They may not attract the away support because of the distance to travel, but I've been there in early February and the monsoon game.

But the point still stands that Wakefield, Cas, Salford, Bradford etc benefit far more from the visits of Leeds, Wigan, Saints HKR and Hull than Catalan do.

I'd get rid of Salford before Cas/Wakey/Catalan/Crusaders because they offer nothing to the competition, nothing in terms of expansion and have one of the worst stadium in the league (2nd to Caravan Park imo). By the next round of franchises, because Crusaders will probably be given a free pass again Salford will be gone so that will probably leave us with 1 spot between Cas, Wakey and I think Bradford will be edging nearer & nearer to losing a spot with falling crowds, crap stadium and worsening results on the pitch.

I have no problem with Catalan. They have a good home support in a rugby league heartland; you only have to look at a map of the area around Perpignan to see villages that have rugby league pedigree, like Pia and St Esteve. There was a French side in Super League when it started, and so it is hardly novel. And would the season be less interesting without them? Yes, it would, because a lot of fans would miss out on an enjoyable rugby weekend in a nice part of the world.

Quins and Crusaders are trickier, because the benefits they supposedly bring are not as visible on the terraces. I am told that the presence of Quins has benefited grass roots rugby league in the south. If Crusaders do the same in Wales, it can't be a bad thing.

Would I personally prefer more heartland teams involved? Yes, but not if it makes the game shrink. When I have stayed overnight at major events, for example, I have heard many Geordie accents, and so maybe the word is spreading.

Why don't you just get rid of the game the drivel you are spouting.
On second thoughts just get rid of yourself would be easier and the game would be better for it as well.

Agreed to a point as far as Leeds, Cas the two Hull clubs and possibly Wigan but the rest no, Wire, Saints and Bulls support have been very dissapointing this year, the rest Cats, Quins, CC, Salford and Hudds never bring any support to speak of, some will blame the recession some will blame the poor facilities at the club which are no worse than 4 or 5 other clubs, but the point is that in answer to your post I bet that if you add all the away support to a clubs attendances, for the season I am willing to bet you that Catalans get more away support than any other club which was my original point when you wre praising their support, one other point I might be wrong but isnt their's the lowest entrance fee in SL if it isnt then its very close to it.

Away support is not always relevant, teams should be taught to rely on their home crowds to bring in gameday money, not a big weekend visit from Wigan or Leeds. Im far more interested in what kind of facilities a team has and how many home fans they are bringing through the gate.

The worry about expansion teams only seems to arise when certain clubs know that they may be unable to compete with them, either in the present or eventually. Over a century to sort out Belle Vue and build up a fan base and all that and still not much to show for it... A very old club can't excuse its own mediocrity by comparing itself to a club thats all of four years old.

(takes out matches, lights the touch paper, and stands back, smiling).

Don't anyone bite!

Salford fan?

I offered something to the discussion then you come on and single me out for nothing at all - come on what do Salford offer to Super League at all? Or was it the Crusaders free pass comment? that wasn't a dig at the Crusaders at all, it was just what seems likely the RFL will do "for the good of the game" - the young Welsh players v England looked to have some talent so either they need an extra 3 years in SL at the next round of franchises or they needed a few more years out of SL before they were let in to get ready.

Came on to see what was happening with you guys and came across this thread.

Regarding the Cru, we don't bring MANY travelling fans to away games because ALL away games are a min 8 hour round trip. We don't have many home fans for all sorts of ridiculous historical reasons and an inept marketing department.

As regards the playing base and support clubs, well we're coming on in leaps and bounds there. School competition has expanded from 8 teams to 65 teams. Wales European (apart form England and France of course) Champions and a load of young Welsh talent retained by Noble and promoted to the first team.

I imagine the RFL will try and shepherd us through the next round of franchises, because for all the crowds are a bit small still, we really ARE expanding the game and if we can get a bit of success this year, I expect our average crowds to double. Still not huge, but 100 odd years of Union dominance takes a while to overcome.

For what it's worth, we like Wakey down here and hope you get over this little financial hump.

The same point remains - the number of away fans you take is irrelevant, the number you attract at home is far, far more important. If your business relies on Leeds bringing thousands, the you need to take another look at it...

Yes I did seem to pick you out there,sorry about that but I'd just been reading Jack Dee's Biography and he slagged everything off so I must have caught a bit of it!!

in my opinion catalans are great. Great crowds / great team they have really developed and are the prime why french rugby league has improved 100% . Celtic are struggling. For me only changes I would make is salford out and bring Halifax and Widnes in. Extend the competition give the welsh a bit of time.

Yeah, er ... CRUSADERS (they dropped Celtic from our name) are not struggling in any way. We were, but we're not now.

And Trinity, if that was directed at us, it doesn't, we don't and even when we were struggling last year, we never targetted you. Shame you can't return the favour. Hard to pontificate when you don't hold the moral high ground.

Good luck Wakefield, you've had a lot to deal with of late and I hoe you can rise above. But to CERTAIN posters, don't try to drag US down cos we bite back.

Not at all - my post was defending the likes of yourselves, Catalans and Quins. The key, for Wakefield and everyone else, is to attract supporters week in, week out, not rely on a big crowd when Leeds or Hull turn up.

A strong presence in Wales/London/France etc. leads to benefits for the sport as a whole, just some don't want to see that as, in the short term, it may hurt their own clubs who need to get their houses in order to progress!

Ooooo sorry don't I feel like a lady's front bottom?

Sorry Trinity what can I say? I'm a chippy celt who got it wrong. Apologies for being snotty.

Again though, good luck with this latest hurdle. You guys do seem to be bound together by adversity.