Frustrating that years of successive governments / NHS managers have failed to fix this issue and now joe public have to take the blame and stay at home.

Quote MatthewTrin="MatthewTrin"Frustrating that years of successive governments / NHS managers have failed to fix this issue and now joe public have to take the blame and stay at home.'" https://www.health.org.uk/sites/default ... INAL_0.pdf Funny because it actually forecast back in 2015 how many nurses we would be short, in particular critical care trained nurses. Let’s put it simple would you get yourself in debt in the region over over 30k to start on 23k working nights, weekends, on understaffed underfunded wards when the slightest error in judgement or calculation would cost somebody their life???

Quote MatthewTrin="MatthewTrin"Frustrating that years of successive governments / NHS managers have failed to fix this issue and now joe public have to take the blame and stay at home.'" https://www.health.org.uk/sites/default ... INAL_0.pdf Funny because it actually forecast back in 2015 how many nurses we would be short, in particular critical care trained nurses. Let’s put it simple would you get yourself in debt in the region over over 30k to start on 23k working nights, weekends, on understaffed underfunded wards when the slightest error in judgement or calculation would cost somebody their life???

That's down to the RCN who in the early 90's wouldn't say boo to a goose and others wanting to make nursing more "academic" based.
Hence the fees.
Prior to that nursing was salaried as a student.

That’s before my time BG, I’m only a young whipper snapper


It’s not good though

The reason I ended up on here was in response to the first post by Trin, Trin and of course the thread title.
Here is that first post, see hi lites.

=#BF0000Well we're back to more silly times to come, it's just been announced by UK government for England & from monday, all social gatherings in homes, outdoors, events etc, etc will not be allowed above 6 people.
That puts paid to fans watching RL, live etc. Heavy fines will follow by way of enforcement !
However, we will witness selfish people still breaking rules & of course the nutters that don't want to believe about Coved19.
=#BF0000How can anyone think it's a conspiracy theory when all countries in the world are affected & are actively trying to beat this virus ?
Onwards & upwards to all of us, stay safe my friends, signed Trin, Trin.

I had noticed virtually no questioning of what, who or why re covid in the whole of the threads and posts back then so, as I believe every government action should be questioned, I answered the main question:

How can anyone think it's a conspiracy theory when all countries in the world are affected & are actively trying to beat this virus"

Rather than accept being called a "nutter" I thought I had an answer to that so that's what I posted along with the reason why I believe we should never have been locked out of Belle Vue. That refered to the "what now for fans watching." part of the thread title.

Then the challenges to me poured in so I try to answer each one then some posters supported me and the rest is history.
I did notice the thread was getting lots of views, far more than any other thread, so I saw no harm in expanding the subject a little.
Now, to be fair to me I have tried to get the thread back on track at least as far as the "what now for fans watching/" even Pop Tart will back me up on that, but to no avail, very few want to go there unlike the threads on Newmarket.

I do not use facebook or twitter but I do comment on various youtube pages. Trouble with that is I'm just "talking" to the converted.

I tell you this though, If wrencat, Pop Tart you etc. would stop challenging me this thread wouldn't have got past page 15 or thereabouts. Bad lads, the lot of you.



It is NOT a crusade or anything like it is my opinion and god forbid we should all think as one. There are millions who believe as I do and I'm simply expressing those views. As I asked wrencat, why does he believe Agenda 201 to be an exersise only? That's his belief, one I do not share.

Can I ask you something. Do you ever, just for a second, doubt the official version of events? More and more people are begining to have doubts I find . They havn't gone as far down the rabbit hole as I have but to them, things just don't add up.

I just don't understand why you are so bothered about all this. You believe the powers that be have one agenda, and that is to keep you safe until a vaccine comes along. All the power is in your hands, why bother about little ole me? So what if one or two take my view it's hardly going to have much impact in the grand scheme of things.

I have never, ever stated that no one has passed away. I disputed the figures and the bogus death cerificates and I was proved right on that but I have never said no one has died.
The remarks I made were simply personal experience in answer to someone who virtually accused me of infecting people. I believe I proved not one person I have been in contact with has come down with covid. Should that change I will hold my hands up and come on here and informe you all.

Tis a pity you cannot acknowledge suicides and cancer though. As for the cost financially, (after ten years of austerity after we bailed out the banks leading to deaths, NHS shortages, closure of libraries, bus service cuts etc associated with that fiasco) I fear the cost, both in health and financial, for future generations will completely dwarf anything we have experienced with the bailout. The cost of "Covid."will dwarf all of that. As with the vaccine, it had better be completley safe because if not that will cost the tax payer millions in compensation payouts.

Though Gates is expecting at the very least 700,000 worldwide to be injured by the vaccine.

Sorry to hear that. I just can't imagine having that experience. Everyones worst nightmare I should think.

Quote REDWHITEANDBLUE="REDWHITEANDBLUE"Right OK you are still beating the drum and not answering any debate put to you. Let me explain to you you keep quoting 0.3% of the population is only really affected by Covid so in effect we should dismiss it and run with it. Well that equates to about 220,000 deaths in the UK from Covid based on 66million people a bit of work for the NHS there mate. Now you keep bleating on about this American petition signed by 600,000 people as if its massive well lets put it into your percentage profiles, the population of the US is in excess of 300,000,000 which works out that the petition is around 0.3%, on the one hand you totally dismiss this figure as irrelevant and then on another you are ramming it down peoples necks as if nothing else counts. Now then you bang on about Gates and his Event 201 Well what about this one then that occurred almost a year before the one you mention is a world conspiracy this one by the World Health Organisation was held in 2018. https://www.who.int/ihr/eoc-exercise/en/'" I have adressed this issue, you appear to have missed it. Pg 57 viewtopic.php?f=33&t=630163&start=560 One point I did make. I think we can assume the majority of people in the US have never heared of Bill Gates, why would they? Those that buy a computer couldn't care less who made the operating system let alone the guy who runs the company. So that brings the 300,000,000 way, way down. Then you have to factor in those that have been informed of the many allagations against Bill Gates. Again not many knowing how the US MSM works.Again, that brings the figures way, way down again. I repeat, to save you looking. Lets imagine you, yes you, visit the US and decide to buy a used car from Texas Petes amazing car sales. You do a quick check online to verify Texas Pete and find 600 comments rubbishing the guy and his garage, Do you: a) Buy a car anyway or b) Do a quick calculation of what percent 600 is of the population of the USA. Decide it's a very, very tiny figure and buy a car from Texas Pete anyway. Does this not demonstrate how ridiculous your argument is? I thought you of all people would know how to interpret statistics. I think you get the drift. Anyhoo, 600,0000 is a lot of people in anyones book. In fact, the White House feel "only" 100,000 is required for a investigation let alone 600,000. Good enough for me. Do not worry though. These Billionairs never get brought to book do they. As for the one in 2018, so what? Practice makes perfect. Maybe they just missed the boat that year. You still cannot give me proof it was not planned. And if I cannot give you definative proof it was planned then you can hardly take the morel high ground over me / us? So why not just, at the very least, have an open mind? At the very least, I have .

Quote REDWHITEANDBLUE="REDWHITEANDBLUE"Right OK you are still beating the drum and not answering any debate put to you. Let me explain to you you keep quoting 0.3% of the population is only really affected by Covid so in effect we should dismiss it and run with it. Well that equates to about 220,000 deaths in the UK from Covid based on 66million people a bit of work for the NHS there mate. Now you keep bleating on about this American petition signed by 600,000 people as if its massive well lets put it into your percentage profiles, the population of the US is in excess of 300,000,000 which works out that the petition is around 0.3%, on the one hand you totally dismiss this figure as irrelevant and then on another you are ramming it down peoples necks as if nothing else counts. Now then you bang on about Gates and his Event 201 Well what about this one then that occurred almost a year before the one you mention is a world conspiracy this one by the World Health Organisation was held in 2018. https://www.who.int/ihr/eoc-exercise/en/'" I have adressed this issue, you appear to have missed it. Pg 57 viewtopic.php?f=33&t=630163&start=560 One point I did make. I think we can assume the majority of people in the US have never heared of Bill Gates, why would they? Those that buy a computer couldn't care less who made the operating system let alone the guy who runs the company. So that brings the 300,000,000 way, way down. Then you have to factor in those that have been informed of the many allagations against Bill Gates. Again not many knowing how the US MSM works.Again, that brings the figures way, way down again. I repeat, to save you looking. Lets imagine you, yes you, visit the US and decide to buy a used car from Texas Petes amazing car sales. You do a quick check online to verify Texas Pete and find 600 comments rubbishing the guy and his garage, Do you: a) Buy a car anyway or b) Do a quick calculation of what percent 600 is of the population of the USA. Decide it's a very, very tiny figure and buy a car from Texas Pete anyway. Does this not demonstrate how ridiculous your argument is? I thought you of all people would know how to interpret statistics. I think you get the drift. Anyhoo, 600,0000 is a lot of people in anyones book. In fact, the White House feel "only" 100,000 is required for a investigation let alone 600,000. Good enough for me. Do not worry though. These Billionairs never get brought to book do they. As for the one in 2018, so what? Practice makes perfect. Maybe they just missed the boat that year. You still cannot give me proof it was not planned. And if I cannot give you definative proof it was planned then you can hardly take the morel high ground over me / us? So why not just, at the very least, have an open mind? At the very least, I have .

Quote Miro="Miro"I have adressed this issue, you appear to have missed it. Pg 57 viewtopic.php?f=33&t=630163&start=560 [i [/i why would they? Those that buy a computer couldn't care less who made the operating system let alone the guy who runs the company. So that brings the 300,000,000 way, way down. Then you have to factor in those that have been informed of the many allagations against Bill Gates. Again not many knowing how the US MSM works.Again, that brings the figures way, way down again. I repeat, to save you looking. Lets imagine you, yes you, visit the US and decide to buy a used car from Texas Petes amazing car sales. You do a quick check online to verify Texas Pete and find 600 comments rubbishing the guy and his garage, Do you: a) Buy a car anyway or b) Do a quick calculation of what percent 600 is of the population of the USA. Decide it's a very, very tiny figure and buy a car from Texas Pete anyway. Does this not demonstrate how ridiculous your argument is? I thought you of all people would know how to interpret statistics. I think you get the drift. Anyhoo, 600,0000 is a lot of people in anyones book. In fact, the White House feel "only" 100,000 is required for a investigation let alone 600,000. Good enough for me. Do not worry though. These Billionairs never get brought to book do they. As for the one in 2018, so what? Practice makes perfect. Maybe they just missed the boat that year. You still cannot give me proof it was not planned. And if I cannot give you definative proof it was planned then you can hardly take the morel high ground over me / us? So why not just, at the very least, have an open mind? At the very least, I have .'" Seriously? you think that people in the US have never heard of Bill Gates? wow! https://today.yougov.com/topics/politic ... Bill_Gates only 96% then 96% of 329,516,498 = 316,335,838 600,000 / 316,335,838 = 0.19% Quote MiroIn fact, the White House feel "only" 100,000 is required for a investigation '" Do you have any support for this assertion? context? I answered your Texas Pete question before. To know how significant 600 complaints is you need to know how many customers he had. 600 out of 650 = 92% = he really is a cowboy, don't go there 600 out of 6 000 000 = 0.01% = seems like a decent enough guy, you can't please all of the people all of the time. Quote MiroYou still cannot give me proof it was not planned. '" Again, it is you who is making the claim, therefore the burden of proof is yours. I don't believe there have been any alien abductions, but some people do. There is no way anyone can prove the negative, that there has never been an alien abduction, but there is no credible evidence that there has. The burden of proof is with those who are making the claim.

Quote Miro="Miro"I have adressed this issue, you appear to have missed it. Pg 57 viewtopic.php?f=33&t=630163&start=560 [i [/i why would they? Those that buy a computer couldn't care less who made the operating system let alone the guy who runs the company. So that brings the 300,000,000 way, way down. Then you have to factor in those that have been informed of the many allagations against Bill Gates. Again not many knowing how the US MSM works.Again, that brings the figures way, way down again. I repeat, to save you looking. Lets imagine you, yes you, visit the US and decide to buy a used car from Texas Petes amazing car sales. You do a quick check online to verify Texas Pete and find 600 comments rubbishing the guy and his garage, Do you: a) Buy a car anyway or b) Do a quick calculation of what percent 600 is of the population of the USA. Decide it's a very, very tiny figure and buy a car from Texas Pete anyway. Does this not demonstrate how ridiculous your argument is? I thought you of all people would know how to interpret statistics. I think you get the drift. Anyhoo, 600,0000 is a lot of people in anyones book. In fact, the White House feel "only" 100,000 is required for a investigation let alone 600,000. Good enough for me. Do not worry though. These Billionairs never get brought to book do they. As for the one in 2018, so what? Practice makes perfect. Maybe they just missed the boat that year. You still cannot give me proof it was not planned. And if I cannot give you definative proof it was planned then you can hardly take the morel high ground over me / us? So why not just, at the very least, have an open mind? At the very least, I have .'" Seriously? you think that people in the US have never heard of Bill Gates? wow! https://today.yougov.com/topics/politic ... Bill_Gates only 96% then 96% of 329,516,498 = 316,335,838 600,000 / 316,335,838 = 0.19% Quote MiroIn fact, the White House feel "only" 100,000 is required for a investigation '" Do you have any support for this assertion? context? I answered your Texas Pete question before. To know how significant 600 complaints is you need to know how many customers he had. 600 out of 650 = 92% = he really is a cowboy, don't go there 600 out of 6 000 000 = 0.01% = seems like a decent enough guy, you can't please all of the people all of the time. Quote MiroYou still cannot give me proof it was not planned. '" Again, it is you who is making the claim, therefore the burden of proof is yours. I don't believe there have been any alien abductions, but some people do. There is no way anyone can prove the negative, that there has never been an alien abduction, but there is no credible evidence that there has. The burden of proof is with those who are making the claim.

Quote MatthewTrin="MatthewTrin"No that was made to friends and relatives back in April. Any detailed thoughts on my Sweden report - page 68?'" An interesting article here from the economist https://www.economist.com/leaders/2020/ ... d19leaders It highlights many cultural differences between Sweden and the UK. It's clear that their initial approach cost a lot of lives, but they learnt their lesson and put together test,track and isolated systems that are actually fit for purpose (unlike the UK). Well done to them for avoiding a second wave (so far)

Quote MatthewTrin="MatthewTrin"No that was made to friends and relatives back in April. Any detailed thoughts on my Sweden report - page 68?'" An interesting article here from the economist https://www.economist.com/leaders/2020/ ... d19leaders It highlights many cultural differences between Sweden and the UK. It's clear that their initial approach cost a lot of lives, but they learnt their lesson and put together test,track and isolated systems that are actually fit for purpose (unlike the UK). Well done to them for avoiding a second wave (so far)

Quote Miro="Miro"I suppose your refering to me, big head that I am Let me remind you. I know of no one who has died from covid. I know of no client who has died nor do they know someone who has died. ( I always ask) Not one of my relatives has died of covid, yer know, the ones I hug or kiss. No elderly neighbors, no shopkeepers, no shop assistants seving me who have been on the "front line" since the begining. Everyone I ask knows of no one who has died including those rejecting the wearing of masks. That's hell of a lot of people even just assuming they all know a minimum of ten people each. Never mind deaths, I don't even know of anyone who has even been in hospital let alone an IC unit. I have heard of rugby league players testing positive but apparently a couple of weeks later they are back playing the toughest sport on earth. I think you need to look elsewhere for someone to blame other than non mask wearers. Maybe it's those actually wearing the filthy germ bags over their mushes. You know, the ones who cconstantly touch the bloody things and then handle everything without washing their hands and then dispose of them goodness knows where. Or worse, just use the same face nappy over and over again that;s after breathing in their own exaust fumes over and over again. Yer know, just like nature intented, or not. Or, maybe it's because the powers that be have abolished herd immunity that your "covid" is not under control. Or maybe it's just an over reaction as 99.95% of us are reltivley ok thanks. Or a scam '" I'm pleased that you haven't been directly affected by this pandemic, but in reality it's not that uncommon. I only recently had the first person I know die of covid, he was 80 and not in great health, but probably still had a few years left in him. It depends on how many friends you have. The average number of friends in the UK is 40. https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/li ... e-of-mates So, if you have 40 friends and based on UK figures (covid deaths = 46,555, population = 66,435,600) You would only have a 2.7% chance of one of those friends dying. If you assume you are much more popular than that and perhaps include all your social media 'friends' increasing to 500 friends you would still only have a 1 in 4 chance of one of those dying. You would need over 1000 friends before it was more likely than not that 1 of those would have died. However, as it is predominantly older people (65+) who are dying, you would have to adjust for the age profile of your friends and acquaintances. In fact, this is still so swayed towards that age group, you would be probably safe in just counting the older people you know, say over 55. How many friends, relatives and acquaintances do you have over 55? More than 40? On RL players testing positive, this is clearly a safety first policy. They are being stood down and isolated, as are their close contacts. This is random testing and is subject to a high degree of false positives. (see Bayes' probability) Unfortunately, it is impossible to distinguish between false positive and asymptomatic cases. I guess they could do 2nd and 3rd tests, also followed by antibody tests, but even this would not prove they actually had the virus. Better safe than sorry.

Quote Miro="Miro"I suppose your refering to me, big head that I am Let me remind you. I know of no one who has died from covid. I know of no client who has died nor do they know someone who has died. ( I always ask) Not one of my relatives has died of covid, yer know, the ones I hug or kiss. No elderly neighbors, no shopkeepers, no shop assistants seving me who have been on the "front line" since the begining. Everyone I ask knows of no one who has died including those rejecting the wearing of masks. That's hell of a lot of people even just assuming they all know a minimum of ten people each. Never mind deaths, I don't even know of anyone who has even been in hospital let alone an IC unit. I have heard of rugby league players testing positive but apparently a couple of weeks later they are back playing the toughest sport on earth. I think you need to look elsewhere for someone to blame other than non mask wearers. Maybe it's those actually wearing the filthy germ bags over their mushes. You know, the ones who cconstantly touch the bloody things and then handle everything without washing their hands and then dispose of them goodness knows where. Or worse, just use the same face nappy over and over again that;s after breathing in their own exaust fumes over and over again. Yer know, just like nature intented, or not. Or, maybe it's because the powers that be have abolished herd immunity that your "covid" is not under control. Or maybe it's just an over reaction as 99.95% of us are reltivley ok thanks. Or a scam '" I'm pleased that you haven't been directly affected by this pandemic, but in reality it's not that uncommon. I only recently had the first person I know die of covid, he was 80 and not in great health, but probably still had a few years left in him. It depends on how many friends you have. The average number of friends in the UK is 40. https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/li ... e-of-mates So, if you have 40 friends and based on UK figures (covid deaths = 46,555, population = 66,435,600) You would only have a 2.7% chance of one of those friends dying. If you assume you are much more popular than that and perhaps include all your social media 'friends' increasing to 500 friends you would still only have a 1 in 4 chance of one of those dying. You would need over 1000 friends before it was more likely than not that 1 of those would have died. However, as it is predominantly older people (65+) who are dying, you would have to adjust for the age profile of your friends and acquaintances. In fact, this is still so swayed towards that age group, you would be probably safe in just counting the older people you know, say over 55. How many friends, relatives and acquaintances do you have over 55? More than 40? On RL players testing positive, this is clearly a safety first policy. They are being stood down and isolated, as are their close contacts. This is random testing and is subject to a high degree of false positives. (see Bayes' probability) Unfortunately, it is impossible to distinguish between false positive and asymptomatic cases. I guess they could do 2nd and 3rd tests, also followed by antibody tests, but even this would not prove they actually had the virus. Better safe than sorry.