I'm not really interested in speculation which is normally poor - my point wasn't meant as an excuse for groundless gossip which this is whether you believe it or not.

If the money and the state of the club is right he will stop with us - nothing is nailed on. So over to Mr Glover.

We knocked Cas out in 2002 at BV. I think thats our only win against SL opposition which is shocking really!!

He is represented by an agent who is the brother of Phil Clarke. According to quite a few the guy is one of the worst there is to deal with and it was suspected sometime ago that he was not staying with us. He will be no great loss IMHO.

However I agree with your main post and I think the generation we want to be building on is Walshaw,Wildie and Trout.

As I say not really interested in the Johnson speculation and as you know nothing is nailed on see Gareth Ellis. TBH Johnson was the first name that came into my head - who is here in 3 years time doesn't matter just so long as there are some and so long as they are good enough.

At the moment the team has no back bone at all and though I'm not an Agar fan that is not his fault.

Even considering our inability to keep real stars like Brough, Ellis and Solomona we could if our previous board had not failed have had the likes of Snitch, Moore, Ferguson, George and Murphy to name a few still at the club. Maybe BJ would be playing his heart out now in his testimonial season. Not world beaters I accept but at least something resembling an organically grown team rather than one bought off e-bay. Very sad, very sad indeed - it really is no way to run a club and it's been like that for 40+ years.

Didn't we also beat Widnes and London in the early SL days? All pre-Kear though.

Also Widnes at their place - Ian Knott era and London at theirs - 2004 I think.

Slim pickings though after all these years.

Vastman has it about spot on - no heroes in this story and no mental strength shown. We made a better fist of it at Bradford in the quarter final before we got into SL!

Yes we did. Both away as well.

The things vasty has said in this thread are probably the most intelligent insights in this whole debate so far.

Thanks to 40 years of mismanagement, we don't have a team, any continuity or anyone on board with any sense of the 'story' of WTW; what we do have is a revolving door of transient players and staff who have no emotional attachment to the club or in many cases, the city - yet.

Mr Glover has spoken before about his ten year plan - I think that's an optimistic outlook of the task ahead; to get this club back to anything like it's glory days will take a minimum of ten years and will require blood, sweat, tears and no small amount of luck to achieve. It's do-able, but it needs the right people and the application of significant amounts of expertise, patience and shedloads of cash.

In ten years, if we're sat at NM talking about players like Trout, Walshaw and Slater as fantastic servants to the club and maybe contemplating Kyle Wood's testimonial, then it will begin to look like a success.

Well said vasty - you've summed up perfectly the issues currently facing WTW, without resorting to childish proclamations of doom and gloom, or the usual, knee-jerk 'coach out' tirade. Good man.

It's a point I've been trying to get across for a while now. Off field problems are relatively easy to solve with a bit of cash and some nouse. On field is more like alchemy than science.

It doesn't matter how good or bad you think Agar or the team are or whether they could be doing better. What matters is that we shouldn't be here at all and the blame for that lays partly with previous Coaches, players, even fans but for the most part the various boards who have failed the club.

Now we inhabit some weird kind of RL hinterland where we are neither a new club or an old one but a hybrid of the two. I don't think the RFL or the Press or pundits or other fans give us an especially hard time - I think they are ignorant of us as a club because unlike most clubs we have no continuity on the pitch where it matter. Brian Carney is fairly dim but all the same you can't really blame him for not knowing anything about our team, hell it took us half a season ourselves to work out who was who in last seasons team and it's not much better this.

One players keeps coming to mind as the players who sums it all up. Steve Snitch. Came through our Academy the hard way, couldn't gey a decent offer from the club due to too many Aussies - went away, did well - came back - did well but still couldn't get a long term deal. Yet we will fly the likes of Steve Southern half way around the world and he isn't the first or the worst.

Snitchy is no world beater, isn't even a top SL player - but - he wanted to play for us so long as we offered him a similar deal to what other clubs did - we didn't - we simply couldn't be bothered with an English player and a ranker to boot.

So after 15 years in SL we can't even field a workhorse like Steve Snitch - instead Cas have him. He should be a one club player, loyal and dependable even if not the worlds best. The fact that we don't have him (and he left pre administration) is frankly pathetic.


I don't think it matters that much who the coach is, no one and I reckon no one wouldn't struggle at our club for a few years to come. Whoever was in charge would need time which is in short supply in RL - in which case even the best would be sacked before they had chance to do anything if the mentality of those who post on here is anything to go by. Mr Glover big task is not N/M or season ticket sales that kids stuff compared to keeping his nerve where the Coach is concerned. If he doesn't the ludicrous suggestion of Poching for Coach could become some dreadful reality - and that's no dig at Poching who may well one day be a Coach, just not yet and just not learning on our time.

Top couple of posts Vasty.

Almost spot on - except that players like Snitch were offered deals to stay and yet chose to move on as we hadn't the stability or quality of the other clubs available.

Also, as Nobby showed at Crusaders and we have under previous coaches, it is possible to coach the players to perform in a more 'workmanlike' manner - i.e. to get more out of them physically. Now the question is: do we think that given time and patience that this squad of players will eventually be better skilled and better able to compete with other SL clubs - because that appears to be the six million dollar quastion that the senior officials are betting on - otherwise, if we're judging it today on what we've seen, there would only be one outcome!

totally agree for once with vasty's posts..well said sir!