Unquestionably true, my point was that Scargill in particular and the unions generally, didn't help their members either.
Sadly the union mentality of a good shouter is better than a good thinker proves itself time and time again, crowds of baying people on both sides are unlikely to work anything out for the good of anyone.
I'm not hugely political, they're all bent as far as i can see, nobody works for the working public anymore, and thats why the country is down the pan.

Javelin

Has anyone seen the latest manufacturing output figures ?

For all the people are critical of her and the damage she did, or the fact that she was there too long.....

....someone kept voting her in.

Jeez I got a bit giddy reading the title.

Looks like my party’s on hold.

Are we forgetting her use of the police force as a state army, the use of military personnel dressed in police uniform to swell ranks, the police state like measures to stop groups of young men travelling freely from city to city, the over aggressive confrontation seeking tactics employed, the manipulation of press and media to create a false picture of the miners strike, the secret deal to hoard coal bought from abroad at huge cost, the tiny kids that died after being buried under slag heaps while they dug for coal to keep warm at home, the suicides that followed the destruction of many family men's lives, the escalated drug culture that filled the pit villages and Towns that were destroyed by Thatcher, the dismantling of the UKs manufacturing industry from which we've never recovered, the poll tax, poll tax riots, the imprisonment of the elderly, single parents and any normally law abiding individual who tried to stand against the poll tax etc etc etc.........

Sorry but I'm not having a Maggie Thatcher love in from anyone, the woman was a political genius, a world leader to be proud of and feared in equal measure but EVIL, discompassionate and ruthless to her core.

For any good she did, she did twice as much bad!

You didnt even mention letting people work for £2.50 or less an hour and not giving a t***, the unions may have had too much power in the 70's but boy did she make sure that employers had all the power in the world during the 80's!!! whatever Scargill's faults no way what he did was as bad as Thatcher!!!!!

Scargills not blameless but to suggest he's as much to blame is way off the mark, Thatcher was going to do what she did irrespective of Scargill who was a bit part player and no more significant in that Thatcher centric world than Ian McGregor was.

Thatcher had her campaign planned for months if not years before Scargill even got started along the lines of opposing her as vehemently as he did. Her secret stockpiling of chep coal bought from the continent and hidden from the view of everyone is testimony to her intentions. Some might say she was clever, I won't argue that, but many many miners got into the strike not knowing what they were getting into because they did so believing the coal supplies were less than they were. As a result homes were lost, debts were acrued,families destroyed and communities broken on the back of Thatchers pre planned and ruthlessly efficient campeign to break the miners unions. They were collateral damage, cannon fodder and good old Maggie didn't give a toss.

Beyond the miners strike there were many other Thatcher policies that were so hard line that they actualy cost lives!

You forgot to mention the thuggish, bullying tactics employed by striking miners against their own kind and the attempts to cripple the country to meet their own ends - which differed depending on where you stood in the ranks.

Thatcher may have been cold and dispassionate towards the miners, but the miners leaders were cold and dispassionate about our great nation!

Neither side won anything and neither will either side ever win this argument!

All politicions make bad decisions and in that she is no different to the Blair decision to send us to war in Afghanistan and iraq, that doesn't in my book make either of them evil.
To simplify the point made, if Scargill wasn't as bad as Maggie the miners strike would have ended far sooner, equally friendships could have remained and communities divided.
Both made bad calls, the ordinary man suffered as is always the case.
Tbh as interesting as this debate is, I think it serves little purpose but to divide, so maybe it should end?

you lot should of lived the 12 months on strike and then suffer the years after trying to catch up with debts that was put on hold.

my local community stood firm and held beliefs that was passed on down by their fore fathers that have died to give most of you your rights for what you now take for granted nowadays.

while trends change in economic times due to 'cost', gas was proven to be cheaper than coal same as the British rail wasn't deemed to be required so lets slimline it down all at cost to the working mans living.

the years that has gone by I have noticed a greed in the private sector and a couldn't careless attitude sod you jack I'm alright from workmates and the attitude of employers now trying to devalue skilled mans job

given the chance to go back and work with my pals back at the pit who I could trust with my life I would,
thugs we was not we just wanted the right to work on a decent wage.

continue with your debate