Fair enough u got me thinking there i thought they where a bit more advanced in the stadia plans.But you have both promised and yet nothing i suppos its a toss up just like its a toss up who gets in either us widnes or toulouse.I say go to 16 Give another 2 years for stadia.Do u think its widnes ot toulouse thats coming up ?

I can tell you categorically that crowds have gone down. We have lost 800 fans from our average figures of last year. Why?? Because the games down in the championship are nothing to what they were previously. Most of the emotion has gone from games. Try a few matches were the away support bring nothing more than a handful see how much atmosphere can be generated.
This competition is a lame duck I'm afraid.
However Fax have played a blinder... they have announced a huge crowd for their final game by handing out tickets free at a county show and then counted these as attending whether the recipient turned up or not.
The figures have been skewed and Fax have now given the RFL ammunition to claim that the game is thriving in the lower leagues.

Without wanting to appear nasty here, because that is not my intention, do you not think that they are right to remove you. The basis of your SL berth last time around was on the proviso that you moved into a new ground. You have until April to prove that you will have a ground ready for action by February 2012.


It won't be the death of the club but it may become as you have mentioned it above. This is now what life outside SL is like.



Unfortunately for you, you will not find out if your licence application is any better than ours or Fax's because the two applications are no longer in direct competition against each other. The Championship club going up have different criteria aimed at proving the 'potential' of the club. They may not have the speccies now but given a solid base, a decent financial standing etc etc there is nothing to suggest that this won't come. It will take a couple of seasons to become competetive but it is no longer about what happens on the pitch. It is about what the club can offer to SL.


but by the same token all you need then is one or two bad performing years and you are back to where you started. That is why the RFL want clubs with good structures in place and are less interested in you reaching the playoffs etc.



It's a little fatalist to feel like that. The future of the club is still firmly in it's own hands. If your board have been truthful then you will not be removed. If you have been less than truthful about the real position at your club then one waiting in the wings deserves it's chance surely. Just for the record I am a P&R fan and I firmly believe that Barrow should now be in SL and Salford should be slumming it down here with us.

Without wanting to state the obvious it will all come down to both clubs proving in April 2011 that they have enough work happening and quickly enough so that the Wildcats and / or the Tigers are running out at their new grounds in 2012. I don't think it matters too much where you both are now.

Also without myself trying to be nasty, on what basis should we have to make way for you in SL. The only thing going for you that we cannot compete with at the moment is your council owned stadium, hopefully that problem will be resolved in the near future, not if but when it does happen which of the criteria demanded by the RFL will your club take a lead over ours, if it was not for the likes of Saints and Wire you probably could not field a team let alone win anything.

At the moment there is nothing to say that you will make way or that we will be the ones to replace you! If you get your ground then I don't see there being a problem and your board seem confident that you will so it's all gravy.
My question was that if you don't get your ground by 2012 then surely you can't have any complaints.
Not sure what you mean about Saints or Wire either???
For your record.. in the last round of franchising we were given a B score by both Sky and League Express in their evaluations. In the end our administration was the factor that kept us out. That won't be a problem this time around with SOC backing us.

Widnes Will make it in even through they haven't played as good this season because of the stadium, you will end up buying some of the players from the team going down

They only have a right to remove us if our franchise bid is the worst of the lot, speaking of which with this new criteria which has been formulated by the rfl how do they know that a championship side will have a better application some 4 month before the SL clubs submit theirs' by saying that a championship side will replace a SL side in 2012. And yes if we dont have posh toilets by then I suppose we will deserve to miss out. Just as a matter of interest who from Sky gave you a b score your Turry and auntie Angela, tbh I would take more notice of the new musical express than the league express as it goes, best of luck anyway I am sure you wont need it.

The problem with some of the above, that a club coming up should only replace the worst team in SL if we directly beat them, is it is absolutely impossible for a team in the championship to drum up the support and the squad needed to beat any super league team. Thats why it needs to be based on potential. There is a tiny salary cap in this division, meaning the biggest clubs cannot financially dominate, so league position under licensing is an unfair way of doing things. There are virtually no away fans for most of the games and we're in a competition with largely no greater meaning. Stagnation is becoming a way of life in this sport.

Upon what basis should Wakefield, or Castleford, or Huddersfield, be allowed to stay in super league indefinitely and with no threat to their position? Why should any club be given that right and why should other teams have to stay in the second tier which becomes weaker by the season? NFL style promotion would only protect people who don't necessarily deserve it and make others suffer whose only mistake was not being in the top league at this point in history.

It is absolutely vital that there is a path to the top for teams in the championship. I think given them a chance there are a number of teams who could give it a go as good or better than a number of super leaguers and why on earth deny them? I would take P & R back tomorrow even though my club is primed for a franchise but not primed for winning the league. The longer this system is in place, the weaker teams down here become and the more likely they will never be ready for super league. We are heading towards a system of feeder teams and I suspect people know that all very well but then they wont be bothered about the health of clubs outside their little sphere.

More money, higher attendances, more youth players going through into first team (for the club), higher average finish

Sorry i must have missed the attendance bit that i quoted