was less intent on irking Thatcher and making himself a name, a lot of people (him not being one of them of course!!) and communities would have suffered less.
But lets stay off the politics and stick to the rugby, history teaches us that the working man will always suffer at the hands of ANY politician.'"
Correct, Scargill and his gang of thugs were self serving idiot who gave Thatcher a relatively easy victory. It cost us all not just miners because despite what most miners thought they were not the only workers getting stuffed. We now have almost powerless Unions which in turn has allowed this massive gulf in earnings between workers and company bosses. It makes me weep to see what trade unions gained for workers after the war thrown away by these little Napoleon's by playing right into Tory hands.
Agree though best stay clear of politics.
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| Quote: Lawefield44 "Anybody can say what they want about Thatcher but I think anybody who lived through the 80's and experienced the collapse of community self belief and respect at the hands of the her government, especially in this area might have a very dim view of her time in power'"
Unquestionably true, my point was that Scargill in particular and the unions generally, didn't help their members either.
Sadly the union mentality of a good shouter is better than a good thinker proves itself time and time again, crowds of baying people on both sides are unlikely to work anything out for the good of anyone.
I'm not hugely political, they're all bent as far as i can see, nobody works for the working public anymore, and thats why the country is down the pan.
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| Quote: Stanley Cat "Ask anyone from a mining comunity what they think of HER and I should think you will get a stock answer. She caused more misery in those comunities than any other PM in history. She would have got more support had she sugested that we put children down the mines again. I am not stupin enough to think that the last labour government were anything but useless but the only good thing that tory boy and his a---- licking side kick Clegg have done is sort out the benifit system to make it profitable to go out to work and not sit at home poncing of the rest of us.
Really, ask them publicly where the old NUM brigade can hear them and thus intimidate then your right. Ask privately and free from cohersion and the answer is often very different.
The NUM were bully boys just like Thatcher but she was clever. The NUM lost all moral credibility because it tried to bully other members from other areas. Yet this is continually swept under the carpet by those with an agenda.
It is far to simplistic to blame Thatcher alone for the demise of coal, cynical and calculating as she was. There are many culprits including ever more demanding, grasping and over politicised miners.
Just a final point. If as a group of workers you make it your mission for nearly 20 years to destroy any Tory Government why would you expect them to show mercy. Scargill never negotiated, he was a gangster who thought he could hold a nation to ransom. If ever there was a lesson that confrontation rarely works this was it.
I know we are now way off topic so I'll try to shut up now
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| Javelin
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| Quote: vastman "Really, ask them publicly where the old NUM brigade can hear them and thus intimidate then your right. Ask privately and free from cohersion and the answer is often very different.
The NUM were bully boys just like Thatcher but she was clever. The NUM lost all moral credibility because it tried to bully other members from other areas. Yet this is continually swept under the carpet by those with an agenda.
It is far to simplistic to blame Thatcher alone for the demise of coal, cynical and calculating as she was. There are many culprits including ever more demanding, grasping and over politicised miners.
Just a final point. If as a group of workers you make it your mission for nearly 20 years to destroy any Tory Government why would you expect them to show mercy. Scargill never negotiated, he was a gangster who thought he could hold a nation to ransom. If ever there was a lesson that confrontation rarely works this was it.
I know we are now way off topic so I'll try to shut up now
Sorry to carry this on the off topic route but its an interesting subject and I want to add to it. I'd say Scargill is as much to blame for the demise of the coal industry as Thatcher. She wanted to defeat the Unions, not necessarily kill the coal industry. The country had been held to ransom in previous years with strike and she wanted to stop that. The coal industry were one of the most powerful but also led by someone who, with hindsight was not as good a leader (and in some ways political general) as Thatcher was.
She prepared well and took the fight to them
He called a strike without a ballot, in winter!
Poor campaign lost at the first hurdle.
The problem is the losers were the thousands of innocent miners that were hurt in the cross fire (both physically and financially)
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| Has anyone seen the latest manufacturing output figures ?
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| For all the people are critical of her and the damage she did, or the fact that she was there too long.....
....someone kept voting her in.
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| Jeez I got a bit giddy reading the title.
Looks like my party’s on hold.
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| Are we forgetting her use of the police force as a state army, the use of military personnel dressed in police uniform to swell ranks, the police state like measures to stop groups of young men travelling freely from city to city, the over aggressive confrontation seeking tactics employed, the manipulation of press and media to create a false picture of the miners strike, the secret deal to hoard coal bought from abroad at huge cost, the tiny kids that died after being buried under slag heaps while they dug for coal to keep warm at home, the suicides that followed the destruction of many family men's lives, the escalated drug culture that filled the pit villages and Towns that were destroyed by Thatcher, the dismantling of the UKs manufacturing industry from which we've never recovered, the poll tax, poll tax riots, the imprisonment of the elderly, single parents and any normally law abiding individual who tried to stand against the poll tax etc etc etc.........
Sorry but I'm not having a Maggie Thatcher love in from anyone, the woman was a political genius, a world leader to be proud of and feared in equal measure but EVIL, discompassionate and ruthless to her core.
For any good she did, she did twice as much bad!
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