Fans ask for pride/passion and effort from players wearing our shirt, we've had this for the past god knows how long from this guy yet some find excuses for not turning out at BV sunday and saying good bye.

You want it, you get it, and then you find a reason to turn a blind eye.

That is fair to say about JD, but unless I am missing the point. People pay to go to matches to see two teams competing, not to watch one man with pride and passion carry 16 others in game against 17 other players.

Nobody as I can see has said that JD has not shown pride or effort. What people are saying is that they are not prepared to part with hard earned cash to watch that shower week in week out. Look at it how you want but that is not turning a blind eye it is living in the reality of the team haven't given the effort we should expect from Professional sportsmen. We have been a playing like a beaten side for months.

To put it in simple terms (as an example) if signed up to a dvd rental package and then after a few months the company sent you copies made from somebody with camcorder in a cinema instead, would you carry on paying for it? No you wouldn't, the same principle applies if people are not getting value for money from a team then people are unlikely to pay out for sentiment.

The simple fact is that at the beginning of the season we were promised McDonalds and finished with a broken down burger van.

Before anyone starts with nobody could have forseen what was going to happen (we started the season with two hookers and a third coming through from the Academy, that negates the need for Newton. It was said on this forum last winter that Brough was going to leave, couldn't we have cashed in then and found a replacement. As for Tronc the club went for a big name when we got rid of a more than capable player in Stosic) or Kear saved us speech (maybe if he had been captain of the Titanic maybe it wouldn't have sunk)

Am I alone in thinking there looked to be more than 5,500 there yesterday. I thought 6k plus?

I thought there were more, but guesstimated 5.5k based on previous announcements.

Yes, true enough.

The worrying thing was that 5,500 is a crowd we could have expected against Quins last year. This year it was against a side who brought a lot with them.

Worrying to us but not as worrying to the club it seems.

It shows this 20 quid is definitely not working plus what did we do to try and entice people to the last home game of the season (bearing in mind our horror run of form)
Howard Webb being there was hardly going to pack them in was he?

Call him? Certainly not! It's a short career, and, personally, I'd take the chance to prove myself at a bigger club, on a bigger wage with a chance of winning trophies, than being loyal. And when we talk of 'loyalty' what exactly is that worth when the club, correctly in my opinion, haven't offered him another contract.

Do Poching and Ellis regret the Grand Final winners rings they have? Does Westwood regret playing at Wembley? Will Atkins in a fortnight? If you were a player, would you rather battle against relegation - no trophy for finishing second bottom, no glory - or challenge for honours?

Players 'talk the talk' all the time. 'It's a great club, great tradition' and all that rubbish. If you believe anything they say, more fool you.



No, I am not a player, but I've worked in the real world, and when you're offered a job in the same industry, but with a bigger company for better cash, you more than likely take that offer! Say you work somewhere for 8 years, have little chance of progression, but a job appears at another company for better money, you'd be a fool not to take it.

Whether I think Demetriou is a 'great' is not the issue. I appreciate the job he has done. All I ask of players, whether they are here for 2 games or 20 years, is to give their all every time they go on the pitch. Nothing more, nothing less.

'Legend' - no. No player in this era is a legend, not until they lead the club to the glory that the true legends of this club did in the past.

If message boards were around in 1930, I wonder what they'd have made of Jonty Parkin.

So you're you saying jason is a fool here? I'd hardly describe him as that



the entire point of my post is that JD to trinity is the biggest legend we've had in the SL era,
Its all releative, players like fox took us to glory many years ago at the highest level, trins greatest SL season was our top 6 run where we were narrowly beat by wigan, JD lead the club that year

Or are we saying untill we are a top side such as leeds or wigan our players can not have players that can be referred to as legends,

I fear if that is the case we may be waiting a very long time



I'm sure they would have spoke about him in the same manner as many of us will and do talk about JD

Mopsey would have said he was crap.
Multey would have tried some smartd comment becuase he had nothing relevent to say.
Jonh would have said he was not as good as that lad from Wigan.
NGB4C would have done is Hull KR/Peter Fox routine.
TRB would have said he was a prince amongst men, but Ted couldnt offer the money
Rotherham Fev Fan would have said Kyle Briggs was better.
Vastman would have said Dale Ferguson was better, or that he was never any good once he had left.
BigAl would wait for one of the other mods to post opinion before he knew what his own opinion was.
Sunbed Kid would have said he saw him in Superbowl Carpark the other night so was due to re-sign for us.

Perhaps, but 5.5K is about average for this fixture, take the previous three seasons;

2009 - 5,169 - SKY
2008 - 5,436
2007 - 6,119 - SKY

Total - 16,724

Ave 5,575

Although I must say, I agree JD is a legend at the club for many reasons, and I am glad he stayed such a long time, I also agree that loyalty is over rated by the fans.
From a player point of view you have to pay your mortgage.

In additon, being loyal to the club is actually nothing to do with the fans. If a player is treated well by the club, both financially and otherwise, then loyalty could be expected in return. But JD is a good example of someone who has not been treated well by his coach at Widnes and sometimes by our directors too. So I don't think it is a matter of being loyal, I think he likes playing for Wakefield and with the group of players and coaches he has at this club.

People are loyal when they feel they have something in return. Some don't feel they get that at Wakefield.

Ellis is a good example though because he didn't go when the clubs came calling first time round. He played out his contract and put his all in for the club until he went. Don't think it is fair to put him in the disloyal group.
Westwood went when he was young and was carving out his career. Don't see anything wrong with that. Atkins had given us our monies worth too. It's not like he ripped us off.
It's just a job to most players. they may enjoy their job and enjoy being with one employer more than just for the money, but it's still a job.