I thought not.

In that case, cut out the personal attacks - it got very boring sometime last year and I certainly have no interest in going back there.

I actually like our back line this year. Ellis n Chase in the halves, with Webster, Shenton, Carney and Dixon.... But yeah, Owen at fullback is my concern. I'd personally put Dixon or Jordan Thompson there for the high ball, but Owen's steadlily improving positionally, which is pleasing.

Like we've said though, there aren't that many quality full backs to pick from.

However there was a comment on here earlier which was garbage, saying coaches sacrifice defensive qualities in full backs for offensive qualities. ....we'll never beat the aussies saying things like that

Disagree as it's my post you are referring.

If you look at most NRL Fullbacks their attacking abilities clearly outweigh their defensive abilities. Even the likes of Barba and Slater are miles better in attack than defense. It's the defensive structure throughout the teams where we usually lose out to the Aussie and probably because they are more clinical under pressure.

Again another old fashioned view of things. Superleague is not the game played in the 40's/50's/60's/70's/80's and probably not even the way we played in the nineties. It and other sports have evolved so much that most teams/players are having to change certain parts of their games. Think some people have to accept things for what they are and move on.

Yes I'm with Supercat on this. Defense now means taking a high ball not tackling.
Gaining yards on a kick return is much more valuable than being able to make super tackles.
Handy to have some idea but not no.1 skill for FB any more.

i don't see why it needs to be sacrificed though? humans aren't computers with o many gig of memory, where once it's full they can't possibly practice anything else without deleting something...

catching a high ball is a skill I admit but not one that requires specialist training - Mathers has played super league for about a decade, he should be able to tackle.

In fact I'll rephrase that, ANYONE who plays super league should be able to tackle. They didn't get scouted at amateur level by dropping off them

You are missing the point Dave, they can all tackle to a very high degree. However, the attacking role of the full-back has developed significantly over the last few years and the position now utilises a different kind of player and as others have said, taking the high ball, plus kick returns together with coming into the attacking line are regarded as more important than making a certain percentage of one on one takles when a player breaks the line.
We all like to see a FB crunch an opposition player when they break through but, it seems to happen less frequently these days.

yeahhhhh I take you're point. Can't argue on that really (not that I was arguing as such)
although the question of "do you rate mathers?" I seemed to have flaked on a little.....

The answer to this is yes I do.

Great in the line, good under a high ball, positionally superb
BUT
whinges a lot, tackling isn't great, and it's just interestingly concerning that top coaches seem to have shifted him on fairly quickly over the last few years.

to me his + outweight his -

but if I was right, he'd have settled at Warrington and not come to Cas. And even Cas were quick to get shut.

funny carry on

What do you think Milwards problem was with RM, he never gave him a chance ?
It's not as though he'd screwed up in the first 10 games and tbf, the other guy hasn't exactly been a world beater.

Maybe you shouldn't have got shut

Cas aren't the first team to ship Mathers on.

he never gave him a chance correct... maybe it was decided that behind the scenes he wasn't worth one? I don't know any ins and outs as to what conversations took place - could have been related to training, who knows???

I'd have a fiver on cause it's due to how much he whines though. But that's as far as my guess would go. Based on nothing other than, I just said it lol

Well, I totally disagree about the attacking full back being some new fangled thing.
You could not get full backs any more attacking then Derek Edwards at Cas, the GB international Gerry Round at Trin, Wraith at Trin/Cas and Gary Cooper the ultimate attacking full back at Trinity.
He too had his critics defensively . but as an international centre , before settling at full back he could read when to join in the threequarters and cause havoc with his pace , swerve, sidestep and brilliantly timed passes.
Oh yes, also England international Les Sheard was a great attacking full back for us.
There are many more such as Paul Charlton GB international , and the great John Holmes GB /Leeds who could throw out long cut out passes matching those of King Wally.

As an outsider, it was a truly bizzare decision, to isolate one of the senior players in the squad, before a ball had been played seemed crazy and it certainly didn't galvanize the rest of the team, in fact it seemed as though there was unrest in the camp all season and you would have to agree that Cas were poor last season.
Obviously there were off field incidents and of course the sad loss of IM's son which was horrendous, so maybe thins will improve this season.
But, we still have Mighty Mathers and you have Santas helper

oh absolutely, I can't say I agreed with the decision - it baffled me as much as anyone. All I'm saying is whatever issues he left Leeds, Warrington and Cas for, he will probably take with him to Wakefield. Just cause we don't know what it is or see it happening doesn't mean it doesn't exist. There were underlying issues for his departure and if he was coming to my team, it'd concern me a little.

And yeah I agree, we have no excuses to not have a better year. If you look at our ins/outs we are far stronger - and obviously the death of our coach's son 6/7 games in didn't do us any favours. Not that we can single that out as a sole reason for poor results.

I also would say that Mathers is a better full back than Owen - you're spot on. But as for 'mighty mathers'........I'd maybe keep that one to yourself for now lol

When RM was at Cas Tigers the training regime included an early start (I think it was a 6am start finishing at 2pm). I don't know if they are still doing this. RM didn't like the idea of this so IM isolated him from the rest of the squad. I could understand RM not liking it due to having a newborn at the time which you would always put first.

If he did accept the changes though his handicap would have improved dramatically because after clocking off at 2 some of the players got a round of golf in.

Deary me, what a sensitive flower you are - be damned if I could see a personal attack but hey ho.